Jet Powered Volkswagen Beetle – $550k (sunnyvale) | Hacker News Reader

Jet Powered Volkswagen Beetle – $550k (sunnyvale)

sfbay.craigslist.org

303 pointsd136o105 comments

I don't want to start another "SF vs Miami/Austin rest of the US" but! An awesome thing in the Bay-Area is all the insane stuff you get on eBay and Craigslist. I bought a Velodyne VLP-16 LIDAR for my mobile robot side project and met up with a guy in SF. He had a startup that ended up using vision only so they sold off their LIDARs.

Was that guy also building self landing rockets by any chance?

I've gotta' be honest, this post makes me miss my time living in the Bay Area, Los Altos specifically.

I don't think I'll ever live anywhere else again where one neighbor couldn't fit his new McLaren 720s in his 70's ranchburger garage after a brief drizzle or my other neighbor who no joke - had a red VW bug with a bumper sticker that read "Ham Radio Saves Lives".

> An awesome thing in the Bay-Area is all the insane stuff you get on eBay and Craigslist.

I don't browse craiglist much, but I buy a bunch of retro computing / telecom / lab equipment stuff on ebay and the coolest stuff is always local pickup only on the west coast I swear.

This varies by industry of course... the Bay Area is definitely the best place to score computing and electronics related stuff. But southern CA has way more aerospace stuff, New England (especially CT and MA) have a lot of precision instrumentation and manufacturing equipment, and for stuff like robots and heavy duty metalworking machinery you really want to be in the Rust Belt.

I haven't found much precision instrumentation or manufacturing stuff on MA craigslist. The MIT Swap Meet used to be THE place for that thing but the past couple years I've gone its all junk. I wonder if there is a new venue to find those things?

When I read the headline, the first thing I thought was "definitely in California." Not even a question.

It's funny that you say this because kindof "the" people who make jet powered cars are in Florida, not San Francisco: https://www.elainelarsen.com/

Yeah, but they're not going to use a Beetle are they? :)

For ex: Jet Dragster Competition

https://youtu.be/8voAgRcKfaU?t=562

The sort of thing that makes me love America (yes I know EU people they feature them in other countries).

Now I have to ask, what kind of side project requires such a high quality sensor?

I think particular robot side projects, if you can afford it, make use of LIDAR partly because it makes dealing with things much easier than the amount of time invested attempting a vision-based system.

It's been a long time but I remember lidar being common (or at least a divide between rich/poor college clubs) a decade ago in competitions like http://www.igvc.org/

Oh definitely. I brought one of the first stereoscopic camera robots there. It was very clear we werent in the same financial support league but we did well I think our second year on there.

One of my favorite pastimes during COVID has been browsing the "free" section of the sfbay CL. Some truly weird and confusing things on there.

Miami people don’t have the same hobbies as the rest of the country does. Shipping cross-country is the only way I’ve found to sustain the hobbies I picked up in other parts of the country.

Wait 'till you see what he's got planned next: http://www.ronpatrickstuff.com/images/SCOOTE2PScopy.jpg

Wow! I used to ride that model (Honda Metropolitan) scooter to work at Harvard years ago when I lived in Boston.

The guy who owned it before me removed the restrictor so it would zip right up to ~40mph and I thought THAT was a bit too fast for such a little ride.

...can't even imagine what this beast would be like!

There's videos too. https://www.leithcars.com/blogs/1421/lifestyle/jet-powered-v...

Usually when there's an "oddball" or "eccentric" person on, Letterman had his way with them, but I thought Ron more than held his own. Right mix of self-deprecation and confidence.

"It can be a little windy inside with the jet engine running but not too bad. "

Now that is an understatement. Despite all the (self-described) obsessive engineering that went into this, the driver of this beast has the intake of a GE T58-8F helicopter turbine engine less than two feet from their head. HELL NO.

My thoughts exactly

I just emailed the seller (Ron Patrick) saying he is a legend and he replied with, "Then I went to Stanford for the PhD but the real reason to come here was to start a company and make lots of money so I could play around and build stupid things. / It worked out pretty well. I never had to work for anyone. Started my company (www.ecm-co.com) while at Stanford. / So I want you to go out there and do better that me! I bet you can do it." He is a real legend—really hoping someone will take his car off the market!

I'm out in the Valley quite regularly. People here in Michigan ask me all the time about the difference between the two places outside of weather. This is a prime example.

