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Comment by dukeofdoom | Hacker News Reader

Isn't this selection bias? It's like walking in on a flight to US, and seeing how poorly sloppy everyone is dressed. So you might assume that the US is some sort of third world country. But you would be wrong, because the US is rich enough that even the lower class can travel. So if you are talking with some native speaker, you just might be speaking with an idiot, because even idiots speak English as their first language. Where as English speakers from other countries, might be well educated, since it's their second language.

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I don’t think the opposite of ”idiot” is ”well-educated”.

And I also didn’t like the quoted person in the article that said they had to (my words) “dumb down” their technical conversation whenever an American entered the conversation or they wouldn’t understand the terms they were using. That is just arrogance and borderline xenophobism in my opinion. Neither the implication that speaking perfect grammar and knowing more words is almost equivalent to moral superiority.

Anyway, that represents the diversity in non-native speakers perceptions somehow I guess. I enjoyed a lot the insights of the professor from New Delhi — I loved the word prepone - and I think the concern about prejudice over not being “native” or “mother tongue” very valid.

I just saw the word prepone for the first time last week. My boss, who is from India, used it. I had to look it up.

That's probably because it was invented by Indians speaking English in India. Its not illogical etymologically but there is no reason you should be expected to understand it.

https://www.dictionary.com/browse/prepone

>Indian English

I think you're confused about how Americans dress. Even people with money dress casually, and we don't dress up to get on airplanes. In fact, most of us dress extra-casual on planes. I normally won't wear sweatpants in public, but I will on a plane, because it's far too uncomfortable to wear pants and a belt while crammed into a tiny seat. People who normally dress well will wear pajamas on planes.

That's true through an upper middle class level, then you get into always traveling business class (aka humanely-sized seats, better food). The bump from business/first -> private is not that much better.

Honestly, even in business class, sweatpants are just the better choice.

You should see how Australians fly. SYD-LAX is 13h, SYD-DBX is 14h and another 10h to Europe. There's no pretention about dressing to impress, it is calibrated for maximum comfort and practicality.

People who dress smartly on business class flights are probably just wearing whatever clothes they Normally wear for business, especially if they came straight from the office. You might find different dress on e.g. business class on a flight from San Francisco to Shenzhen (which is likely to contain engineers out to inspect factories).

I have the impression that I get asked less questions by immigration / customs when I dress better.

I was in a hostel where I and a Southie were the only native English speakers, and the Southie was unfortunately trying to explain how to "speak American" to someone from Eastern Europe. Cringe-worthy doesn't describe it.

Agree. In my native language, we use tons of slang and ignore grammer all the time. In fact lot of talk is based on context, you literally don't have to finish sentence, still other person understands meaning behind it.

It's the same in the majority of the languages.

I noticed that the usage of slang, correct grammar is an indication of the position on the social ladder and education.

It used to be like that but not any more. These days upper people mostly speak 'accented' english.

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