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Comment by tcbawo | Hacker News Reader

As the younger people alive today get older, they are more likely to remain connected with technology and spend more time socially with digital experiences (playing video games with friends, etc.). Hopefully, this will help offset loneliness that might accompany decreased mobility.

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Unfortunately this is a poor substitute for real physical connection with other people.

Is it that poor? During the pandemic my son has stayed in touch with his friends on the phone in these big group chats and smaller chats as well. I’m amazed at how natural it has become for them. They talk, gossip, play games (Roblox, Fortnite, nba 2k), and even watch YouTube and TikTok together.

I think the model they created will persist into post Covid, with the addition of physical connection.

It is a poor substitution. Online groups nowadays are inherently exclusive and degenerative: they very rarely grow to include new individuals who were not in from the start and often will shrink over time as people feel slighted by something or another and disengage. There is no opportunity for growth. Social groups get crystallized and social growth stunted.

Does that same process not naturally play out as kids turn into adults? (e.g. college freshmen massive friend groups -> 10 years later only really talk / hang out with 10 or so folks)

I'm responding to this comment as a response to all the comments which all seem to have a similar tone. I think it's important to remember that kids are at a different stage in their life than adults. Having small locked in social groups from a young age is bad: it limits experiences, creates echo chambers, and ultimately can lead to stunted growth. The most important thing about what you said re: kids turning into adults is that they had the chance to select their 10 or so folks from a massive friend group. Locking in a social group when your choices up to that point in life are the people you went to elementary school with is likely to have severe consequences, and that is the real harm of shutting in-person schooling down.

I won't even touch on the idea/harm of replacing physical connections with purely online ones. A lot of my friends are people I have met via the internet, but our friendships have often been cemented by eventually meeting up in person. I suspect the same is true for most people who talk about their extensive online social graph.

Not to my experience. Whether big (subreddits, HN) or small (bunch of friends over a Telegram/WhatsApp chat), the groups tend to be somewhat inclusive and grow over time; the larger they are, the faster they grow. But even if they didn't, arguably exclusivity is a feature.

I honestly think smaller more stable groups are going to yield stronger relationships than ones that are continuously growing.

I've been on reddit for ~12 years, for example, and after five or six years still hadn't really cultivated any kind of 'group' or relationship with anyone, so I just started rotating my accounts regularly because the social aspect of the platform is essentially of zero value. HN feels much more like a community, and some of the forums I frequent are even more so, despite being largely undiscoverable and frosty to newcomers.

That's not my experience at all. My online social circle has grown substantially over the pandemic and there's several people I was only acquaintances with previously that I've grown to know much better.

Do you have a source for that?

That's also common in meatspace.

I agree it's better than nothing, but my heart breaks a little to think about how we've completely dropped two of our senses on the floor when it comes to virtual social interaction.

We have more nerves devoted to touch than any other sense. We're a social primate species. We need to shoulders to cry on, hugs, handshakes, etc. We crave being in the same space with others, experiencing their physicality.

Even the smell of our loved ones is an important component of being connected to them. Most of us probably have deeply evocative memories of the smell of "grandmas's house" or an ex's shampoo. Scent is tied to our emotional memories more deeply than any other sense.

Can confirm. I used to like staying alone and being connected via social media. Now, I don’t enjoy that anymore. Maybe it is because I am tired of the dopamine hits social media provides.

Social media as it currently exists isn't going to substitute personal relationships. It misses the trees for the forest (personal vs tribal). To me, it feels like being at a party where I only know a handful of people and I have to shout to communicate with the people I do know. But, technology can connect people with shared interests and activities and facilitate one-on-one communication. People who are into baseball cards or bird watching can find each other. Technology has the capacity to enrich long term relationships. I think we're still figuring it all out.

I agree. Although, in practice digital activities probably help to strengthen and keep relationships alive, which could lead to greater real physical connections in a symbiotic way.

> connected with technology and spend more time socially with digital experiences

As a young person today, I feel totally disconnected from the people around me, even moreso because of the pandemic, and I actively try to spend less time "socially"/"digitally" etc. because they only increase feelings of loneliness. No technology besides basic telephony has done anything to help me stay more connected to my friends.

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