An In-Depth Look at What/How/Why Books Sell (2016) | Hacker News Reader

Why Books Sell (2016)

electricliterature.com

105 pointspepys50 comments

My novel doesn't. I don't know why. The few people who have read it really like it, so I believe it's not that it sucks. But I've tried ads, promo services who have mailing lists of readers per genre,... and very few people buy it. Something doesn't work.

Is it the cover? Is it the blurb? Is it the theme? Is it the price? https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00QPBYGFI Anyone knows anyone in publishing who could help me debug this?

(On the other hand, my not-novel Computer Graphics from Scratch seems to be doing well!)

Did any of the few people who read and liked it recommend it to somebody else. If no, why not.

"There is no shortage of wonderful writers. What we lack is a dependable mass of readers." - Kurt Vonnegut [1]

[1] https://www.google.com/books/edition/Conversations_with_Kurt...

Maybe because it's a nazi-themed thriller? Nazi fiction has always been about USA (good) vs Hitler (evil), but this millennium has shown how evil our own governments can be. Nowadays we commoners understand wars are not for fighting evil, but for gaining geopolitical and economical control. The theme doesn't inspire hope anymore.

Disclaimer: I'm just a dumb casual reader.

The cover and intro blurb look like airport fiction. Which ... is a reliably good seller, so if it's well written on top of that, I've got no clue why it's not selling.

To be fair, "action fiction" is exactly what I was aiming to write.

I wasn't trying to make a barbed comment, I just couldn't think of another label to put on it.

From the article:

> The first thing that writers need to understand is that book sales — like advances — are all over the place. This is true even for individual authors. It’s not unheard of for an author to get roughly similar critical acclaim for their first three novels, yet have them sell 10k, 100k, and 10k respectively. Publishing is full of luck, timing, and unpredictable trends.

This is, in my experience, entirely true[1]. If your novel is not selling a hundred thousand copies a year then it doesn't mean it's not a very good book. It just means that the 'word-of-mouth' chatter between readers (which is, in my personal view, by far the biggest driver of book sales) was concentrated around somebody else's novel at the time you were publishing and promoting your novel.

[1] I commented about my own lucky book adventure a couple of years back on HN https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20549429

Size-of-market may be a factor. All the money seems to be in romance/porn novels (if self publishing) and YA (with a traditional publisher).

I'll preface this by saying that I don't want to be mean and just give you honest feedback. I haven't read either of your books and just looked at the amazon page you linked, look at the cover and read the blurb for The Golden Seed, and looked at https://gabrielgambetta.com/computer-graphics-from-scratch/, looked at the cover, skimmed the table of contents and read the paragraph under the title. This is of course entirely personal feedback based on how I feel about both of your books.

For "The Golden Seed", both the cover and the blurb seem "too much", like the kind of book you encounter by the dozen in a bookstore. It's also a fiction book, which appeals less to me because I can either ask people in my family for recommendations (there are a few big readers) and then have something to talk about, or read well-known books (for example, I've read The Three-Body Problem recently, after hearing about it 4 or 5 times here and really liked it).

On the other hand, Computer Graphics from Scratch attracts me more: its cover is in the same style as "Automate the Boring Stuff with Python", of which I've heard great things about; the "from scratch" appeals to me because I like the idea of building things from scratch; the table of contents has an entire part on raytracing, and the book seems oriented at beginners, which I like because I previously tried and failed to build a raytracer following the raytracer in one weekend project, and I think I could achieve it with this book. It's a technical book, which I'll value more because it feels like I'm building a skill. I also have a friend that made a few graphics experiments as a hobby and this could be a great conversation topic.

Again, this is very personal feedback but I hope it can help you understand why some people might buy one and not the other.

>Is it the cover?

It's absolutely the cover, yes.

The photography, the fire effect, the composition, the typography choice, and the 'shine' effect on the text all scream low quality.

Reading a couple of pages using Amazon's preview feature… It might not be just the cover (which, in a more positive light, does seem like it allows one to judge the book by it).

Agreed. Writing is very hard. This is simple and repetitive in style. It is a writing style I would expect from fast paced. I came to see this as a warning sign. Didn't get through the sample and stopped reading. On the other hand I haven't written a novel. Keep up your work.

If I'm reading this correctly, you mean "the text is equally low quality"? I appreciate the honest feedback.

Feels like a staccato of names. Werner, Hans, Bauer, Lange and others all over the place. "Hans helped Werner carry Bauer" caught my eye and most sentences start with a name. Of course it was dark and foggy as well. Lots of adjectives I wouldn't miss if they'd be gone (complete silence, absolute blackness). Also felt no sense of direction or what these guys were even up to. That is easy critique from a reader. My writing covers e-mails and stuff.

'Low quality' is subjective, and it's easy to criticise as a reader (because you know when something doesn't work), but it is hard to provide good feedback (because it's hard to convert that feeling into the concrete points of why it doesn't work).

