Hacker News Reader

Comment by flyinghamster | Hacker News Reader

USB-C sure turned into a mess, didn't it? So far, I only have two such devices (a cell phone and a set of headphones), and there's no problem charging either. But even there, we already have proprietary extensions (Qualcomm quick charging, for instance), and then there's Thunderbolt, and now this.

I'm not enthusiastic about wading into the world of "every port looks identical but isn't" that USB-C has given us. I have to keep my cell phone charger cable with the charger at all times, because it's my only cable compatible with Qualcomm quick charging. Naturally, there's no visible indication of this.

View on HN

I don't know, the flipside is that Thunderbolt delivers genuinely cutting-edge interconnect capabilities. I can run two 4K60 displays and a dozen peripheral devices, and charge my laptop, all via a single cable off of my $100 Thunderbolt 3 dock. There is no other technology that comes close to this capability at this price point.

At the same time, I have no idea if the cable I have is a thunderbolt or usb-c cable. There is no standard marking.

You might not know in advance which is a problem but it seems pretty trivial issue. Just test it and see if it works, if it doesn't return it and get a different one. Then repeat the process until you get the one you need.

Or you could look at the cable from the getgo and read a simple marking and not have to do this song and dance.

Your Thunderbolt cables don't have the lightening bolt logo on them? I didn't think it was a 'requirement' but every TB cable I've seen always has the thunderbolt icon.

Not my apple one.

Then it's either not genuine Apple or it's not Thunderbolt. This is what an Apple Thunderbolt cable looks like:

https://www.apple.com/shop/product/MD862LL/A/apple-thunderbo...

That's not a USB-C cable. The discussion is about USB-C cables capable of thunderbolt. Not the older, dedicated thunderbolt cables.

Correct link: https://www.apple.com/shop/product/MQ4H2AM/A/thunderbolt-3-u...

So…. with a lightning bolt then.

Which made me realize…a lightning bolt symbol could just as easily be interpreted by laymen as “charging only”!

What a mess…

Good catch - still has a lightning bolt on it though.

The standard MacBook charger that comes with any Apple laptop is not thunderbolt.

Thunderbolt cables generally have a lightning bolt mark, and are expensive and short and thick+inflexible. And because of that, you likely don't have any except for the one coming out of a thunderbolt dock or external GPU enclosure etc.

My apple cable I believe is thunderbolt but I'm not sure. It's white with no marking.

If there's no lightning bolt marking, it's just a charge & USB 2.0 cable, not thunderbolt. Genuine Apple Thunderbolt cables are marked, and the one you got with your MacBook for charging isn't one.

Does it have frayed rubber isolation around connectors and randomly along the cable? If yes, then it is a genuine Apple (tm) cable. If it has solid isolation ad looks good then it's probably a Chinese knockoff. :)

You either have a fake cable or a USB 2.0 charging cable

do those screens need to be 'thunderbolt' as well? or can they just take a usb-c connection (but ... not be thunderbolt?)

I have a 2019 MBP 15". Every 'dock' I've looked at seemed to indicate that "you will see mirrored screens on multiple displays" - which is not what I'd want.

Perhaps all of this is because I'm 'only' using a 2 year old MBP, and this is somehow all Apple's fault?

Would love to know what specific $100 thunderbolt 3 dock you have. It seems to be a confusing mess of half-information whenever I go to shop for stuff.

No, the displays don't need a Thunderbolt controller (and I do get 3 separate displays - mirroring would be pretty useless, I agree).

I use this dock: https://www.amazon.com/Lenovo-Thinkpad-Thunderbolt-Dock-40AC...

After updating the dock to the latest firmware, I can run two 4k60 displays, although it requires a specific configuration: one display on one of the DisplayPort lanes, and one on an active USB-C to DisplayPort cable hooked up to the dock's unpowered Thunderbolt port.

I've done this setup multiple times with this dock model, and it has worked with every Thunderbolt 3 MBP I've used.

> and this is somehow all Apple's fault?

Unfortunately yes. Apple (or MacOS specifically) doesn't support DisplayPort MST, which allows using multiple displays over a single DisplayPort connector. Since non-thunderbolt usb-c video is just DisplayPort, that means many usb-c docks with multiple display outputs don't work. Now why MacOS supports multiple video outputs over Thunderbolt and doesn't support MST is beyond me, but everything else does.

It's not _terrible_, but could definitely be improved.

I'm fairly content with my current situation. My phone has 'WARP' charge, which fully charges it in less than half an hour, however it can also charge (at a slower rate):

* Earphones

* Shaver

* Handheld Fan

* MacBook

I rarely connect my devices to a display, but that is supported with my cable too. The only device I use semi-regularly that isn't USB C is my Bose QC35s, but they last ~20hrs so usually last a few weeks due to my low usage.

On the other hand, my Mac charger can charge my phone (and obviously Mac) but none of the other devices...

After only reading the headlines promising the bright future of USB-C, I am very disappointed now that I carry three USB-C in my backpack for different use-cases.

Can you explain the differences between them? I don't have many USB-C devices (Switch and MacBook) but wouldn't you be able to use the most "fully featured" cable for every scenario?

The most "fully featured" cable with a USB-C tip is often like <0.5m long.

which perfectly ecapsulates the "problem" with usb-c: everybody wants a cable with all the features, but only wants to pay for the cheapest cable. and then gets frustrated when their $3 cable doesn't support thunderbolt and high-power modes.

you can get 3-metre thunderbolt cables if you want, you just have to pay a lot for them. all the problems with USB-C can be solved by spending more money. if you want to go the cheap route and buy cables that don't support all the various modes, then you're going to end up with a bunch of cables that don't support some modes and have to keep track of which ones those are.

if you regularly use devices that need higher-spec cables, it's probably worth keeping one good high-spec USB-C cable in your bag, instead of three terrible ones.

And $40+. Buying a long one for a music recording interface (that sweet sweet I/O) was super painful.

I guess it's cheaper now but in what world is a $50 cable to power an accessory reasonable in any way.

Source: https://www.sweetwater.com/c1225--Thunderbolt_Cables

It's kind of funny when (pre-covid) at the office people would point out my dock TB/USBC connector and how thick it was.

It carries probably 100W+ for power, multiple 4K displays, ethernet, half a dozen USB3 ports... I'd rather it not be the thickness of a 5W charging cable.

Quick Charging 3.0 is more-or-less a hack and shouldn't be done on usb-c (unfortunately, cheap manufacturers still do). Quick Charging 4.0 is just USB-PD, so a different name but compatible.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com