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Comment by sandworm101 | Hacker News Reader

Air outside is -40. Windchill brings that to -57. My work is shutting down all activities that require being outside for more than a couple minutes. Forget the health benefits, until it warms up I am not going to walk anywhere other than to my car. Even that can be dangerous at these temperatures.

https://weather.gc.ca/warnings/index_e.html

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It is still doable if you want to take the time to figure out the clothing. Modern clothing technology means you can even be comfortable when doing so. I live in one of the scary red areas on that map (-31C) and spent a fairly nice couple of hours out walking around this morning. ... and yes, there was significant windchill... which mostly made for some weirdness with ice on my eyelashes.

Running is different in that you might manage to freeze your respiratory passages and then have a cough. Walking is pretty much hazard free.

There's still the significant risk of being stranded, or equipment failure. Your life literally depends on those boots and gloves. Most folks do not value a walk enough to take that risk?

What sort of failure mode could a boot or glove have to leave you in serious trouble? It is not something that anyone ever has to worry about. Most people don't walk out of reasonable range of civilization. It takes a fairly long time to actually freeze to death.

People that do somehow walk out of range of civilization on a casual walk will usually be in range of a cell tower.

Slip, fall, break/sprain/tear something or crack your head due to lack of traction.

Unexpected falling is a fairly quick way to sustain a heavy impact long-term injury, and you can even die.

As noted in another comment, get microspikes or something like that and use a pole and you're plenty safe. I mean, you could fall down a flight of steps at home too. It definitely takes a bit more effort to head out if there's a bunch of snow and/or ice on the ground--which has led to me being a bit lazy since the last snowfall--but it's really not dangerous if you're properly dressed (though I would probably draw the line at current northern Midwest temperatures for a few days--though I have the gear for it).

This is maybe practical if you’re walking as a dedicated activity, but how many people are going to be using that kind of gear for, say, a trip to the corner store? Slip and fall danger is quite great, and can strike you in places you least expect it, like say a patch of black ice on your standard dark asphalt parking lot. It would be quite odd for me to bring a walking pole on my 30 minute walking commute to work.

This reminds me of comments that pedestrians should wear high-vis clothing if they don’t want to be hit by cars, as if high-vis clothing isn’t an explicit step outside of norms regarding clothing.

It's stuff I keep in my car in the winter and I'll use it if conditions warrant. Now it's true that, if you live in a city or are just walking someplace from your car in a parking lot, you probably won't and you're just careful. (Though I would absolutely use a pole if sidewalks were bad enough.) And, yes, people do sometimes slip and fall on ice and they sometimes break bones, etc. But I'm not sure what the alternative here is. If you need to go to the corner store or walk to work, you need to go to the corner store or walk to work. You can't hibernate all winter.

You can certainly limit your exposure. I switch my walk to work to a bus on overly cold days. The first comment in this thread literally describes doing this:

> Forget the health benefits, until it warms up I am not going to walk anywhere other than to my car. Even that can be dangerous at these temperatures.

If you need special equipment, you are not getting people to do long walks in winter conditions.

> You can't hibernate all winter.

People reduce all kinds of outdoor activity in winter, and depending on where you live you may have spent an entire year limiting what you do outside.

Wiping out is a skill. Learn it so you don't have to life your life in fear of something as basic as walking.

Lots of cell phone batteries stop working when they get cold enough; if you're going to rely on your cell to keep you safe it's a good idea to test it in the cold before doing so.

The one thing I'd probably recommend to someone going out in the woods or certainly climbing a hill/mountain where they might be exposed to wind is to carry a spare pair of mittens/shells in cold weather. They're warmer if their hands get cold and they're backup if a glove manages to blow away or get wet.

Anecdata: my sister got off the bus with her 7-yo son as rain began to fall. In seconds it was impossible to walk on the sidewalk. They resorted to walking on grass lawns, then at each driveway she would get her son to crouch and she would push him sliding across then run and glide. It took an hour to go 2 blocks.

A failure in a traction device (she didn't have any) can leave you seriously stranded. Yak trax are very popular, but they fail routinely. I carry a spare set in my truck.

The weather is more unpredictable than we can imagine.

A few years ago, I got into Montreal just as a light freezing drizzle was starting. And something similar. A bit later that evening, you could barely walk on the sidewalk. And unfortunately neither of us had brought our microspikes.

>A failure in a traction device

I have had a microspike fail--fortunately just out my door. But it's mostly not the end of the world. Especially if you also have a pole you can manage pretty well with traction just on one foot under most circumstances.

How about the boot sole hardening and then splitting, exposing the bottom of the foot with each step? I had that happen to a ski boot once.

