Comment by EliRivers | Hacker News Reader

Comment by EliRivers | Hacker News Reader

The car. As he says, the car. The goddamned car.

Every time you get into it, hoping that it will start. And not just when it's been sat outside your house for a while. When you stop for petrol (gas), or in the car park after buying food, sitting behind the wheel and hoping it starts again. The restrictions that get placed on you when you just can't rely on the car always starting.

For your life, a mostly-starts car is in theory better than no car, but for mental health it's corrosive. Every plan you make carries the rider "unless the car doesn't start" and you end up restricting where you drive to places that, if you were suddenly carless, you could still get home from. Any time you're outside the safety zone, there is the constant fear "what if it doesn't start?" Being afraid, having that stress, all the time is just mentally corrosive.

If a better job comes up and it's not near public transport, every day is a gamble on being able to get to work, and get home again. Spending your evening worrying about whether you'll be able to get to work in the morning is a horrible way to live; perpetually unable to relax. At least once I simply sold it for scrap and gave up entirely on doing anything that needed a car. Such a relief, but I was in the privileged position of being able to live and work without one.

That moment when you come out of the grocery store and the car doesn't start on the first try...

I'm not in that situation anymore but I can still remember the absolute sinking feeling. And then the overwhelming sense of relief when it started on the second try. I've had my water turned off. I've had my heat turned off. I've scavenged wooden pallets on the side of the road to burn in a wood stove for heat. I've broken the seal on the gas meter so I could turn it on at my most desparate. I escaped those circumstances thanks to family, and church friends. But this article is spot on as to what it's like to poor or poor-ish.

This ties into covid too. Low paid jobs are more likely...scratch that. Low paid jobs always require physical presence, most often at strange hours not served by public transportation. There are no work-from-home days for tradespeople, for cleaners, for food workers.

For the wealthy, a car is expensive but mostly a convenient way to get around. For the poor, car maintenance costs can be ruinous. However, our society (excluding a few large cities) all but requires a car for day-to-day activities. Everyone drivers, but the poor bear the brunt of the cost, since they are more likely to live near noisy, polluted roads. Meanwhile, the wealthy can afford to live on quiet suburbs and cul-de-sacs. Cities and infrastructure designed for cars ("car dependency") disproportionately hurts the poor.

I'm really curious to see how electric cars work for the poor (maybe 25 years from now, not presently).

One of the big selling points of electric cars is simplicity - with far fewer moving parts, less can go wrong and you can hopefully expect a car to last longer.

That's the hope anyways, but the big maintenance item in an electric car is the battery, and of course that's an expensive thing to replace. Will folks be able to do DIY repairs like cobble together battery packs from various sources? Will a decades-old battery that is 50% depleted or more still allow that car to function properly, just with less range? Or will it refuse to "start"?

Maybe in 25 years.

As is, electrical car means new car and new car means an inane amount of software components that break all the time. Just pick any specific model, say, the Tesla S: You can find people being confused how to turn it off, the car not starting due to software updates, the car being hacked, the being bricked by broken software or lacking connectivity, erroneous warnings, the car only driving backwards due to low battery.

The simplest car is something like a 1998 Corolla and given the current trends in automotive, that will stay that way for a long time.

The downside is needing somewhere to charge them. The poor don't tend to live in houses that you can easily plug an EV into.

They'll have to go somewhere else to charge up, that will charge a premium.

That's the main reason I'm so excited for EVs with useful amounts of solar panels on top. Adding 5-10 miles of range per day is enough to cover a lot of people's commutes, especially those who live apartments that're more likely to be closer to the city. (Folks in sprawling suburbia likely have longer commutes, but also have a place to plug in and charge.)

Looking at the current trend, it's highly unlikely e.g. single casting, structural battery packs. Car companies are for profit, so they have every incentive not to make it repairable. What is more, they are some good arguments to be made against DIY when you have autopilot in the car.

Self-driving cars may help tough, probably 15+ years after it's legal.

As much as I think the solution is "get rid of cars" (or get rid of personal vehicle ownership), I do think reliable cars would make a huge difference for people struggling financially. Not having to worry about the most important tool in your life — the thing that allows you to get to work, to the store, and to appointments — would be a massive stress-reduction for so many people, and stabilize their finances. No more "I can't make it to work, so I lost my job" and no more unexpected $2000 repairs?

Honestly, more reliable transportation might do more to reduce poverty even more than food stamps. (Also, allows you to make your food stamp appointments.)

This has been my problem for years now. I'm in the middle of nowhere and I can't count on the thing. I don't know how many times I've been stuck and also almost towed because I couldn't move it. I've luckily managed to avoid it so far but I'd not be able to do much about it if it happened.

I once was interviewing at a company for a graphic designer position. My previous job was paying me just below $30,000 and I desperately needed to increase my income to keep up with my bills (college loans, rent, food, electric, etc.). My vehicle (1987 Chevy Blazer) was not very reliable (in ~2010) and wouldn't you know it - I broke down immediately after parking in a lot directly in front of a sign that said "2 Hour Parking, Vehicle Will Be Towed At Owners Expense".

I'll never forget the embarrassment I felt after a pretty underwhelming interview explaining that my car was broken down outside in their lot and asked they notify their security so that I was not hit with more expensive fees. I've had some pretty significant financial hardships - some much worse than this, but this moment in particular really had a lasting effect on me.

Dude this is so true, in the US reliable transportation is so important. Particularly given the abysmal, non existent public transportation in the majority of the country. Having an unreliable car is a major source of stress for a lot of people.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com