I've tried real hard but I can't imagine seeing this ad in Detroit. If it happened the press would get ahold of it and make fun of the guy. ;<(

Detroit is an odd example given that it's 'Motor City'. Chrysler built a jet powered car back when the original Beetle was in production. Then again nowadays it's all about FCA putting the biggest engine in every model they can before they die off.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chrysler_Turbine_Car

And the Chrysler turbine actually drove the wheels! Strapping a jet to a car is impressive engineering, no doubt, but mechanical propulsion is a whole different level.

That VW is actually powered by a helicopter turboshaft (a T58) that's been stripped of its shaft drive to just make thrust. In theory one could've driven the wheels.

Except this was a company R&D project not an individual. When I was at Michigan State in the early seventies there was an EE prof who drove a battery powered VW that he built himself in his garage. I thought that it was cool, overwhelmingly everyone else thought he was eccentric.

He told me the entire industry will go electric once someone invents a better battery. He thought it would happen by the year 2000. Sadly he passed away before the birth of Tesla.

More info: http://www.ronpatrickstuff.com/

The next project is a twin jet scooter. How appropriate :)

It looks just as unwise as it sounds :)

https://www.leithcars.com/blogs/1421/wp-content/uploads/2016...

Gotta love the fuel tanks. Exactly how they stood on the shelf at the hardware store.

The jet car craigslist add says he wanted to thrill himself, not kill himself.

I think he might not be satisfied with just thrilling himself any more.

Actually, it's for... his wife!

I love how 90's his webpage is. Void of javascript and css and an earthlink email address.

If I recall correctly this was actually made in the late 90s or early 2000s so the website is period correct, not retro.

> * Update 7/18/06 * You have to give the California Department of Motor Vehicles (the DMV) credit for creativity on this one. A DMV insider has disclosed to me that the DMV has made a formal request to a federal agency to rule if my Beetle constitutes a threat to national security based on what could happen if it got into the wrong hands. This raises three questions in my mind: #1 Does this mean I’m the right hands? #2 If someone with the name "b_laden13" is the highest eBay bidder for my Beetle can I refuse his offer even if he has the prestigious eBay Red Shooting Star feedback rating (the highest)? #3 Would this affect my eBay rating?

Response from the hot rod magazines has been slow. One editor told me that is because I didn't use anything they advertise.

In case anyone didn't already know what gets ink in trade press.

I don't know, I feel like I can talk him down to $500K.

I'm all for awesome engineering projects, in which this project is not deficient, however if this thing can be street legal then I don't understand why so many other cars are not allowed to be.

Even when this thing is working as intended. it's shooting hot flames out the back.

I'm pretty sure it's only street legal while the jet engine is turned off. Then you're just transporting a jet engine on the back of a Beetle, right?

That's what I thought too, but then the post says "That said, I do enjoy the occasional blast down the highway." and suddenly I'm not so sure...

I've also seen a mini-cooper on youtube with a jet in the back doing the same thing on the highway :)

It might be cool from an engineering perspective, but it's fucking stupid from a "there are other people on the road who's lives are now in danger" perspective.

Maybe. There are certainly places where you can find long straight runs of highway with no on ramps. Do that in the middle of the night and you are unlikely to encounter another vehicle.

Go to a racetrack. Unlikely isn't good enough.

I'm sure that's not legal, but then, neither are more conventional blasts down the highway.

>the occasional blast down the highway

if he were to install the engine into the vertical position, he could have enjoyed occasional blast _over_ highway as the thrust of this engine (even without adding turbofan) seems to be just about enough to lift a stripped down VW Beetle.

i mean.... where's the law that says that it's _illegal_?

Noise ordinances would be the easiest way it would be illegal, then hazard zone produced by the jet exhaust is not marked as that zone likely falls under same regulations as carrying a pole or other cargo that extends out back of the vehicle.

It's definitely not street legal... not with the jet engine running at least.

You're not allowed to incinerate the guy behind you when the light turns green.

Advertised as street legal in the post.

Sort of. It's advertised as legal with the gasoline engine. I take it "then, when you want to have some fun" means "when the Police aren't around."

> The idea is that you drive around legally on the gasoline engine then, when you want to have some fun, spin up the jet and get on the burner (you can start the jet while driving along on the gasoline engine).

It has a license plate on it.

