Comment by teddyh | Hacker News Reader

Comment by teddyh | Hacker News Reader

“Self-host” is such a weird word. Having your own stuff yourself should be the default, should it not? I mean, you don’t “self-drive” your car, nor “self-work” your job. The corresponding words instead exists for the opposites: You can have a chauffeur and you can outsource your job.

I think the problem is entirely caused by the US having absolutely abysmal private internet speeds and capacity. Since you can’t then have your own server at home, you are forced to have it elsewhere with sensible internet connections.

It’s as if, in an alternate reality, no private residences had parking space for cars; no garages, no street parking. Everyone would be forced to either use public transport, taxis and chauffeur services to get anywhere. Having a private vehicle would be an expensive hobby for the rich and/or enthusiasts, just like having a personal server is in our world.

— Me, 2019-10-13: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21235957#21240357

> I mean, you don’t “self-drive” your car, nor “self-work” your job.

You could just take these metaphors up a step and you get the opposite effect.

For example, building/fixing your own car or running your own business. Those are considered unusual compared to using a third party.

And you don't usually grow your own food, yet it's not seen as strange.

It would be seen as strange if you say you are a farmer but you don't have a farm that you grow food in, instead you just temporarily rent a farm from random places for short amounts of time.

Last year I was renting my farm from AppleFarms but they started charging high prices when I wanted to expand so I switched to AmazonForestServices. For migration I used the DockerShippingService from GiantGarageInc to transplant all the seeds and plants from my previous farm to the new farm. They have amazing support and their staff was very diligent in plucking all the plants carefully.

It’s non-obvious, but that’s actually very close to how farming works today, at least in the US. Farm-owners will lease their land for a season to grow a specific crop. The land needs to meet requirements for acreage, irrigation, etc., but someone else will “use” the farm.

I’m sure this happens on a continuum from “that’s a big field, can I use it?” to “here are seeds, I expect XYZ yield in N months”.

> "Having your own stuff yourself should be the default, should it not?"

I don't think it has anything to do with internet speeds. Self-hosting is simply too complicated, not just for non-technical users, but for many developers too.

Compare the simplicity of installing a desktop app. Click to start the installer. Click next, next...finish. Done.

Self-hosting in the cloud is ludicrously complicated in comparison. Docker, Sandstorm, Cloudron, your command line script - these are neither simple or easy. (A developer's definition of 'simple' and 'easy' bears no relation to the real definitions of these words).

It's also one of the reasons why SaaS, for better or worse, is eating the software B2B (Business-to-Business) and B2C (Business-to-Consumer) markets. In comparison, the self-hosting market for web apps is negligible.

> Self-hosting in the cloud

That’s a contradiction in terms. It’s like saying that you own your home when what you have is a timeshare. The cloud is a timeshare.

I think the main point is self managed vs buying the service? I think a more apt metaphor might be renting a car from a company who takes care of the car vs buying a car and managing all the maintenance myself.

Internet speeds may suck in some parts of the US, but don't get it twisted: companies host their DBs on the cloud to mitigate the risk of their own incompetence/for lean gains from a managed service (RDS has done wonders in this realm).

Chauffeur is the right model for most on-prem business IT, which is typically owned and physically held by the business, but driven by a contractor who comes to visit as needed.

Can you provide some more information about the claim that the US has abysmal internet speeds and capacity?

Edit: Grammar.

I said “abysmal private internet speeds and capacity”. Note the word “private” (which you omitted). By all accounts, the speed and capacity available to US residents in their homes is far inferior (both in price and speed/capacity) to what is available in many nations in the world. Sorry, I don’t have a reference, it’s just what I hear people say every time the topic comes up.

Not only it is on average slower in the US, but also usually more expensive: https://fairinternetreport.com/research/internet-speed-by-co... (first link I found doing a web search)

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