For those who can afford it, quitting has become the ultimate form of self-care

You know you're burned out when things that used to motivate you to get up early and work through lunch now feel like burdens. Not just work stuff either, but burnout it starts affecting your life outside work, on things that you thought had nothing to do with work.

> a challenging situation

You're challenged when, even if you don't know how to get through it, you have in your mind a structure, a way of getting through it. You know you can figure it out, you just have to work it out, and the process of working through it energizes you. You're over-stressed when you don't see a way through, or when you see the way through but dread doing the necessary things.

Tolerance for stress depends, in part, on a person's level of resilience: your ability to face reality exactly as it is, your sense that what you do will have some meaningful impact, and your self-confidence in your ability to handle the situation. You might remember a time when you were a kid and something you dealt with seemed like the end of the world, but now you look back and wonder what the big deal was. Your ability to manage stressful situations grew.

In short, when you're burnt out, you're tired even when you get enough sleep, you are reflexively cynical and critical of the work, and you begin to feel like problems you should be able to handle require extraordinary efforts. Those feelings happen now and then when you're not burnt out, but if it becomes chronic, that's burnout.

Oooooh boy you should look into medicine. This is a profession that has been dealing with insane burnout since before software existed and is only recently getting any amount of attention from within the community. (Think 80+ hour surgical residency for 8 years with the self-perpetuating cycle of "that's what I had to do so I make these residents do it too" logic of hazing)

I was previously pre-med and at one of my med school interviews (when the school was bragging about their mental health resources) they mentioned a story of a physician who played candy crush every morning before he got out of bed "just so that he could have one win for the day."

For me, I knew I was burned out when I just could not face the thought of going into the office and doing my job any longer. It made me physically sick to my stomach and then, over time, started to manifest itself in other ways that negatively affected my physical health.

The linked article really spoke to me - as do a lot of the comments in this thread. I think that for those who burn out, the hardest thing is perhaps learning to forgive yourself. Sounds cliched but there it is.

The main reason I know it was a burnout is that I never really found back. I am done with tech, or rather done with 40 hour weeks, done with unrealistic deadlines, done with so many things actually.

The Maslach Burnout Inventory, mentioned in TFA, is probably the most widely used/recognised specific classification / diagnostic mechanism.

If you think you're experiencing burnout, my recommendation would be to seek mental health support and specifically request the burnout assessment. Getting that might be more difficult than you'd expect, the sector is often averse to making such determinations.

Psh, what preceded that was far worse and also involved a lifetime of laboring for someone else's benefit.

Mid- and post-industrial revolution Europe had many large companies with many employees. In fact, the British East India Company (founded in the year 1600) was the first company to sell shares of ownership to raise enough capital to buy/build the necessary supplies to do large-scale business (in their case, mostly ship construction).

Of course, modern labor laws were created in response to the horrible human rights abuses committed by business owners against their employees beginning at that time.

The opposition of "big capital" vs "labor" (and hence the philosophy built on that dichotomy that underpins Marxism) didn't really exist prior to these large industrial revolution companies.

Prior to that, small businesses (and banks/lenders) were the bread and butter of economic society.

The nice thing about working for someone else's company is you work 40 hours, then it leaves your mind for the rest of the time. If there's some problem at work, it's usually "not in my job description." Like, printer doesn't work? Call the Department of Inhuman Resources. Not your problem.

If you work for yourself, it's 24/7. No vacations, either. All problems are your problem. Printer quit? Whatcha gonna do about it? It isn't for everyone.

