Just curious how the year has started for people looking for a new role.
leetcode problems are silly but company us them as filters because they don't know any better but on the "Brightside" only take 1 o 2 hours of your life.
take-home challenges are worse because they require more hours to completed and sometimes companies just ghost or reject you without giving you any feedback.
By far the best way to skip all that nonsense has been with referrals, I believe its because if the new guy underperformed they can just blame the one who referred him
They didn't understand why anyone would design a system like that and asked if I had the choice again, would I build it the same way. Their correct answer was micro-services up the wazoo.
I tried to explain that startups don't have budget or desire for massive infrastructure or are generally only interested in building a prototype to validate product market fit. Wasting money on ivory tower systems was a waste.
At no time did they ask if the system supported the workload or even how many users we had. Nope straight to build massively complex infra.
I've forgotten that a lot of s/w engineers who work in the real world/large companies, don't have any idea some of the pg mantras we all chant.
Major red flag. Pass. :/
To pass tech interview, I have to do some stupid super-hard hackerrank algorithm test for front-end react positions. wtf?
When he told me to do this and I got annoyed and asked him if they every found the need to design an algo which expired cache, with greater than 10 items, when it's a full moon but not if the number 42 was in a md5 of one of the items.
I asked, isn't this like every other job which is mostly pull from the db, group and minimally process it, push it onto the front page and then spend 80% of the time faffying with vertical-aligning annoying css.
He laughed, but still got me to do the hackerrank algo.
Real motivating to do my own thing. :/
I've also never personally experienced the tech trope of being in high demand, getting multiple great offers or amazing salary/perks. It seems a lot more uphill than the exepriences that other people share online.
Interviewing people over the past 25 years, not at FAANG level, but Fortune 1000 down to VC funded startups, I can put people into three buckets. Bucket one is people who clearly don't make the cut. Bucket two is people who seem to have basic skills and knowledge, but when you drill down they don't understand things in depth. Bucket three are people clearly head and shoulders above the other two groups. I would say if interviewing six people, one winds up in bucket one, one winds up in bucket three, and the rest wind up in bucket two.
Bucket two people are interchangeable - you see they have been working for a while, you feel they can handle the simple tickets needed - but what about the more complex ones?
That is one problem with being in this group - of the last six interviews, four others were just like you. Unless they have a recommendation, there is no incentive to hire them. Because out of every six interviews, you usually find someone who can answer almost every question in more depth than the five others.
I think this is the model to have in your head. If your manager's manager has 36 Javascript developers under him, if you're not in the top 6, you're not going to be a "high demand, getting multiple great offers or amazing salary/perks".
Of course the times have an effect on these things to, the bar is lowered and raised. Some people used to make six figures doing stuff in Adobe Flash, and then demand for that dries up and the smart ones have jumped onto the new thing. Things can go both ways at once. Your local job market may have dried up some, but the country might be more willing to hire remote-for-the-next-few-months right now. Although that could have good and bad effects.
The wrong approach is to go on an interview and think you passed or failed some bar. The correct approach is to imagine five people like you, all working your job, four of whom can get basic things done and have basic knowledge. You have to clearly have a better depth of knowledge than all of them, your code samples have to be more up to date and complete and better than theirs, your 30 minute code solutions have to be better etc. You're competing with five other people, four of whom have basic competence, and you have to clearly distinguish yourself from them. That is how you reach the "high demand, getting multiple great offers or amazing salary/perks" category.
Some of these things (like schooling & previous jobs) can end up being strong positive feedback loops.
Confidence and presentation matters, ability to 'connect' or emphasise with the inteviwer matters, all questions are asked from a certain, somewhat contrived point of view, and if you don't get what they are looking for you won't do well. I was looking for a job in 2019, and at first did very poorly - I came across as a nervous schoolkid. Over time I got better at interviews just by doing more inteviews and praciting writing code fast in front of other people. None of those skills translate to my daily job in any way.
Me neither, but then again I'm not a great programmer and I haven't gotten the opportunity to live in any "hot" markets. I've applied to jobs all over the country in the past though.
Also for me (maybe such insights could help you) I just last year finally started discovering what makes me tick and get excited as a programmer and nowadays I am seeking for jobs that scratch those itches. Feels great and I no longer feel like an impostor.
It's kind of like dating really. People can spend a lot of time thinking something is wrong with them while in reality you simply haven't stumbled upon the right people.
Don't underestimate yourself. I am sure you can do a lot and make a true difference.
Really, it just monetizes some equalization of the power/information assymmetry between applicant and employer. I know I would have paid easily over $100/mo during my last job search to know wtf was happening with each of my applications, even if it was just getting turned down. The black hole is such a waste of resources.
Or, at least, something like that.
By show of hands, if I build it this weekend who's willing to pay and how much?
I have applied to around 100 positions, had three interviews and countless form rejection letters.
I am stuck working remotely or in the city I am in now so understand its been hard but I am just about to the point where I think I will not have a real "career" in my lifetime. I fluctuate between blaming my poor choice in going into the life sciences and the "economy" in general. Between unemployment, food stamps and living at my parents things are going pretty well but have basically given up on finding a meaningful job.
