Hacker News Reader

Some great points here. I went to school in Waterloo (where RIM is) and worked for 4 months in product design at Apple, so I am pretty aware of the differences between the two companies. Here are my thoughts on your points:

1) Very true. Apple is anal about the smallest details, RIM isn't. RIM has too many products in parallel development to dedicate the kind of resources they would need to match Apple. Just can't happen. Just accept it and come with your own style. 2) I absolutely love this. RIM does have a lot of manufacturing done overseas, but they have a very modern manufacturing facility right in Waterloo. Bring it all here and hype that up. It might flop, but it's a ballsy move that people would appreciate. 3) I am not sure if this is the case anymore, but for a while there, BlackBerry's were being shipped without App World on them. Wtf! 4) I disagree here. Their acquisition of QNX was brilliant. Use the playbook and you realize that it's an entirely different operating system than OS6. I think it could be very successful on their phones. 5) Interesting. Would help to become the low-cost smartphone while keeping margins relatively high.

In my opinion, it all comes down to how well QNX can create a compelling smartphone operating system. Do it well, and RIM will do just fine capitalizing on their legacy customers and getting those who want a keyboard. Screw it up, we might be looking at the next Palm.

+1 for Waterloo. I'm not far from it.

"3) I am not sure if [Blackberry apps are a problem] anymore."

Yup - they are. I think the solution is in the money developers can earn. Quote from Gizmodo: "BlackBerry App World debuted in 2009 and had about 26,000 applications as of April 2011. Android had over 200,000 apps and iOS was pushing 350,000."

"In my opinion, it all comes down to how well QNX can create a compelling smartphone operating system."

With the current outlook and direction of RIM in mind, I completely agree with you. However, Apple's mobile devices are founded on cheap, disposable hardware. It's a sound strategy. RIM however previously found a great deal of success by founding their products on the hardware along with a secure, reliable OS. The times have certainly changed, but I think that the fundamental problem with RIM is that they have lost sight of this.

Do people actually care about where the product is manufactured? I don't, as long as they're not using slave labor etc; I actually think outsourcing improves the standard of living around the world and provides me a better product at a lower price.

Of course. For many people "buy American" is a mantra. People from car makers to American Apparel try to tap into this sentiment. (obviously the degree to which something was actually "made in the USA" is not always clear)

You do know RIM is headquartered in Canada, right?

Do you know anything about American Apparel? You'd be better if with your money in a mattress than in their stock.

Some Americans care about "buy[ing] American", but most don't. A prime example is the Japanese auto manufacturers taking market share away from American companies with better quality cars since the 80s, eventually becoming dominant.

Not to mention that the US isn't the only market for smartphones out there, so a large portion of the market certainly don't care if something is manufactured in the US.

Making quality software is probably the biggest opportunity for RIM right now, not the location of manufacture.

Consistently, Apple's "dirty secret" has been their use (and sometimes over use) of cheap offshore labor. This has allowed them to release products quickly and earn high profits.

RIM is still in a position to take the high road. Their devices don't need to compete on price. They can compete on quality. With manufacturing brought completely in to North America, RIM could say things like "take pride in our products - we do" and "Apple is in it for the money, we're in it to make our lives better".

"take pride in our products - we do"

pride when you make inferior product is not a good idea. Imagine the reaction of the people if just after I lose on first round of a Tennis open(I did) I scream to the stands: I'm so proud of me!!!

"Apple is in it for the money, we're in it to make our lives better"

If they say that they will be lying. Actually Apple has so much money in the bank that they could take the luxury of not being on it for the money, while RIM needs it to survive. Does Steve Jobs is there for the money? I bet you not.

Good list

1. Agree to a degree they already doing it on Playbook by taking good stuff from WebOS whenever I use iPad I wish I had PB ui on it. 2.It would take a very good marketer to pull this off and make real money. Not sure about it. 3. You can make money on AppWorld and competition is not like on iOS. They have payment and ad api. They also now introducing BBM sdk, which could be a massive money maker for some apps that can integrate with it. 4. I do not think they can do this, huge part of their brand is software (security BBM etc) QNX is what will either save them or kill them I think. 5. Not sure, my plan costs me $35 cdn and its unlimited sms, 5gb of data etc (go WIND!)

QNX is the key, I just hope we do not have to code in flash to make stuff for it.

This si an exciting time to be a dev in mobile I think both RIM and MS can really surprise many people who think this is all over. US is farm from the only market, people here tend to forget that.

"4. I do not think they can do this, huge part of their brand is software"

I don't think that RIM should ignore their OS or the software that runs on it - far from it. I think that RIM needs to make a course correction and that the course correction should focus on hardware. Software is will easily make or break RIM (as you've noted with QNX), but centering their products on a strong, reliable, thin and easily extendable OS should become front-and-center.

"5. Not sure, my plan costs me $35 cdn and its unlimited sms, 5gb of data etc (go WIND!)"

Sadly, Wind is only available in heavily populated metropolitan areas and RIM has done nothing to ensure low rates. Wind is simply competing on price.

RIM needs to publicly open discussions with every carrier in the world. They need to form collations to reduce cellular data fees so that their devices proliferate even faster. How much more popular would the Playbook be if it came with an unlimited data plan that cost $5 a month? How many more Blackberries would we see (regardless of product changes) if they openly supported the customers who used their devices?

Beyond offsetting hardware costs with term fees, monthly data costs are outrageous. Battling them is a way to win favor with the public and secure a larger number of users.

1. As they did before(they tried to follow their own path but market disagreed with them), so the can continue losing market share even faster...

2. So people that is not North American, like Europeans, Japanese, Chinese and South Americans have more reasons to not choose it. Do you honestly think that you(Americans) are the center of the world?

3.4.Yes, they have to.

5. They can't kick their customers!! Remember that RIM does not have a direct sales channel as Apple has, they need cellular providers. It is terrible expensive to have it(you need billions of dollars in inventory).

1. Agreed. I was going to switch to them when the Torch came out (love my physical keyboard), but what a failure that was.

5. So much of this, but I doubt they have enough power to do this anymore. Case in point: BESX (the free enterprise server). When BESX came out everyone was happy until Verizon were assholes and still required some nonsense fees that BESX was supposed to make free.

I don't know how much things have changed since then -- it's been about a year now -- but I doubt its any different now.

"They need to step up where Apple hasn't and make their consumer level data plans inexpensive, open and user friendly."

Did you miss where Apple negotiated the dump pipe iPad plan?