5tefan noted a few issues I agree with. There is a lot happening there, but you're not giving the reader much to hold on to. Bauer getting shot by the SS officer is a means to establish his ruthlessness, but at this point the reader doesn't have much to actually care about poor Bauer — perhaps I could care a little if he shared a piece of chocolate with Werner at a stop earlier and related a short anecdote about his bucolic yet blissful childhood in the Rheinland-Pfalz helping at his uncle's vineyard (note that I am not a writer, this may not be good advice). The execution scene also feels overwrought. Lange seems to care about fulfilling his mission above all, and time seems of the essence, so why would this ruthless man waste time on a nobody like Bauer? He might as well have kicked him aside, sending him tumbling down into a ditch and left for dead and thrust the torch into Werner's hands (or perhaps his right-hand goon would have done so automatically) with a good deal of «Verdammt noch mal!» leaving the fatigued Wehrmacht privates and non-coms to carry on, unable to disobey their leader and leaving poor Bauer to his lot.

Also, starting with 'Alps' is like saying 'Texas'; it's a huge area spanning eight countries, and at this stage of the war it matters where they (roughly) are. I would expect something like 'Alps, somewhere near Saalfelden' or less specific 'The Bavarian Alps'.

I can't say if the story itself is good or bad (it has something of an Agatha Christie feel in terms of plot, which is not a bad vibe to have), but your prose looks like it needed a stern professional editor. Did you have one or did you rely solely on test reader feedback?

Bear in mind that by writing and actually publishing a novel you are already a better writer than I am (a mere humble reader), and anything you'll write after this will likely be better than what you've written before.

Would you mind reading a couple pages of mine?

https://blondyn.com/lolpop.html

I actually randomly started adopting a very similar reading model with my short story series just yesterday, though with incorporating ~ 3 ad units per short story.

I’ve thought about testing this out for a bit, & while the idea of “inline-ads” sounds way-distracting, it does somewhat fit in with the “Pop Art” style literature of these short stories

Any feedback / critique super appreciated

I'll give you some feedback. The link color (#d4af37) and the background color (#eae4ce) is literally the worst combination I've ever seen. I thought magenta and emergency orange was bad.

I used to have a black background and the gold hyperlinks made for a better match

Thanks for the heads up, though, will choose a new link color tomorrow

For all the criticism HN might not be the target audience/market. So advise is very difficult. Generally I think it is a marketing problem. There are a lot of successful authors who only became successful after a couple of books and the books that didn't sell were also fine. (after the author beeing known the book sell)

For an unknown author marketing is important (and for this book putting it in the shops at airports, railway station where people just want some 3h entertainment). So I think you shouldn't self publish but sell it through a publisher who has access to these channels.

I love the cover :( I commissioned it through 99designs, went to many iterations with many artists, and even if I didn't make it myself, I'm basically responsible for it. I feel like it's the kind of cover this kind of book should have. I guess I'm wrong :(

I like the cover, it makes me think of an Andy McNab novel, and based on the blurb looks like you're in a pretty close genre.

I mean, I think the cover is cool. It makes me think of a Jason Bourne novel involving Nazis. Which is also a type of book I’d never read, sorry.

It’s a good cover because it tells me in an honest way that I will not be interested in it.

I wouldn't assume it's actually a bad cover based on HN commenters' tastes. Look at what's successful in your niche and copy that (to my eye, looks like you've done that, but idk the niche well)

My first thought, write another one ... second thought, have you looked at Pod casting? Scott Sigler, J. C. Hutchins, and Nathan Lowell all seem to have made some progress that way.

The name. Unless you're writing some fantasy breeding erotica?

The nazi imagery, even in a negative light isn't the best idea.

The blurb is fine. just fine though. It's a different skill than writing fiction, closer to writing marketing copy.

You're not the first to comment on the name, and I can't see the implication there. Perhaps because English is not my native language? Sounds completely innocent to me :(

> You're not the first to comment on the name, and I can't see the implication there.

Seed is a slang term for semen. The cover has nothing at all related to plants and instead looks like spy stuff, where you expect a fair bit of sex due to the genre (e.g. Bond girls like Dr. Goodhead or Pussy Galore), which is what tips the interpretation towards sexual innuendo.

Also, it doesn't help that it feels like a reference to some Bond film names that were also sexual innuendo, e.g. the Man with the Golden Gun, where gun also means penis.

I hope this helps your understanding of English, I know how hard it is to learn other languages and you write well enough that I would not have guessed that English was not your first language.

Seed is not only a slang term for semen, but a literal translation of the word.

Congrats on actually writing it on English! From someone that's also ESL, I know how hard it is to write decently. In the end, I think that can be part of the problem.

In another comment, someone mentioned that they wouldn't have guessed English is not your native language. But passing as a native speaker is one thing, passing as a good native writer is another.

But I hope you keep writing and keep evolving!

Seed means semen.

I did read the first page. The rhythm of sentences seems simplistic, words too short, sentences too short. Too much telling, not enough showing.

Fair enough, thank you.

Maybe you're being too hard on yourself? I mean your expectations may be too high? It has good reviews there, and seems pretty creditable. I liked the first chapter, which I've just read. I think I'd be happy with it. Lots of famous authors have written many more books than the books they are known for. And those are the famous ones! The attrition rate is high. In your situation, I would seek to find out what 'normal' is and then I'd measure myself against that.

