Comment by bonoboTP | Hacker News Reader

Comment by bonoboTP | Hacker News Reader

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It's a great "mind-bown" insight story, but just not true. People do judge each other and have opinions and put them in little mental boxes all the time. Impressions matter and can make or break your life. For example, anyone who used to be fat and then loses weight can attest that it matters what others think of you and they do think things. It's comfortable and uplifting and "wise" to say that nobody cares but they do. People assess their relative status and success all the time by comparing with others.

Now this doesn't mean you have to go crazy trying to satisfy everyone because you can't. People want contradictory things from you. You need to have your own moral or other principles to keep on track of a certain path in the face of rejection. But if everyone thinks you're an asshole, the answer isn't to just ignore everyone.

I think a better lesson is that it's better to have some haters and some who really like you than to have everyone be lukewarm about you and ignore you. The haters are no big issue unless they are really determined enemies, and the upside of the truly appreciative people is bigger. You can only get true deep connections if you accept the risk that some people won't like you. As long as you try to please everyone you won't really please anyone. See the story of the miller and his son.

>It's a great "mind-blown" insight story, but just not true. People do judge each other and have opinions and put them in little mental boxes all the time

Yes, we all understand that people stereotype. I think you're getting bogged down in the details and missing the overall point, which is far more generalized. The above story is meant to be short and clever, and to do so it glosses over a few things that you're meant to pick up contextually. The point it's trying to make is this:

20 year olds tend to think people are watching, judging, and remembering their every move and are concerned about it

40 year olds still tend to think they're being watched and judged, but don't care

60 year olds realize that everyone is too busy thinking about their own situation to really pay much attention to others beyond superficial stereotyping, and that unless you affect someone deeply with your presentation, they won't likely cling to previous judgements of you.

And this observation does have empirical backing and is known as the “Spotlight Effect”. The more careful definition of it (which I agree is not the point of the pithy story) is “People tend to overestimate the degree to which others notice them and their failings.”

(Caveat that I haven’t looked into how deeply this has survived the psych and social psych replication crisis)

For sure. You are the protagonist of your own movie but a supporting role in other people's or even just an extra.

If you think people think about you all the time, then you benefit from the message of this story about the 20, 40, 60 year olds.

But don't take it too literally. It matters how you present yourself and what impressions you leave.

The good news is, you have to be really really bad to leave a long lasting bad impression (except if you personally screw someone over or cheat against them even in minor ways - people tend to remember that) and failed but honest attempts to get ahead don't tend to compound, but success does compound. Meaning it's worth playing a numbers game and diversifying your potential outcomes. A good impression can lead to a lot of value for years to come, a bad impression often simply means you can try again elsewhere with added experience.

Maybe they are all right. The twenty year olds think their peers are judgmental because they are judgmental. And so on.

Yeah I think part of it is the attitude/illusion that the stakes used to be were lower earlier in life. Like, "oh how cute, they are sweating so much about petty things like teenage love and fitting in cliques, if only they knew how much it doesn't matter in the grand scheme of things"

But it does matter a lot in those years. Teens are correct in their assessment that fitting in is important. At least in some group. Doesn't have to be the "popular kids". As you grow up, achievements and status become more manifest, it's not so much about pretenses. Things are now more cemented and move slower. You have this or that profession with a certain status. You live in a good or a bad neighborhood, move in fancy or non fancy circles, can afford traveling or not, and so on. By contrast in your teens and early adulthood, all you have is how you perform in social interaction. Later you're like "maybe I'm awkward but I'm a surgeon and you're a fast food worker".

And when you're 60, the status fights are mostly over, you're living off of what you achieved earlier. So you think it was useless because now you have little to lose in future potential. You mostly have your familial and friendship situation cemented for the rest of your life, usually no more worry about who will marry you, whether you can be promoted high, whether your kids turn out good etc. Typically 60+ year olds don't have to prove themselves in the moment any more, they just ride on the past.

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