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Comment by StavrosK | Hacker News Reader

I guess they mean that in many places around the world, public transportation is more usable, so people don't need cars.

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That's true too, the point I wanted to make is that in many places, poor people can't afford any cars.

That's what you literally said, but why bring it up?

I'm just trying to put into perspective "poor people around the world" vs "poor people in the US". From my pov, if one can afford a car, it's a little rich to call oneself poor when compared to all the people who can't afford basic necessities. And no, a car isn't a basic necessity, not even in the US.

> And no, a car isn't a basic necessity, not even in the US.

This varies considerably. There are many places in the US that are entirely car dependent (nothing within walking distance, and little to no public transportation).

In most places in the US, if you don't have a car, you can't get to your job. Or you can, but it involves a fragile set of bus transfers that take you 2 hours (when driving would take 30 minutes) each way, and if you miss a transfer (because the transfers don't actually line up with any reasonable schedule), you're late and risk getting fired. So instead you add a 30 minute buffer in the morning and waste even more of your time.

Or you can walk 5 miles each way. Maybe it's good for your health (though the winters might be brutal where you live, and your route might not have sidewalks, and walking into work covered in sweat in the summer might not be allowed where you work), but that's pushing 2 hours each way as well. Getting a bicycle would reduce the time requirement, but most streets in the US are pretty bike-hostile, and you still have the weather issues to contend with.

Sure, technically a car is not "required" in that scenario, but people who are poor essentially have their time as one of their few precious assets. Saving 3-4 hours a day on a commute could mean picking up another job[0] that helps reduce financial insecurity just a little bit, or allowing a parent to spend a little more time with their kids.

I think people just really don't understand what it means to be poor. I have (fortunately) never experienced it, but have heard enough first-hand accounts to get the gist of it. Everything is harder when you don't have money. Everything.

[0] And that's a whole other issue, that so many jobs don't pay a living wage, requiring someone to hold down more than one just to make ends meet.

Why aren't scooters more popular in the US? Does it have to do only with the weather?

Agreed that everything is harder when one doesn't have money. Agreed that with kids, time is a lot more precious.

But in general... walking 5 miles each way doesn't sound impossible? Back before the pandemic, I walked 6km each way to a social gathering every week. I often walk errands up to ~8km each way.

Cycling... I used to cycle to work 12km each way year round, in temperatures as low as -10°C. Challenging? Yes (I didn't have especially fancy clothes and my hands were freezing). Impossible? No.

or someone that's considered poor, can't afford one.

Easier to do in some places than others.

Public transport is nonexistent in several places here in Texas for example - you have to have a car (or know someone who does) to get to your job in the first place. But commuting puts wear and tear on the car, especially if you can't find work particularly close to where you live.

I read a book once on extreme early retirement that advised to pick your place of work and house so that they were within walking distance of each other and also walking distance to a grocery store. The quality of the work and even your income weren't as critical as this. The idea being the goal was to finish work as soon as possible in your life when investment income could take over. Live in a one room rental, have one plate, a pot and a fork. Be a Spartan. That was the gist of it. Retire in five to ten years. Was compelling on some levels but orders of magnitude more difficult when you consider trying to bring a spouse and family into this.

That's rich people advice. Poor people know that wages can vary so much from place to place.

Or since this is tech we’re talking about, just work from home then live where you want, no need to be stuck in a tiny apartment in a big city.

I would find that kind of Spartan life to be pretty bleak and depressing. Sure, some people would like it, but I expect most people would not.

Those have "no car problems" that are objectively worse than "old car problems", since the (often disastrous) consequence of the later is throwing some of the former at you.

Yes, there are some places where public transportation both exists, doesn't take most of your day, and is cheaper than cars. Those places must be great, but as a 3rd worlder I barely know them (it's not a huge problem for me, personally, it's just enraging).

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