Hacker News Reader

Comment by patall | Hacker News Reader

This kind of article has caused my father, who hasnt seen any snow this winter so far, to buy two new snow shovels for my grandmother (who has not seen any ground snow either and already has a dedicated snow shovel and a plower). When I asked 'why', he told me he read of a 'professional' snow shoveler who has multiple shovels for different types of snow. Meanwhile, in my area we are snow coverred for two weeks now (pretty standard around here) and pretty much everyone in the neighboorhood has a single shovel and a vanilla broom for the task.

Yeah, we have seen the pictures from Madrid but come-on, you dont have to prepare like its gonna be 6 feet of snow tomorrow.

View on HN

It's very interesting to contrast how different regions handle extreme (to that region) weather. I was raised in the UK where 10cm of snow pretty much means the country is shut down for a week (interestingly the same happens in 'extreme heat' of 30c).

Where I live now there was 30cm of snow in the last couple of days and everyone is happy and playing outside, and tomorrow will be work as usual (well for covid). Most major roads have been swept, and those that aren't you just drive a little more careful. I guess there is a different level of preparedness (here you are required by law to have winter tires on your car), but still it seems like some places treat it as an end-of-the-world scenario as if it's impossible for humans to live like that.

Same here. I live in North East Scotland, but have spent a lot of time in Norway with work over the past 20 years (I'm actually closer to Norway than to London!). If there's so much as a sprinkling of snow over here, airports shut down and there are car crashes everywhere - meanwhile in Norway, it's business as usual. Also in Norway, if you have a car you must by law fit winter tyres during snow season.

It sounds crazy that relatively affluent nations/cities can't handle snow, but at least here in the DC area in the US, there are a few good reasons...

1. While we do get snow every winter, it tends to be mixed with icy rain, not the powdery stuff you get in more northern climates. What tends to happen is a bit of snow will fall overnight, then go into a melt/flash-freeze cycle as the temperature hovers around freezing.

2. Because it only snow (with any major accumulation) once or twice a season, there isn't a huge incentive to invest in more snow removal equipment. The state DOT handles major roads, but neighborhoods are largely left to clear their own snow. My last neighborhood had a contract with a construction company from out of the region for major snow - they'd drive up their trucks (with plows attached) and set up camp at the edge of the area for a few days, then go home.

3. DC is highly transient. Lots of drivers who simply don't have much experience driving in snow.

4. Public transit is terrible. So, everybody tries to go to work, and if their only car is a Corvette, so be it. And of course, they spin it into a ditch as soon as they try to get on the highway.

Even a rear wheel drive sports car can do well in the snow if it has stability control and you put good snow tires on it (and take things gradually).

Sporty cars in the US are often sold with summer tires. I'm quite sure many consumers don't realize how much difference a good all-season or winter tire makes in snow.

> While we do get snow every winter, it tends to be mixed with icy rain, not the powdery stuff you get in more northern climates

A good point, I've noticed that too - despite how close we are, the snow in Norway always seems different, more powdery and less slushy.

That's because the weather in Norway is predictable. It doesn't snow heavily once every few years, it snows heavily most years. So there are systems and equipment in place to deal with it. And drivers have experience of difficult conditions.

The UK is mostly temperate, but occasionally it isn't. Buying snowploughs and using them once every five years is a difficult ask for constrained council budgets, and drivers might get a couple of weeks of heavy snow every few years in which to practice their not-sliding-into-other-cars skills.

Right, if considering south of the border, but here in NE Scotland, at least a little snow from Jan-Mar is pretty common. So we're used to it, have snowploughs, gritters and plane de-icers, but somehow drivers still drive like idiots, and airports etc still can't cope ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

scottish snow plows have absolutely hilarious names. they've recently gone somewhat viral on twitter.

https://scotgov.maps.arcgis.com/apps/webappviewer/index.html...

At least in Germany it's quite normal that people totally loose all their driving skills on the first day of snow in the winter.

Somehow they get them back quickly within days. Or those with difficulties driving in the snow stay at home, not sure what it is.

Years ago my average commute in the evening was 25min or so, with the first snow of the season, this was upped to 3.5h.

Growing up in New Hampshire, you had to pray for 18-24" of snow overnight to get off school...

Desperately listening to the radio as they read off the list of school closures was the local sport :-P

I grew up in Suffolk and probably be a foot mark until school was off, kids today though, in London 1" and it's in stone near on. But health and safety along with insurance like liability insurance would of been a factor in that shift. Kinda like how many schools don't do rugby due to insurance costs - a factor when I was a child that changed in the early 80's. I'm sure been many more legal and liability factors added into the the overhead of managing and running a school.

Heck, with climate change 1" is probably the equivalent to a foot of snow half a decade ago. I jest, though probably not far of the mark.

One aspect of the UK is when we have snow, it's been a long time since the last snowfall and drivers will have time to adjust and in that time, things happen. This is true of first snow in all countries, though in many, they have had more experience.

The other factor is the UK road system is kinda densely used with many bottlenecks already and any factor will quickly increase that, so a few flakes will see drivers over or under compensate causing a ripple that can turn into waves very quickly.

But it's always fun. The dynamics of the UK weather sure do make for interesting repercussions and whilst those same dynamics play out in other countries, they are more stable and more adjusted to such things.

Just look at how lock-downs impact area's, peoples habits changing suddenly has ripple effects and in the UK - toilet roll is serious business.

Another way to view it is - a covering of snow, even less than 1CM in London is headline news in the UK. You probably have to look at Miami to get a comparable response to snow.

Doesn’t the polar vortex make it “too cold” for snow?

The too cold for snow is based upon most cold being from high pressure in the UK at least and with that you don't get the moisture in the air - snow in the UK is mostly a clash of warm/cold are battling from Europe and the Atlantic. Hence we see most snow with good cold easterly and battling lows comming in hitting that cold air.

But as a child I too always questioned the saying "too cold for snow", the high pressure aspect is why as a rule of thumb, it works for the UK, but always exceptions to rules.

Wait a couple of years, or maybe four, nah, let's say 10, or 20, probably close to 30 and snow will be a thing of the past. Better say, 50. OK, by 2100.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com