General Mills is looking for bioinformatics types as well if you want to stay in the crop field. They may let you work remote.
Banks/Insurance are also looking for data science / programmer types if you want to go that way.
Every year I put in my resume at the lowest most junior software engineering role I can find at FAANG, but I never get passed the resume stage despite the fact that I have a bachelor/master in computer science and 2 years of working experience (1 in teaching web dev, 1 in software engineering). I guess it must be that I'm in Europe/European, it's tougher there? I applied for European places too.
I also applied to non-FAANG companies with its own issues (e.g. companies not replying or sending 40 hour code challenges), but it just hurts that I never got a test even by the companies I always wanted to work at when I was still at uni.
Because of that, I lost the whole "you're a new graduate!" thing and it made me directionless. Before Covid I applied for jobs for 1 year and failed. Then I got a job, which was amazing and I was really grateful for. Unfortunately, the founders felt I was too entrepreneurial and didn't stick enough to being just a programmer (note: I programmed 90% of the time) and had a big culture clash because of it, so I left. I can't work at a place where I know that I don't fit in the culture. Now I'm on the hunt again.
The whole process makes me feel inadequate while I know I'm not! I know a thing or two and have even way more to learn, that does not mean I'm inadequate. I was one of the most motivated students at uni, because I love an intellectual challenge and love working for a bright future. While I still cherish my love for intellectual challenges, I am not working for a bright future anymore. I don't see one.
I'm going to take this data and come up with some solutions that benefits everybody with regards to interviewing and hiring. Everything I receive and put together I'll post somewhere for everyone. I have about 24 people so far. I'd love to get to 40 even.
Everything is anonymous.
https://forms.gle/7oZjGpbq7LtmG1xc8
_Note: I believe some of the questions are difficult to understand and I think there's one repeat question. I'm cleaning it up. Even if you could just do the initial questions (a handful of them), it's super helpful_
I found that five years of experience in "programming" didn't qualify me for jobs that wanted three years of Angular, or Spring, or seven years total. I've still never had an interview with a programming test except my very first one that had FizzBuzz.
My best opportunities so far have come via LinkedIn recruiters, believe it or not. One recruiter got me interviews with two companies before the end of December. I had a code challenge and second interview with one of them, so pretty far in the interview process.
Otherwise looking at job boards like Indeed and LinkedIn listings. Some good opportunities there but I feel like applying is almost a waste of time. I almost never hear back. LinkedIn has a feature where it emails you if your application was even looked at, and I rarely get those emails. I got one outright rejection but otherwise just ignored.
I've also been targetting companies in related work to my previous experience or companies I would be interested in working for but none seem to be hiring.
I don't think there's any single silver bullet answer to job hunting, just have to try every avenue you can to dig up opportunities.
I wish I was better at networking.
They gave me a technical interview recently which I felt I aced. Only for me to go read the question again I realised that what I felt was just supposed to manipulate an object could actually be a file that they meant.
I'm yet to hear from them, it's been almost 2wks now. But ever since that realisation my confidence has gone done like crazy.
ATM want to focus on building projects with minimal Algo tests on the side. Gets tiresome solving Leetcode all the time.
good luck out there, guys.
Otherwise, that's kind of part of the problem IMO.
Would you consider them if they remove things from their CV to appear less qualified (not illegal, unlike adding imaginary things)? Or is it purely about age?
(Honest questions, as I might be in this position in very few years).
Anyways, what’s a polite way to say that to a new person that you just got involved with? You just avoid it to begin with, nothing personal.
Someone in leadership also has needs. They need a team that respects and looks up to them. If they hire someone that clearly has a better resume, this is just not going to work. They can’t tell the recruiter ‘no, I can’t interview this person’ because usually the resume is good enough for a phone screen, so they go through the process.
But the answer is always simple.
Not generally true. I've worked with people with management experience who got a chance as junior programmers (after getting tired from managing or not finding another job). They were incredibly loyal, nice, and easy to work with and manage. I've also worked with arrogant intolerable people with zero experience.
Overqualification is really just a bad factor to consider.
- The applicant has relevant experience
- He/She is interested in moving forward (they did apply for this job, and not some other higher-paying job)
The rest is just human bias and lazy HR.
No, the guy who did 3 years at Google is not more likely to be less committed to this position that he applied to. You don't know anything about him or his circumstances.
You assume. I'm not against taking a statistically-based decision, but you don't even have the statistics. Juniors often enough job-hop while the guy with experience may actually know what he is getting into and have a reason to do so (I also don't have the statistics, and that's why I won't filter fresh grads...).
Although I probably wouldn't apply for a junior position. I'd at least apply for a senior role.
I assume most of these are bot.
Amazon keeps sending emails to do their automated tests... nothing different.
4 interviews with different companies
6 total rejection emails
0 job offers
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Email in profile...
Recruiters will sell you to the client, and help during rate negotiations. Good luck!
I think this is pretty good advice honestly, I have had some great opportunities pitched to me by recruiters from LinkedIn.
Really it's about at the same ratio I would find jobs I'm interested in on job boards so I'm fine with it.
Me: Why they unnecessarily need it to complex?