However, if you ever talk to uber drivers or your waiters they will complain about how expensive California is. Or even people at parties who are in between jobs and thinking of moving to where they grew up. I guess in real life I just hear more people talk about the general cost of living argument than a than the specific anti-tech one.
I hear the opposite, people cannot afford where they grew up. Most people from the Bay Area aren’t working high paying tech jobs.
> I guess in real life I just hear more people talk about the general cost of living argument than a than the specific anti-tech one.
Anti-tech sentiment peaked in the early 2010s. Tech buses stopped being vandalized and the “die techie scum” thing mostly went away after 2015.
While we're comparing anecdotal evidence, I live in Los Angeles and count among my peers many who work in the Hollywood/Media industry. I can assure you the general sentiment among them toward Big Tech is overwhelmingly negative. I work in tech (albeit not a large company) and even I tend to agree.
Also to be quite honest software engineers aren't as smart or nerdy as they think they are in general. Very arrogant and egotistical, though, for sure.
And almost by definition, if you move to California from somewhere else then "home" would be lower cost of living. Only exceptions are if you grew up in NYC, Boston, DC or a few other cities.
Lots of California is cheaper than a lot more than just the few most expensive cities. California is not just the central cities of the Bag Area. Also, on a state level, HI has a higher cost of living than CA.
https://worldpopulationreview.com/state-rankings/most-expens...
Everyone knows that California is not just LA and SF. But also Florida isn't just Tampa/Miami and Arizona isn't just Phoenix.
The big cities in CA are more expensive than the big cities in other states. The rural areas in CA are more expensive than the rural areas in other states.
Pointing out that the rural areas in CA are cheaper than the cities in other states is not compelling.
And for the record, Hawaii is seeing net out-migration too. At least its excuse for low cost of living is the fact that its an island that has to ship everything in.
Indeed, my experience is that there are parts of CA that aren’t significantly more expensive than my Midwestern home state.
The cheapest parts of CA are probably going to be as expensive as right outside a Cleveland or Pittsburgh.
If we're just talking about random middle class (and below) people ability to retire in the same house they've lived in for decades, a few other states may be worse at the moment, e.g. NJ and CT and perhaps others raising property taxes fast. But the days of prop 13 protecting Californians from this same fate may not last forever.
Areas of Washington State like Arlington have seen this as well, it's crazy to see a dated 4 bed 3 bath house go for $800k when it is not within even supercommuting distance of any high paying employees.
Or cash out for a retirement where you aren’t living someplace subject to Prop 13 effect on the market, which is what a lot retirees leaving CA do.
I'm not necessarily in the camp that thinks California isn't worth the cost. Though some undesirable location in the desert may indeed not be worth the taxes.
Since it is a place that people can come to California from, it is a very effective defense against the claim almost by definition, if you move to California from somewhere else then "home" would be lower cost of living.
And pretty much all Hawaiian transplants.
A sampling of average overall salaries for professors:
- UC Berkeley (ie bay area): $214,300
- UCLA: $234,200
- UT San Antonio: $130,900
- UT Dallas: $169,500
So an average Berkeley professor makes more than half again as much as an average UT San Antonio professor. And 25% more than UT Dallas.
In the end I imagine the prof at UTD could easily have more cash at the end of the month than the prof at UC Berkeley.
UTSA is such a small school it really shouldn't even be compared to UC Berkeley or UCLA.
https://www.ucop.edu/loan-programs/loan-programs/frap/index....
It doesn't really say what percentage of professors get this assistance or how much that assistance is typical in the end.
Faculty housing rates at UCLA:
https://portal.housing.ucla.edu/faculty-housing/faculty-hous...
So pretty much >$2k and up to $5,427/mo for housing costs. And that's supposed to be somehow more affordable than the surrounding area? For a 2bdr apartment its >$500/mo more than my mortgage + insurance on a four bedroom home with a pool purchased recently. For the condos, that's a few grand a month more. Compared to $1,400/mo average rent immediately surrounding UTD. Rent can be found for <$850/mo in Richardson, only 42-70% of the cost. And that's without having a small commute and living in a cheaper part of DFW, as Richardson's real estate isn't exactly a cheap part of town.
That would have to be a pretty good-sized stipend to offset that cost. Also it speaks volumes that a professor making >$40k gross more needs to then also have a housing stipend to make the actual take home close to the person making >$40k less.
I remember taking a hard look at some job offers around SF, relocating from DFW. Crunching the numbers I would have needed well more than twice my current salary to have my savings rate be the same and I'd still be downsizing my housing a good bit.
A major issue in looking at the averages at the entire university level like this is that you might be comparing apples to oranges. There are typically three ranks among research professors: assistant, association, and full. These positions can additionally have chairs. The salaries differ considerably across these ranks. Then there are teaching positions which are usually non tenure track. They may also have the same assistant, associate, and full professor positions but their salaries are much lower than the research professors. AAUP appendix has combined all of them into one single category.
Finally, this survey masks the salary differences among different disciplines. In American universities, B-school professors typically earn way more than other disciplines such as pure sciences, psychology, and engineering.
When we do salary comparisons (we have to do it while negotiating a raise), we pick out colleges/schools that are similarly ranked as ours and then we take average salaries of professors at the same position. As I mentioned, the salaries are public so this is possible although quite tedious.