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Comment by xyst | Hacker News Reader

am I the only one that doesn't care about working for a FAANG? The only intrigue from these companies is that they offer golden handcuffs. I occasionally go through the interview cycle at these companies just to get offers I could use to leverage other companies.

there's probably a limited number of projects that interest me at these companies and knowing my luck I would get assigned to some maintenance project doing "plumbing" (internal use only libs for example) or assigned to cleanup shitty code from a nearly dying project.

if you are graduating college and get into these companies, don't drink the koolaid. keep your eyes open and don't waste your potential on these companies. Save up your $$$, and build something that people will use.

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It says that she chose Google instead of Repl.it because they'll also send her to Europe for a summer internship, which may open up quite a lot of possibilities for her (regardless of if she likes/dislikes FAANG). When you're in a relatively obscure country outside of the US, every networking opportunity counts, regardless of what you want to achieve with your expertise.

yes exactly! this is something that I discussed a lot with my mentor at Manara and this is what we agreed on. I’ve never been on an airplane before, I think being in Europe will be life-changing for my career and also for my personal experience. Gaza is tiny, it’s 30km x 6km. I want to see some new things. :)

As someone who works at Google Munich, sounds like a smart choice to me! Seeing different parts of the world, different lifestyles and cultures can be very eye-opening.

You’re not the only one. But there are a lot of people whose life situation might dictate that choosing a safe FAANG job beats the risk of working for a startup or striking out on their own. Or maybe they just want to work on interesting things, have a good work life balance, and get paid really well.

Your golden handcuffs might be someone else’s golden parachute.

>a safe FAANG job beats the risk of working for a startup or striking out on their own

There's an entire universe of companies, thousands in the US alone, that are not FAANG or a startup, but that employee technical people out there.

Few of them pay what fang pays, though, and even fewer have the same brand recognition. If by 30 she gets bored, with conservative investments into broad market funds, she'll have a few millions in assets and the luxury to choose between a cushy well paid job and maybe starting her own thing.

FAANG companies are good options for foreign engineers because they have a very organized application -> visa -> green card pipeline. If you're interviewing at a small startup, it's very hit or miss whether their legal team will be willing and competent enough to get you into the country safely.

I'd actually recommend small startups for most people, given growth opportunities, but if your primary concern is to get into the US on a permanent basis, it's much safer to apply to a large boring enterprise with a good legal team.

I don’t know why you’re getting the downvotes, this is the reality of the situation. People who already live in the US are in a privileged position and cannot emphasize with this point of view.

I've given up using downvotes on HN as a meaningful measure of information quality. Reflexive users will downvote on keywords. Whatever.

Same.

Organized application -> visa -> blackhole (greencard). If you see recent greencard backlog timelines for the categories most engineers are on, only first two steps are more realistic. :-)

And yes, very well done Dalia, good luck and best wishes!

They're fine for non-Indian/non-Chinese.

doing both of the shitty things you’re describing at a FAANG right now, and I started during the pandemic

yeah, it’s way less enjoyable and fulfilling than previous jobs at small companies and startups, but:

- i have total control of my workhours, and i can work no more than 40 hours if i want to

- i get paid WAY more, and raises/promotions are nearly six figures worth of increased TC, instead of 1-10%

- i have clear career progression, and an actual mentoring system for once

- dont have to worry about my employer running out of money

- dont have to worry about getting fired with no notice or warning

- I’m more likely to get the things I want / ask for

- teammates are nicer and more competent

- ~prestige~

basically everything is better except the work itself. it’s a trade im willing to make

If you're a foreigner it's much harder to get sponsored by a smaller company. I know a bunch of people are essentially "locked in" to FAANG until they get their green card and are chomping at the bit to work on more exciting things.

Also I think there's a shine to FAANG from the outside (if you're young and/or don't know the area)

Count your blessings that you can see things as they are, but also remember your perspective

> If you're a foreigner it's much harder to get sponsored by a smaller company. I know a bunch of people are essentially "locked in" to FAANG until they get their green card and are chomping at the bit to work on more exciting things.

I don't believe this, especially not in the current market. Anyone who is actually eager to hire people will be grabbing them up too.

FAANG comp is half a million all liquid. Most places can't afford that sort of comp.

The comment was about being restricted by sponsorship, not pay.

According to public records, the average salary for a visa holder is around 140k at Apple. At that level I wouldn't expect stock and bonus to be particularly earth-shattering, though I'm sure it's nice.

FAANG companies offer a bunch of things:

* Excellent pay

* Good benefits

* Stability

* Prestige (looks good on resume/opens doors later)

* Smart coworkers

* Huge customer bases

* Lots of internal transfer opportunities

* Well established competence in handling foreign hires

Now, obviously plenty of companies offer a lot of those things too...but not many offer all of them.

And even then, often there's the visibility issue: maybe there's a bunch of ~200 person companies that do, in fact, offer the same things -- but will {Random Engineer X} actually be aware of that? With a company like Google, where I work, there's been enough written about it to have a decent idea of what you're getting into before you even apply. Discoverability is a bigger challenge with smaller companies.

What's your shortlist of companies you would recommend to new grads?

Don't go by a list of companies.

Look for a place that works on something you care about and allows you to apply and build your skills.

That's pretty much something a grown up has to figure out individually.

Not really. What matters is whether the company has the political power to get you a VISA in a modern country.

Every grown up has figured it out.

Not everybody needs a VISA. Not every company is in the US.

F and G are off my list because they're detrimental to society and individuals. G offered me hundreds of thousands of dollars, any department, and to design my own role, but I turned them down for the 8th time.

Apple and Amazon are wobblers depending on what type of role, the impact you're trying to have, and the benefits vs. harm you think they make.

Netflix is essentially harmless because they're a TV and movie store.

It's very tempting to go for the big salary and benefits package, but then having to rationalize, normalize, or compartmentalize the fact that the business makes billions at the expense of harming society. It should ultimately make the employee feel guilty if they're honest and paying attention, but should give pause if it doesn't.

If I could make a steadier living (enough clients with periodic, on-going needs) at SRE/DevOps tech and management consulting, I would never work for any company other than my own.

Younger people should consider working for large organizations to get immersed in that field if they're looking to go the consulting or related enterprise startups route later.

So unnecessary to be this sanctimonious.

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