“…man never regards what he possesses as so much his own, as what he does; and the labourer who tends a garden is perhaps in a truer sense its owner, than the listless voluptuary who enjoys its fruits…In view of this consideration, it seems as if all peasants and craftsman might be elevated into artists; that is, men who love their labour for its own sake, improve it by their own plastic genius and inventive skill, and thereby cultivate their intellect, ennoble their character, and exalt and refine their pleasures. And so humanity would be ennobled by the very things which now, though beautiful in themselves, so often serve to degrade it…But, still, freedom is undoubtedly the indispensable condition, without which even the pursuits most congenial to individual human nature, can never succeed in producing such salutary influences. Whatever does not spring from a man’s free choice, or is only the result of instruction and guidance, does not enter into his very being, but remains alien to his true nature; he does not perform it with truly human energies, but merely with mechanical exactness…

…we may admire what he does, but we despise what he is.” ― Wilhelm von Humboldt

You weren’t beholden to someone else’s corporation, but you were to someone else’s land or tribe/community.

There are a (probably) minority of people with genuine brain chemistry imbalances, genetic or otherwise, that cause depression. But for the vast, vast majority of people being fed pills and trying to ignore their problems, your mental health issues are signs of issues you need to deal with, unresolved traumas, unfulfilling work, love, family, or social situations, political problems that you can't accept but you won't engage with, and so on.

I’m sorry, but this triggered me. Have you tried an open office? I long for my cubicles.

At least then I had like 4 square meters to myself. Both my space and my privacy have been degraded more and more.

There are some things worth struggling against, but I see no better reason to quit than a pointless struggle.

Does grinding oneself into dust at a thankless job for a faceless corporation in the name of perpetual economic "growth" at the cost of the entirety of survivable nature as we know it have any meaning whatsoever? Because that's the flipside of what you're saying.

It may not be possible for us to go back to a time before modern technology, medicine, etc (or maybe its more likely than we think), but is it any wonder that so many peoples' brains yearn for something like that? The definition of life may be struggle, as you say, but struggle without self-determination may be the very thing that kills whatever "human" is.

jk, but seriously, meaning is subjective, and nihilism is a thing. one mans isolation may mean worlds to him, and thats good enough.

also, careful about shaming people for being content with personal happiness...for some thats an accomplishment.

But everyone is discounting struggling for faceless corporate entities that do not and will never give a shit about you.

While I realize this isn't an option for many people due to lack of opportunities, kids, lifestyle creep, etc., I have both planned for it and been very fortunate. So no, I'm not worried about it.

I lived very cheaply, worked a few freelance jobs, burned through my savings, and ended up finding a job when I had about 6 months of expenses left in my savings account. Never had to dip into retirement or stocks though.

Best time of my life. Many people like the sound of this but have no interest in actually living that way. I lived in a tiny studio apartment, rode a bicycle everywhere, ate a cheap plant based diet, and bought almost nothing.

I'm not going to be able to retire, and my savings are gone. The end of my life is likely to be quite miserable.

I know my choices have lead to that. They weren't good choices, and I wouldn't recommend them to anyone. But they are the choices I made and I am reaping the consequences.

If you can hack it, be all career oriented and make good choices that secure your future... more power to you if you can do that for yourself and your family.

My wife took a 6 month unpaid sabbatical about a year after we moved in together. She had been with the same company for 10 years at that point. She saved up about four months worth of rent and we just stopped eating out as much, and she paid for the rest with a ~4% personal loan through her local credit union. I think it was paid off within three months.

More recently, my wife took off 1 month unpaid maternity leave. During pregnancy we both saved about 10% of our disposable income, and this more than covered her portion of the living expenses during this month.

So, in the five years I've known my wife, she's taken 7 months unpaid leave. That's not a huge amount of time, but at the same time, definitely helped her avoid burnout. And we didn't have to chip in to long term savings for her to do it. I work in a different industry and job hop more often, so I just take 3 weeks unpaid in-between jobs, which is a mild strain on finances, but not significant. Other than the mortgage and boat payment we don't carry any long term debt and continue to save for retirement.

As for future plans, in about five years we're planning on taking an unpaid year off, just before our kids go to primary school, but plan on doing that in a low cost of living area. Most of that year will be paid for using savings set aside for that, with any run-over paid for with low interest loans. Will it impact the long tail of my retirement? Probably to some degree, but I'd rather spend my time, now, with my kids, rather than rot away in a retirement home wishing I hadn't worked so much.

