How to overcome inability to think quickly while working live with others? | Hacker News Reader

How to overcome inability to think quickly while working live with others?

6 pointsshotput13 comments

A programmer colleague has extreme difficulties when working live with colleagues or customers.

Things that normally come easy to her seem impossible in a meeting.

Also, she says that being often the only woman in the group puts added pressure on her.

She's unwilling to do programming interviews, due to the same problem. And she's unwilling to take advice from male programmers (like me), because she says that we don't understand what she's experiencing. Which is probably true (although it doesn't mean we can't help).

She's been unwilling to try things like meditation, breath control etc.

How can she overcome this hurdle? Any advice from people who've experienced and overcome this sort of hurdle would be great. Thank you.

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> She's unwilling to do programming interviews

> she's unwilling to take advice

> She's been unwilling to try things

> How can she overcome this hurdle?

It should be obvious but if someone's not willing to change, they won't change. If it were me, I would probably stop trying to help her. It seems like she's even made that clear to you "she's unwilling to take advice from...me"

I know it's probably not what you wanted to hear.

Thanks. You are probably right.

I guess my advice would be to prepare as much as possible for the meeting, including writing documents that present their positions. I would also try to defer as many on-the-spot questions with lines like "that's worth thinking more about, let me get back to you with a more complete answer."

There is also that old exercise where you pose the same question to all members of the group, then have everyone break out and write their own answer, then come back together again afterward.

But, stuff like that won't always be enough. To a certain extent, meeting with other people is kind of a requirement for teams, and you have to think quickly to have an influence in meetings. It's a job skill she'll have to develop one way or another.

Now, if she's saying that the people she works with aren't letting her talk, that's a different story: it doesn't sound from your description like that's the case. More like, she's feeling anxiety in meeting situations, and to some extent feeling anxiety about that anxiety, and so on in a spiral.

If that's true, one step would be to treat the anxiety as a separate issue from just work meetings, and talk to a professional about it.

> But, stuff like that won't always be enough. > To a certain extent, meeting with other people is kind of a > requirement for teams, and you have to think quickly to > have an influence in meetings. It's a job skill she'll have > to develop one way or another.

> More like, she's feeling anxiety in meeting situations, > and to some extent feeling anxiety about that anxiety, and > so on in a spiral.

> If that's true, one step would be to treat the anxiety as a > separate issue from just work meetings, and talk to a > professional about it.

This.

In my humble opinion, people should play to their strengths. Does the person in question want to learn how to think quickly in interviews or meetings? Or is it a manager-type setting these situations up?

Thanks for your reply.

The person in question would like to improve in meetings/interviews. My term "meetings" includes scenarios like code reviews, live debugging etc.

The person in question has never been a manager and (afaik) is not interested in being one. And it is difficult to avoid some of these scenarios.

I may not have worded the question well. The person in question is able to "think quickly" if they are not in a live situation. So the challenge is how to reduce the panic (or whatever word describes the feeling) that inhibits their normal thinking.

I'm not entirely comfortable with your question because you say she's unwilling to change and I don't understand why you are asking this question. It's not clear to me if you are butting in inappropriately or being helpful to someone who wants your help.

If she doesn't want your help and it isn't somehow your responsibility, you should butt out.

But I'm replying based on your last paragraph here.

It might help her to start a private journal and write about what happens so she can pinpoint the exact problem. Once she knows exactly what is tripping her up, coaching or practice or just thinking through her options may help.

I'm a woman and I've had to do a fair amount of analyzing "What went wrong?" in interacting with other people, especially men, in professional settings. So I think it can get better, especially if the person in question puts in some time and effort to ID the exact issue or issues and then start brainstorming "How will I respond to that in the future?"

Thanks for the advice. The person in question is not just a colleague but also a friend, and has expressed frustration with this specific issue multiple times to me. She is skeptical about suggestions like meditation, self-analysis, coaching etc. She has accepted other suggestions that are more technical in nature.

I thought that hearing what things others have done might encourage her to try some of those things. They may be more credible to her because they are being suggested by people who have been through what she does.

The "unwilling to take advice" was an overstatement on my part. At some point, though, I have to butt out, and this question on HN was in a way my last attempt to help.

This is a well known problem for many people, male and female. Many students (and teachers) experience it with maths. I got over it by practice and consciously relaxing in these sorts of situations.

I think she's probably making things worse by telling herself it's because she's a woman, but you'll get in trouble if you say that to her.

Edit: and the comments which advocate preparing as thoroughly as possible are good advice.

Thanks - yes, I agree with the practice and conscious relaxation.

And I do not intend to touch the "because she's a woman" part. Although I have definitely seen that side - things like her idea being accepted by someone only when said more confidently by another group member. Of course that is not just a gender thing, it's also about how to assert yourself in a group containing some dominant people. It's tricky to separate out the "because she's a woman" part from the "because she's not as assertive as needed in that situation" or "because someone else had better timing or communication" part.

I'm not sure I understand your connection to this woman. You say she's a colleague, but you also mention programming interviews. Are you working at the same company and helping her find another job? Some companies explicitly prohibit this poaching behaviour.

Aside from being female that sounds a lot like me.

I don't want to do programming interviews. Things that normally come easy to me feel impossible during live coding interviews.

Not everyone wants to be a pair programmer.

Not everyone wants to have their own live coding youtube/switch channel.

Yes, but in this case the person in question would like to improve this aspect.

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