Most laws around street legality center around certification of the chassis, safety equipment, and emissions. Don't run the jet engine during a smog test, and prove that all the necessary safety equipment function (signals, airbags, seatbelts, etc), and you're going to pass. This is why most kit cars depend on a "donor" chassis that gets stripped down and have the new car built on top of.

California DMV said this was not street legal

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=faZT8JAq7Qw

> Don't run the jet engine during a smog test

You wouldn't happen to work for a large German automotive company with the letters V and W in the name, would you?

Actually, the jet-powered car in question does just so happen to have those two letters adorning its crest.

I think pretty much anything with lights, brakes, and seatbelts can be street legal as a one-off. The stricter regulations come into play for series production.

Take a look at the Roadkill episode where they made the Monte Carlo and then took it to get registered and the DMV lady came out to inspect in and just walked away after looking at the color scheme. Everything was structurally fine, it just looked beat up with surface rust.

well this jet car is also street legal

https://www.motor1.com/news/131074/jay-leno-ecojet-window-lo...

I'd imagine the majority of cases involve modifications to the existing powertrain and drivetrain, which is highly regulated in California. I think since the original engine is intact and (probably?) unmodified, it can be street legal as long as the jet isn't actually operating.

Any other old-timers remember the "JATO Rocket Car" posting in Dawrin Awards on Usenet? From Wikipedia entry:

You all know about the Darwin Awards – it's the annual honor given to the person who did the gene pool the biggest service by killing themselves in the most extraordinarily stupid way. Last year's winner was the fellow who was killed by a Coke machine which toppled over on top of him as he was attempting to tip a free soda out of it.

And this year's nominee is:

The Arizona Highway Patrol came upon a pile of smoldering metal embedded into the side of a cliff rising above the road at the apex of a curve. the wreckage resembled the site of an airplane crash, but it was a car. The type of car was unidentifiable at the scene. The lab finally figured out what it was and what had happened.

It seems that a guy had somehow gotten hold of a JATO unit (Jet Assisted Take Off – actually a solid fuel rocket) that is used to give heavy military transport planes an extra 'push' for taking off from short airfields. He had driven his Chevy Impala out into the desert and found a long, straight stretch of road. Then he attached the JATO unit to his car, jumped in, got up some speed and fired off the JATO!

The facts, as best could be determined, are that the operator of the 1967 Impala hit JATO ignition at a distance of approximately 3.0 miles [4.8 kilometers] from the crash site. This was established by the prominent scorched and melted asphalt at that location. The JATO, if operating properly, would have reached maximum thrust within five seconds, causing the Chevy to reach speeds well in excess of 350 MPH [560 km/h], continuing at full power for an additional 20–25 seconds. The driver, soon to be pilot, most likely would have experienced G-forces usually reserved for dog-fighting F-14 jocks under full afterburners, basically causing him to become insignificant for the remainder of the event. However, the automobile remained on the straight highway for about 2.5 miles [4.0 km] (15–20 seconds) before the driver applied and completely melted the brakes, blowing the tires and leaving thick rubber marks on the road surface, then becoming airborne for an additional 1.4 miles [2.3 km] and impacting the cliff face at a height of 125 feet [38 m], leaving a blackened crater 3 feet [0.9 m] deep in the rock.

Most of the driver's remains were not recoverable; however, small fragments of bone, teeth and hair were extracted from the crater, and fingernail and bone shards were removed from a piece of debris believed to be a portion of the steering wheel.

Shame it's not true, makes for a good story. https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/carmageddon/

I remember laughing my head off at a dinner party in 1994 when someone told the story.

This was the subject of the first episode of MythBusters.

https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0768480/?ref_=ttep_ep1

>The engine is a General Electric Model T58-8F with some internal modifications and a custom tailpipe.

Car guys always have to have their custom exhausts, don't they? :)

Definitely. It’s a finishing touch that can be cosmetic and also adds your own unique flavor to how the car sounds, so it’s not just visual.

For me, cars have always been just as much about how they sound as well as look and drive. The rumble of a big V8, or a turbocharger spooling up.

I remember seeing this car on car tv shows all time years back. I can't imagine he'll get close to his asking price, but it's still a really amazing piece of engineering and the juxtaposition of a jet sticking out the back of an otherwise stock Beetle will always be fun.

I wonder what it would fetch on BaT since that's kind of more the platform for these weird/unique cars

He’s probably hoping someone like Leno scoops it up after hearing about it in the news

I used to work in the same complex where they used to keep this. My group was working late one night and was wondering why there were strange explosion sounds coming from nearby. I walked through the parking lot to see this beast on afterburner. It was even more amazing in person than in the pictures!

