Comment by musicale | Hacker News Reader

Comment by musicale | Hacker News Reader

Absolutely. Whiteboard interviews, as practiced by FAANG etc., are largely useless.

I've seen interviewers pose problems that took the likes of Dijkstra and Knuth years to solve the first time, yet somehow they expect candidates to solve two of them in 45 minutes. Unless you are actually Dijkstra reborn or Knuth you're unlikely to solve a problem of this type quickly unless you've seen it, or something very close to it, before.

So it's essentially selecting for some combination of how recently you took an algorithms course or qualifying exam, how comprehensive that course of study was, how much experience and success you have had in "programming" (aka algorithm puzzle) competitions, how much grinding you've done on hackerrank/leetcode/etc., and pure luck.

That being said, I suppose much of the content of medical boards or the bar exam has little to do with the actual practice of medicine or law, so I guess computing is not alone in terms of annoying hoops it makes people jump through. I just wish that algorithms qualifying exams were a standard thing that you could pass outside of a job interview and be done with, rather than something you have to suffer through repeatedly.

One thing these types of interviews do though is select for people who put in the time and effort to learn/relearn/apply these algorithms. Perhaps that correlates with other desirable traits

Or the smart ones will go do something more lucrative instead of putting in time an effort for a lottery ticket interview. I have to spend years in college, years in industry, and then spend a bunch of free time learning random test questions that I might never apply in the real world... why not just go to med school or get a securities license?

Because you are already stuck on the path you picked and have no choice

Sort of. The scenario assumes one is looking for another job via the focus on interviewing. So it's not that much of a stretch to contemplate changing industries if a switch to another job within the current industry requires jumping through hoops too.

I'm stuck in my job like you mention. But this sticking also prevents me from changing jobs within the industry.

Why would you spend a week preparing for an interview for a six-figure job instead of of going through medical school and residency? Is that a real question?

Who says it's a week? Also, there's no guarantee that you will get the job. You have a much better chance of getting an even higher paying job if you go to med school.

My own personal experience says it's a week. You may have better odds of getting a job after medical school, I don't know, but it's six years of very hard work, which, even if you think a week is way too optimistic, is still a much bigger investment.

Part of those six years includes paid residency.

It might be a bigger investment, but has a higher median return.

It may be a week for you, but is that indicative of the average experience? It's kind of like how all the silicon valley people on here post their massive salaries as if it was normal. Many of us in other areas don't even have access to those high paying job opportunities. So what's the point of studying for something that isn't even available in that locale.

I would imagine that most people who've done it a couple times will find reviewing the material is much faster than learning it for the first time. I also suspect that many medical professionals do not live in their first choice of location, but if you think medical school is so much more appealing than some interview prep and a possible relocation what are you waiting for? I think the fact I could learn all this stuff for free is a pretty big mark in favor of it over medicine, but everyone's judgments are different, I suppose.

Well I guess I'm just a big piece of shit compared to you.

That's not what I'm trying to say and your profile suggests you're adapting a lot of self-defeating negative attitudes which are probably not helping your situation.

So you're saying that you didn't think that, but now that you saw my profile it's true.

No. What I’m saying is you’re constructing your own shackles in your mind.

I actually think that optimizes for those who come from a place of privilege. More elite schools have classes that teach this stuff, regular colleges don't. Also it's hard to put in the time for that when all of your free time goes toward merely surviving. I can promise that a lot of tech's diversity problems stem from things like this.

wut? Programming languages, data structures, things like shortest path algos are taught in every traditional school. You can agree that the quality of teachers might not be great, but the books are the same.

You can argue that crappy code academy schools don't teach right, but personally even the most average college will have a decent curriculum into CS fundamentals.

It is on you to make a use to it. I personally learned most practical things by myself, but college gave me a huge jump start into the fundamentals. What you do with them is up to you.

I feel I didn't explain correctly, yes all schools teach algos and data structures, but elite schools literally have a white-boarding class as well, Which is a slightly different situation, not impossible to overcome for one without access to it but acknowledging that people are coming from different places is worth noting, no?

On the other hand, many people without CS education at all (myself included!) have made it through this gauntlet and probably wouldn't have their resumes entertained at all without something like it.

Willingness to be exploited? Willingness to put up with management ordering you to jump through arbitrary random hoops?

You either get natural CS wizards or dedicated people who are willing to spend time preparing. Seems like a win either way.

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