I regularly ski without backup gear and with quality gear even falls haven’t been an issue. I’m not sure what kind of failure could occur within a short walk of home that would be life threatening.

Maybe I’m not being imaginative enough.

You might be fine when walking at -31, but much below that a fall can be lethal. The snow is different at -40, stiffer and more slippery. Slip and knock your head, or simply roll an ankle, and the 300 yards to the next door will seem like miles. They have cancelled schools. They don't want the kids outside waiting for busses.

That's not right. At these temperatures even glare ice is quite grippy. The snow gets stiff. The only real downside si that the snow squeaks when you step on it. It can be sort of loud.

Tell that to my boots. The snow is rock solid. Thier treds dont cut in. Whereas a week ago i could walk, now i am sliding between biuldings. I walked about 500m between biuldings at -42 today. My boots were hardening. By the end it felt like walking in ski boots. Very slippery.

I lived in Whitehorse, Yukon for 4 years.

Every single day of the year I rode my bike to work, but more importantly I took a walk at midday to get sun on my face and some fresh air.

The few days I didn't get sun on my face in the winter I noticed how grumpy I was later in the day and how horrible I felt by the time I got home.

Even at -44C (before wind chill) I loved walking along the river, watching the ice twist and turn and eventually breakup. I loved having the library as a destination - it was about a 10-15 minute walk, then I could hangout inside for 20 minutes to checkout books and warm up before the walk back to the office.

You'll be fine, just wear the right gear.

Ditto. I grew up in Fairbanks, AK, and it was no big deal. You just put on the appropriate clothing and kept doing your thing.

Bought a treadmill for this reason.

Thats why Canada has so many malls. :)

But the Segway will revolutionize human transport! Because everyone lives where the weather is always nice!

But cars are evil, because we should ride our bikes more! Because everyone lives where it's always nice!

How dare you inhabit a piece of the planet other than southern California? The audacity! The hubris! The reality intruding on my bullshit platitudes!

If you look outside my office you will see 200+ cars in the parking lots. Each one of them has a cord plugging them into a dedicated outlet. But not one of them is charging. There is probably more electricity going into our parking lot outlets than to all of our computers and lights inside.

Sure, you can always find exceptions.

But 1000 of 1200 kids ride their bikes to this school in Finland, in -17C weather: https://unofficialnetworks.com/2019/11/20/kids-in-finland-ri...

The people advocating for more biking aren't saying everyone everywhere at every time should ride bikes. They're saying more people, in more places, at more times, should.

Agree. And at the higher end of the temperature spectrum, I've commuted on my bike all through the summer in Austin, Texas, when the temps are routinely 40-43C. Not for everyone, as I had a place to shower and change when I got sweaty, but more <6 mile trips could be made by bike.

>But cars are evil, because we should ride our bikes more! Because everyone lives where it's always nice!

I thought so as well until I saw this video about cycling in Finland. Looks super doable. Rain on the other hand ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uhx-26GfCBU

Yes, g-d forbid the rest of us ride scooters to work because a few people live in Whitehorse. One need not live in SoCal to avoid the use of a car in winter. I lived in Indiana and managed it. Hell, people in Whitehorse manage it, for that matter. (EDIT: well, there ya go: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=26067682)

Yeah, Southern California, the only place in the world with nice weather. Aren't you forgetting tropical Netherlands and Denmark? That's why they bike so much.

During my time in SV people seemed to always apologize when the weather wasn't perfect. They apologized when it was too "hot" barely breaking 80F and too cold when it got below 50F. Personally, "perfect" weather was depressing as all hell because seasons are actually awesome and help you keep track of time passing by. I'll never forget how much people on the east coast (especially boston) treasure the few summer months where you can be outside.

I ride my bike here in Copenhagen like so many others and it's pretty far from SoCal temperatures.

Weather isn't the biggest determinant of cycling usage (and that probably applies to walking too):

"Why Canadians can't bike in the winter but Finnish people can"

https://youtu.be/Uhx-26GfCBU

The scene with the line of tiny bikes parked outside the school in the middle of winter is particularly striking.

I've biked through all weathers but even for me that seems like something that wouldn't be possible, but apparently is with a bit of organisation.

I grew up biking to elementary school in Sweden year around and it did not seem like a big deal. Just make sure to dress for the weather. I remember wearing overalls or ski pants when it got real cold. Snow days were also not a thing. I don't remember a single weather cancellation.

The funny thing is I live further south now and when I go back to visit in the winter, it feels ridiculously cold.

This reads as if you yourself have never been outside SoCal, and don't realize that people bike everywhere in the world.

This kind of bitter, sarcastic tone is annoying enough on HN, and you aren't even challenging the parent, but agreeing with him by setting up strawmen of the opposing side.

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