https://slatestarcodex.com/2020/03/23/face-masks-much-more-t...
At the beginning of the pandemic I was skeptical about the effectiveness of masks and this article is what convinced me that there is some benefit.
https://slatestarcodex.com/2020/03/23/face-masks-much-more-t...
At the beginning of the pandemic I was skeptical about the effectiveness of masks and this article is what convinced me that there is some benefit.
Many of us did learn those lessons.
For me personally when this all began, checking out what the world is doing seemed the natural thing to do.
The US is also very insular, in that a smaller percentage of people travel abroad than is typical for many Western Nations. And a small percentage of people seek news produced outside the nation too.
Both of those stats are better elsewhere in the West, so make of that what you will.
This is the thing that makes me saddest. It just seems like people in the US are unwilling to endure even a minor inconvenience if it will help someone else but not do anything for themselves.
The idea of some effort, cost, minor sacrifice or inconvenience for a common, public good is not strong here.
Couple that being basically as insular on a personal level as we generally are nationally, and we find more of us than we may expect are empathy challenged too.
People refusing to wear masks rarely question whether or not it works, and more to do with a low estimation of the disease's threat, as well as contempt for both the technocrats who chose to mislead the public about masks early on, and leaders who they believe are overstepping their authority by mandating them.
Our leadership has been doing everything possible to burn through its perceived legitimacy, and this is the result. Childish, spiteful, somewhat understandable behavior.
Still, it created a lot of distrust when the message changed a few months ago, it wasn't a tribalist issue and I can completely understand how people ended up with this distrust. They are still wrong and I completely agree with this comment [1].
Yet another component is that trust in the press and other public institutions was at possibly an all-time low in America at the time the COVID pandemic became public knowledge, and shows no signs of pulling out of that nosedive.
"Hey, some government people lied to us saying we don't need masks, hence why we won't use masks now"
Great logic there. But hey, cutting your nose to spite your face feels good, no?
> Great logic there. But hey, cutting your nose to spite your face is nice, no?
Stupid people are gonna stupid, but you can't lie to people and then expect them to then automatically trust you when you're telling the truth. Those people are objectively and factually wrong, but they are right to be distrustful. If the issue wasn't one of science that we could otherwise objectively evaluate, their position would be perfectly rational and reasonable.
A lot of people in HN were arguing that the 0.7% fatality rate reported by Chinese authorities in Feb/20 was because Chinese medical care is bad.
Casual racism is kinda pernicious.
Agreed. We should have relocated Britain and NYC to the equator long time ago.
The statistical illiteracy here is astounding from professional scientists.
”0% of ths sick passengers wore masks, compared to 47% of the healthy passengers. Another way to look at that is that 0% of the mask wearers got sick, but 35% of non-wearers did”
And another way to look at it is that 65% of non-wearers didn’t get sick. The group of sick people is also quite small, meaning that the error bars on the effect size are large.
Sloppy, sloppy thinking.
1. Statistical uncertainty is normally ignored. They can and will tell politicians to adopt major policy changes on the back of a single dataset with 20 people in it. In the rare cases when they bother to include error bars at all they are usually so wide as to be useless. In many other fields researchers debate P-hacking and what threshold of certainty should count as a significant finding. Many people observe that the standard of P=0.05 in e.g. psychology is too high because it means 1 in 20 studies will result significant-but-untrue findings by chance alone. Compared to those debates epidemiology is in the stone age: any claim that can be read into any data is considered significant.
2. Rampant confusion between models and reality. The top rated comment on this thread observes that the paper doesn't seem to test its model predictions against reality yet makes factual claims about the world. No surprises there; public health papers do that all the time. No-one except out-of-field skeptics actually judge epidemiological models by their predictive power. Epidemiologists admit this problem exists, but public health has become so corrupt that they argue being able to correctly predict things is not a fair way to judge a public health model[1]. Obviously they insist governments should still implement whatever policies the models say are required. It's hard to get more unscientific than culturally rejecting the idea that science is about predicting the natural world, but multiple published papers in this field have argued exactly that. A common trick is "validating" a model against other models [2].
3. Inability to do maths. Setting up a model with reasonable assumptions is one thing but do they actually solve the equations correctly? The Ferguson model from Imperial College, which we're widely assured is one of the world's top teams of epidemiologists, was written in C and filled with race conditions/out of bounds reads that caused their model to totally change its predictions due to timing differences in thread scheduling, different CPUs/compilers etc. These differences were large, e.g. a difference of 80,000 deaths predicted by May for the UK [3]. Nobody in the academic hierarchy saw any problem with this and worse, some researchers argued that such errors didn't matter because they just ran it a bunch of times and averaged the results. This is confusing the act of predicting the behaviour of the world with the act of measuring it, see point (2).
4. Major logic errors. Assuming correlation implies causation is totally normal. Other fields use sophisticated approaches to try and control for confounding variables, epidemiology doesn't. Circular logic is a lot more common than normal, for some reason.
None of these problems stop papers being published by supposedly reputable institutions in supposedly reputable journals. After reading or scan-reading about 50 epidemiology papers, including some older papers from 10 years ago, I concluded that not a single thing from this field can be trusted. The problems aren't specific to COVID, they're cultural and have been around a long time. Life is too short to examine literally every paper making every claim but if you take a sample and nearly all of them contain basic errors or what is clearly actual fraud, then it seems fair to conclude the field has no real standards.
[1] "few models in healthcare could ever be validated for predictive use. This, however, does not disqualify such models from being used as aids to decision making ... Philips et al state that since a decision-analytic model is an aid to decision making at a particular point in time, there is no empirical test of predictive validity. From a similar premise, Sculpher et al argue that prediction is not an appropriate test of validity for such model" https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3001435/
[2] https://github.com/ptti/ptti/blob/master/README.md
[3] https://github.com/mrc-ide/covid-sim/issues/116 https://github.com/mrc-ide/covid-sim/issues/30 https://github.com/mrc-ide/covid-sim/commit/581ca0d8a12cddbd... https://github.com/mrc-ide/covid-sim/commit/3d4e9a4ee633764c...
You should look at the the observational studies measuring vaccine effectiveness in Israel coming from Balicer and his group.
They report the effect of the vaccine on number of positive cases without even mentioning that the vaccinated individuals are not routinely tested by ministry of health policy, or that the main reason people get tested is to shorten the isolation period after contact with covid-19 cases, which vaccinated individuals are exempt from.