First of all, well done on getting this far. I've had several goes at writing a book and never got this far. Writing a book is really hard!

Some brief feedback though on the first chapter. I thought the writing style was fine for this genre but I didn't really understand what it was that would make me move onto the next chapter. I wonder if you're holding back just a bit too much of what is so special about the content of the trucks. Maybe it just needs a bit more to draw the reader in?

Among a list of covers, your cover loses out. It looks like a blanket on fire in a Nazi guy's bedroom.

The title or cover doesn't convey what "Golden Seed" is supposed to mean - nor does the description.

What kind of marketing did you do to make sure it is seen by people?

On a side note: Congrats on the Computer Graphics book.

Allow me to give a counterpoint to the feedback on your book. It’s not the type of book I’d read, but the cover actually looks cool / interesting / professional to me. The first chapter was moderately engaging, much more so than what I’d expect from an amateur writer or college student. I can see why some people might feel it’s simplistic, but it doesn’t feel objectively “bad” to me.

I’m surprised and inspired you were able to write two books in two wildly different genres while being a SWE. Also surprised that did this while English isn’t your first language.

You’re putting yourself out there and being vulnerable in a lot of different ways, and I applaud you for that. Your work ethic isn’t unnoticed by me. I’d say please keep it up, I think you should continue writing and honing your craft. You’re off to a great start!

The name stinks, and the cover stinks. I'll introduce you to my version of the "Golden Rule". If a business or product has the word "gold" in it, it's garbage. Unless you are mining/selling gold or the Golden State Warriors (with Stephen Curry) avoid that word like the plague.

One key problem see is your blurb says "twist ending"... You already ruined some of your book with me. Maybe the whole thing at a fundamental level.

FWIW, this was actually in my wish List on Amazon, so I will eventually get around to buying it. I have Amazon unlimited, so I don't know how much this will help you--the book's description caught my eye and I think it came up as a recommendation. I'll write a review when I get around to reading it (I have some other books in the queue). Good luck!

It's interesting considering other markets where Amazon isn't so dominant. Web novel websites are really popular in Asia for example - the content is completely free to read and anyone can upload a novel. The best novels get ranked really high, are easily discoverable, and end up getting publishing deals. Due to the low barrier to entry, good UX, and popularity of the sites, even new authors can get a lot of exposure. I feel like there isn't really anything similar in the US. Amazon has basically extinguished all innovation in this area (like they did with the audio market too, e.g. CDNow which was one of the best curated music sites of all time... and now we have Amazon Music and Spotify).

> I feel like there isn't really anything similar in the US.

I'm not super familiar with the space, but I think this is what WattPad seeks to achieve. I know there have been at least a few stories on there that struck it big via Netflix deals.

There's quite a lot on sites like fanfiction.net and (the newer) Archive of Our own (https://archiveofourown.org/), and RoyalRoad. I've read millions of words of web serials posted on these sites, and would happily buy a published version of them as well.

Other than that, a lot of self-published authors start by uploading their works onto the Kindle (Unlimited) platform, and then marketing via personal blogs, twitter, reddit, etc. These authors can often draw small but devoted audiences – enough to make a reasonable career out of it. Admittedly this is, as you said, an Amazon thing, rather than an independent innovation, but it still works for many.

Royalroad has been growing like crazy, and pretty much anything that makes it to the trending page will get a couple people in the comments asking the author to hurry up and make a patreon page for themselves. WNs definitely seem like a great way for a decent writer to side-hustle without having to write and publish an entire book first, since you can just publish chapters as you go.

RavensDagger, One of the authors that I follow, posted an infographic of their 2020 work & earnings: https://i.redd.it/0cur92r6ll861.jpg

No actual earnings numbers, but Pirateaba is probably the highest paid person on the platform with north of 4k patrons at various tiers, although they recently switched to publishing on their own website only rather than using RR.

SWE turned into a non-fiction author here. I published my first book six months ago. [1]

Surprisingly, my biggest obstacle was digital advertising. It is impossible to advertise a print book on Amazon as an independent seller. Facebook banned my ads (guessing it's the cover?) and when I got past it, the ads had pretty good CTRs but very low conversions.

The thing that did work for me was the YouTube videos, interviews and other short pieces I did for publicity, that helped me to sell half of the total print.

Any ideas on how to tackle the advertising?

[1] https://www.amazon.com/Battle-Panipat-light-rediscovered-pai...

It's a shame to see the low sales numbers but I can't say I'm surprised. I read about a book per week but most people I know read maybe a few books per year, if that.

The author of this post must have free access to BookScan, or otherwise insanely deep pockets. It's really not cheap.

> Single ISBN report £90.00. 2 to 9 additional ISBNs in the same report £18 each https://www.nielsenisbnstore.com/Home/BookScanLifeTimeReport

Anyone know a more affordable way to do this kind of market research?

He still writes about this sort of stuff if anybody is curious: https://countercraft.substack.com/people/2796313-lincoln-mic...

tldr: most books do not sell many copies and or earn back their advances, and writing is a hell of a hard way to make a living

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