I thought Tesla was a “green” company. Elon, this sucks | Hacker News Reader

I thought Tesla was a “green” company. Elon, this sucks

digiconomist.net

28 pointsmassinstall31 comments

While i'm not some Elon maniac, I think these people need to stop eating, because that is more environmentally unfriendly.

i wonder what the difference between eating and using bitcoin could possibly be..

I really don't understand how any company creating batteries from lithium can be considered "green".

Why is that? Is lithium worse in a relative sense than other battery chemistries, or fossil fuels?

I didn't compare Tesla to another car company, I just stated that I don't think this is "green".

But if you're going to buy a car you can rank your choices by how green they are. A Hummer is comparatively less green than most choices. A Tesla is comparatively more green, arguably. Regardless of whether you agree, that is one of their main selling points. I would think this is obvious and well known.

> A Tesla is comparatively more green, arguably.

Arguably? The Teslas are "recycled" by shipping them to the middle east, which then "recycle" them by shipping them to pakistan, india, etc., which ten "recycle" them by dumping the lithium batteries into their rivers.

I don't see how this is, by any measure of "greeness" greener than a Hummer, since first of all, a hummer can run in those countries for 100 years and is easy to repair (as opposed to "repairing" a lithium battery, which is essentially impossible), and second, even if you were to dump a Hummer into a river, that's not as horrible as just literally dumping lithium.

Elon originally funded Tesla because he thought the world was going to run out of oil, not for environmental reasons.

I'd consider the world's oil reserves to be part of the environment!

>>or 52,255 hours of watching Youtube

1 billion hours of YouTube are watched per day... so Bitcoin is ~20,000x greener than YouTube consumption?

The layout is a bit confusing, but that's the amount of energy used for a single transaction.

The title doesn't match the article title...this sucks

Check today's news, Tesla bought $1.5bln in Bitcoin and will accept it as payment from its customers. Bitcoin fans will likely welcome this and laud it as a step forward. Many of them are not informed about the devastating environmental impact of blockchain-based technologies, sadly neither is Elon apparently. Some will simply not care even after having informed themselves. When the next generation begins to ask questions eventually how we could have let this happen, it will be a "big surprise" and we "couldn't have known". Again. The cycle continues...

There are rules on HN for a reason. The title is clickbaity. The author could have just reposted the article with a 2020 title, but chose to clickbait people.

As if USD is green...

"Equivalent to the carbon footprint of 694,893 VISA transactions" That's actually way less than I thought. How much energy does the VISA network expend? Aren't their trillions of transactions per year?

There may be a problem with the way this site is laid out because another thread thought the same thing, but this is the carbon footprint from a single BTC transaction.

It's less than you thought? What did you think it would be and why?

Greater than the energy expenditure of all Visa transactions? This makes it seem more efficient than Visa

You know what sucks? Governments having control of money. Governments will suck you dry of your last cent if they have the slightest reason, regardless of your need to have a bed under a roof and having something to eat. Don't let governments control all money. Even if this was true, it's worth it.

And I don't believe it's true. Are you telling me most Bitcoin miners are paying for mining Bitcoin? I really would like to meet these miners. If a miner wants to be profitable they must use waste electricity - any other electricity, industrial or not, is several multiples too expensive. And I think it's better if waste electricity is used for Bitcoin instead of being dumped.

(I guess the downvoters never had a government take all their money because of unpaid parking tickets?)

> I guess the downvoters never had a government take all their money because of unpaid parking tickets

That's kind of how it works when you don't pay your tickets.

However, I once had to go to court to show proof of insurance that I didn't have when I was pulled over.

I watched as all these people showed up, pleaded no contest and the judge gave them like 50% off what they owed. You would think you would get a discount if you paid out of court, but no, you can force extra/busy work on the courts and you get to pay less. Being a pain in the ass can save you money.

Speeding tickets, red light tickets - sure there can be innocents. But parking tickets - the ticketed are almost always guilty.

Of all the things to complain about regarding the government, you probably picked the most legitimate of all in parking enforcement.

I mean, I don't like all the rules and fines, but it's a pretty clear thing and a pretty clear fine & collection process.

Everyone knows you can get your car booted too.

Sure, and I eventually paid up, that's alright. It's not alright to force me to sleep in a car and wash under a hose behind a gas station, and to look for change in coffee automats. I actually would've paid faster if I had money for my food and rent, as I would've been able to work normally.

Did you go to court? Or just not pay for a long time? You said "take all your money". Was that indirect due to the fine amount or are you saying they actively took it (like a garnishment)?

Apart from the hack I mentioned, there are also options if you cannot afford.

Example: in LA they have community service or payment plan options. [1]

[1] https://ladot.lacity.org/projects/parking-in-la/pay-your-par...

I am actually in the great social paradise of European Union. It's not as good here as the EU shills make it out to be, unfortunately; I'd love to be in the USA. My court was automatical and behind my back without any notice, and there wasn't anything I could do after they forced my bank account into negative balance equivalent to median yearly wage. Not sure what the US equivalent of this would be, this is how the EU deals with debts; they will go to whatever they label as your home and take the stuff there if the bank account is too empty, regardless of whose stuff is it - no real way to appeal after it's done. My bank account fortunately paid for half of the debt so they didn't immediately go steal stuff from my parents.

Wow that's terrible how they handle that. What a bad process. That can't happen with your bank accounts for anything in the US unless you had a special judgment against you in court, which is difficult to get, it would take a long time but you'd have the option to contest it or get some leniency.

Typically auto related things are tied to just that - your car could get a boot put on it, could be towed, you could get your license suspended. You accrue fines. But they aren't garnishing any funds from any bank account. And you have recourse in court and other programs if you can't afford it.

I assuming you then live in a country with near no government and it’s a paradise for you

I said "don't let governments control all money", not "abolish governments", there is value in having governments, but it goes bad quickly if they control everything.

Show me that country please.

I would guess that literally no-one else on HN has "had a government take all their money because of unpaid parking tickets". I don't reckon it's as common as you think.

Visit a bar in a not-so-good part of your city (or some bigger city near you, if you live in a small one), it's way too common, just hidden to you. Even I was really surprised how many people are fucked over by the government, and I didn't have the best opinion of it before.

Why do you think BTC means taxes, fees and levies would go away?

I don't. I think BTC means my money won't turn over night without any notice into negative balance equivalent to median yearly wage. Nothing wrong about paying taxes and fees if there's enough money for the most basic necessities.

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