One Russian youtuber put an APU onto an old BMW with two configurations, with exhaust off the trunk (https://youtu.be/O2azaxhO6U8?t=362), but also connecting it directly to the clutch of the gearbox (https://youtu.be/gcJCY8kXEkw?t=199)

English article on thedrive https://www.thedrive.com/news/24280/some-russians-built-a-mi...

This is why I love the Bay Area, specifically South Bay. A suburban hell and technology goldmine all wrapped up into a neat little package.

The suburban hell is a dealbreaker for me, ngl.

And every time I'm around a college kid talking about how awesome downtown San Jose is on the weekends, there are always people behind them doing the "no" head shake with their hand making the cut it out motion under the chin, validating my existing perception.

exhibit a: https://tenor.com/view/no-good-cut-it-out-stop-it-stop-jonah...

Reminds me of the Darwin Award urban legend:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JATO_Rocket_Car

I recall reading an article by a guy who suspected a project he worked on might be the highly twisted origin of that story.

He (and a friend?) did in fact mount JATOs on a vehicle, but they were really rather mature about the whole process. It was a rocket sled, not a car. It ran on rails extending from an abandoned mine shaft. They aimed the sled toward the mineshaft so it had a hard stop, and they built gravity-fed brakes into the sled: Between the wheels they cemented tire treads to the frame, then hydraulically lifted the entire chassis. Dump the fluid, and the entire sled weight settles onto the rails.

The main things I don't recall are how the hydraulics get cut (dead man's switch?) and whether they managed to stop the sled before it slammed into the mine entrance.

Someone's tailgating you? No problem! Just slag their engine.

https://i.imgur.com/zM5gMjt.png in case post is deleted.

> If you're seeing this message, that means JavaScript has been disabled on your browser, please enable JS to make Imgur work.

You need js to view a png. What a time to be alive.

No you need JS to view the site, to view the image just go to

https://i.imgur.com/zM5gMjt.png

(add i. before imgur)

Not sure what browser you’re on, but this redirects me to the page that requires JS on Firefox android

They must be doing something tricky. I usually specifically link directly to the image for this reason. Or so I thought.

I'm seeing it redirect me when I put the link in an iframe, stripping off the .png

Whereas if I right click / save as, or put the link in an <img> tag, the image is served properly. Could be conditional on the accept headers.

Yeah, I don't know why but it redirects back to the m. mobile site.

This link seems to work for me

https://i.imgur.com/zM5gMjt_d.webp?maxwidth=640&shape=thumb&...

They are doing some sneaky (and IMHO rather abusive) user-agent sniffing --- change your UA header to some old or obscure browser and you will get the PNG as desired.

alt: https://web.archive.org/web/20201215203958/https://sfbay.cra...

Thank you.

I remember reading about this in Hot Rod magazine back in the day. Here's the article from their website:

https://www.hotrod.com/articles/2000-volkswagen-beetle/

Thanks for the great laugh. The picture at night with the flames and fire shooting out of a beetle is just amazing. Registration up to date.

"street legal" afterburners perfectly sums up how nuts America seems from over the pond.

USA!!! USA!!! USA!!!

I wonder how fast your eardrums would explode if you forgot to roll down your windows before firing up that engine.

https://archive.is/5TCZH for posterity

Bob Lazar, is that you?

https://www.newspapers.com/clip/34752972/1982-jul-30-bob-laz...

I can't imagine how loud this thing is. I stood close to an arm sized jet engine and it's loud. Enough to push the air too that you feel it in your chest

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qhCtOhmEDgo

Quite loud. Good day to bring your ear phones to the track.

I'll be interested to see what this sells for. Passion projects like this often have surprisingly little resell value.

I'm a little sad there's no video.

There is! https://www.leithcars.com/blogs/1421/lifestyle/jet-powered-v...

thought that was pricey, not what I expected:

https://www.hagerty.com/media/maintenance-and-tech/turboniqu...

I would imagine insurance might have some questions, even if the DMV doesn't apparently..

It's too bad I refuse to buy a vehicle without a decent warranty.

Does it have self driving support? Jet planes come with auto pilot

But how does it reverse? That’s what I’d like to know!

I would love to see this race the Hoonicorn.

Maybe sell it to Jay Leno?

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