Hacker News Reader

Comment by podric | Hacker News Reader

The perceived bad quality of Chinese products is partly a deliberate marketing strategy to make products that prioritize low price over quality, and partly due to lax standards relative to countries like the US.

It's a lousy argument to suggest that Chinese products are bad because Chinese culture does not promote attention to detail because some people sometimes say "chabuduo". One can equally make the same bad argument about American workers, because some Americans use the expression "just eyeball it" at work.

When held to a high standard, Chinese people are capable of producing high quality products, evident in the prevalence of Chinese SWEs in FANG and the fact that Apple and Tesla both have major manufacturing facilities in China.

View on HN

> It's a lousy argument to suggest that Chinese products are bad because Chinese culture does not promote attention to detail because some people sometimes say "chabuduo".

With respect, you have not spent much time in mainland China. "Chabuduo" is pervasive in a way that you are downplaying - either because you have some agenda or you are not knowledgeable. There is absolutely no comparison between the average Chinese manufacturing process and the average US one. Are their outliers in all cases? Of course. But generally speaking the GP is correct.

With regards to Apple and Tesla (and I would also add Volvo) - high quality/high tolerance manufacturing CAN be done in China of course. But it's only because the Western companies who pull it off have imposed their culture, standards and rules, on the process.

I think the parent author is emphasizing that this culture of "Chabuduo" is not inherent to Chinese culture, rather it is may be something came out of getting rich fast scheme that is inherent to an emergent economic and industrial power.

Yeah, I got that part - and I understand why people would want to believe that because no one wants to believe a culture can have sub-optimal traits. But from where I stand, it is a cultural thing. It may be expedient, it may have sprung from a time when it was more advantageous than it is now, but there's no denying it exists.

How about: not an inherent trait, but rather an endemic and “parasitic” meme? (Like the popular belief in eugenics in many countries in the 1930s; or the belief of several colonial powers—but mainly Britain—in the inferiority of aboriginal tribes’ values and beliefs during the Age of Exploration; or the belief in Varna [caste] as a popular interpretation of dharma within Hinduism; or the belief within Islam that a “jihad of the sword” can permit civilian targets.)

These sort of memes come along and “infect” a culture, saturating it — or at least the more vulnerable-to-manipulation populations within it — with these views; and they can stick around for decades or centuries. But, they aren’t intrinsic to the culture; eventually the culture stops believing these memes, because believing them offers no real benefit (thus the “parasitic” part.) If/when they do get over them, the culture as a whole tends to feel ashamed that they ever did believe them.

Caste based discrimination is not a meme. It’s deeply rooted in more than half of the Indian population and has taken root in the United States along with migrants who brought it along with them and teach their children these “values” https://www.npr.org/2020/09/21/915299467/how-to-be-an-anti-c...

That's what a meme is, as originally defined.

A singular cultural trait or idea that replicates.

Why do you think Varna and Caste are the same? [1]

1. https://hinduism.stackexchange.com/questions/39862/are-varna...

I don't; I meant to talk about Varna. But how do you localize "Varna" to English for someone who not-very-familiar with Hinduism? Most English-speaking people don't even know what caste is.

>It's a lousy argument to suggest that Chinese products are bad because Chinese culture does not promote attention to detail...

I would just like to point out that the GP did mention,

>...not culturally specific to Chinese...

It's not perceived, it's empirical. As you pointed out, the focus of low price and undercutting the competition at any cost are partially the reason.

Incentives shape culture more than the inverse.

I think low quality is only a result of desire to sell cheap, but Chinese producers are capable of meeting high quality standards and out-innovating other countries The bad habits from communism era will disappear eventually

Of course they are. Like everyone else, they do what they're being paid for. It's the companies that outsource manufacturing to China that create the designs and set the quality standards.

I think 'cheap' comes from outsourcing. There are so many producers in China that have been only doing outsourced production, but now they want to sell their own products. But for the moment they dont have brands, dont know the market, dont know how to approach customers in the wild. So they produce cheap and hope to at least compete by price in a crowd of anonymous alike companies.

In my experience with buying from china, it can be described in a saying that is making rounds especially in marketing gadgets market:

You can pay more, and get 100% of your order QA checked and certain to work. Or you can pay less, and at best you will get 130% of your order because that will statistically ensure there's enough of your order done right in the package, but you sort it yourself.

Is Tesla the best example? This was from an American plant: https://www.extremetech.com/extreme/314871-tesla-model-y-own...

Reply on news.ycombinator.com