So after these 10 years you’re free to quit working for ever, work as little as you feel, and for any amount of money. In other words: you’re free to do whatever you want.

Also, what was your most memorable place you've seen in the Americas? Africa?

Edit: This reminds me of the concept of "social integration" in sociology. Some works of fiction cast it as "conformity".

I don't live in a city. I doubt I ever will again. There's nothing there for human beings, they're hostile to us, they're sirens on sharp rocks.

Others will be in very different situations.

Not saying that’s true in every case, but plenty of workaholics burn themselves out.

I've consulted a psychiatrist because it's clearly a recurring pattern that has fucked up my career progression. I've been told I might have ADHD.

I think the point (for me at least), is that some people aren't just meant to function in a full-time job. A bit of an exaggeration, but I tell myself that by the time that I'm 30, and I still have someone control my pace, schedule, and deadlines, that I'll kill myself (maybe just metaphorically).

That assumes you get a chance to explain.

A lot of time your resume will just go in the trash as soon as they see a big gap in your work history.

And if you do get a chance to say you were pursuing some self-employment opportunity in the gap, that'll rarely be good enough, because what most hiring managers want to see that you kept your skills up to date in the interim and continued to do something related to your field (which people who are burnt out are unlikely to do). Otherwise you're going to fall behind... at least in the tech field.

Other things that matter are:

- how long were the gaps?

- how frequent were the gaps?

- how long did you work at each of your jobs?

If the gaps are long and/or the jobs are short, they're red flags. It doesn't mean you won't get hired, or won't get an interview, but every red flag lowers your chances.

With each gap you're digging yourself deeper and deeper in to a hole that will be progressively harder to climb out of.

My advice is to switch careers as soon as possible.. the longer you wait the harder it'll be. Your choice of alternate career doesn't have to be perfect, and it doesn't have to be "your calling" (often people don't even know their calling until they try it). It's important to try, and maybe try a whole bunch of different stuff until you find a good fit, and not to just languish and rot.

Easier said than done for someone suffering from burnout.. but that's the way out instead of sinking further in.

Of course breaks, therapy, and medication work for some, and I hope they work for you.

Maybe they could just check on specific skills they are looking to hire for. They can check if one is reasonably updated on recent industry/technology trends.

But if hiring folks are really hell bent on finding real reason on why I left the job and not working for last few years, I guess there is no practical way to escape out of it.

If you need mental health treatment (that you otherwise wouldn't need) to do your job and not despair? There's a good chance there's something wrong with your job.

I agree though that for many people their situation could be improved by the assistance of a mental health professional. But that doesn't mean that their problems are all caused internally and aren't to some degree a product of their work environment.

Quite the opposite for me. I was miserable in my first job. Not a single day where I wanted to go to work. After 4 years I quit and everyone told me that I need to change my attitude, and that all jobs are like this.

They. Were. Completely. Wrong.

I was very happy with my next job.

My 3rd job sucked (for different reasons). I wasn't anywhere near burnout, but my first two jobs taught me one thing: Life is too short to stay at a job that sucked. I moved on to the 4th job which ended up being awesome.

If you're miserable at your job, it may not be you - even if everyone around you thinks it is.

This XKCD is very relevant:

https://xkcd.com/1768/

Edit:

For example, first job I just looked at

"You are:

Hungry, humble and smart..."

What other profession says nonsense like this, imagine saying this to a doctor or accountant.

As an introvert who would sometimes rather avoid the toll of socializing, I spent the first four years of my marriage unintentionally neglecting my wife and family because I saw people around me working 12 hour days and weekends to provide. So I did the same. The damage that “bringing home the bacon” mentality had on my ability to turn attention to the relationships I truly cherish is painful.

I’m working past it now and looking for jobs with more PTO and after-hours support strategies that aren’t “quick, let’s call Bob” for every fire. I hope you never hit the point I had to to turn things around. One quote that really turned things around for me goes like this:

> when you die, your coworkers will be upset for a time but your job will soon replace you. But the memory of your loss will be with your family forever.