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I have a Chevy Volt as well. But we also have an Outlander PHEV. I wouldn't call the Volt a PHEV or include it in the same category as the Outlander at all. The Volt is an electric car that happens to have an ICE as backup. the Outlander PHEV is a soft hybrid with a bigger battery. It's pretty much impossible to drive it without using the gas engine, even when you hit the "EV" button. And from my impression that's the case with pretty much every PHEV other than the Volt.

But we needed a people mover that fits kids, dogs, skis, etc. for longer trips. So that was the best compromise.

It's a shame they killed the Volt and screwed up in marketing it. Such an amazing piece of engineering. I don't like GM's products generally, but I would have bought an Equinox type vehicle with a Voltec drivetrain and paid good money for it.

GM indicates that they think the EV transition is happening sooner than people and has no plans for another PHEV, just a large slate of EVs between 2023-2030. The Volt is mentioned as a transition option no longer necessary, according to current GM plans. Relatedly, all of the German automakers currently expect to be entirely EV by 2030. (Asian automakers are interestingly split by how much they rely on US car sales versus Chinese car sales. Those selling to China are on a very fast ramp to all EV production and those with much more reliance on US sales are still hedging their bets.)

There's an interesting feeling in the air that it could be a surprisingly fast switch in the next few years. I've loved my Volt and it was a great purchase in 2011, but in 2020 it does feel like a transition tech that I wouldn't buy again (especially as commute changes and electric reliability have moved me more and more to the "gas up once a year only because the Volt makes me" group), I'd personally go for a proper EV next time. It will be interesting to watch the next few years because I think things are about to go "weird" quickly (in rapid shifts in gas prices and availability).

Until there's charging stations deep in the woods a few hundred km from any town, I won't be able to own a pure EV as my only car, and I'll be holding on to my Volt. I can't see that happening in the next decade. And I'm by far not the only one with those kind of use cases.

I think a pure EV meets the needs of most consumers. But I think it's incredibly short sited to drop something like the Volt from the product line, especially in places like here in Canada. Especially since it was superior to anything similar that has come out.

I also don't trust GM to actually be pushing the EV transition. It feels to me like stalling.

I don't think GM is leading, that's why I mentioned the German automakers. GM, at least, isn't falling behind like Ford seems to want to.

There are RV hookups somewhere in most random woods a few hundred km from any town in the US. Many of them are already 220V ("dryer plugs", good for a "Level 2" charge) and all you would need is a plug adapter to charge from any one of them. Everyone thinking of chargers like gas pumps is underestimating how many "chargers" currently exist in the wild. The auto industry hasn't helped matters by over-engineering ("for safety!") their plugs so much, making it seem a lot less like a plug is just a plug is just a plug (just like the early 1900s used to make and everyone has on almost all their walls).

I think when a changeover occurs, there's going to be a huge re-evaluation of the parts of the electric grid we've already built. I don't know if that means that RV plugs everywhere will need to be "upgraded" to credit card reading "proper chargers" or if we'll see a growing industry of "dumb plug adapters" from the dumb fancy EV "charger" plugs to more classic situations like dryer plugs. There's already a lot more plugs in the world than gas stations.

(Also the Volt has a very tiny battery compared to what is being released today. The equation is very different when you factor in current EV ranges rather than trying to extrapolate from your current Volt's range.)

I drove the volt cross country. I wouldn't have been able to do that with a pure electric (at least without a heck of a lot of planning and limited ability to be spontaneous). I enjoyed driving it up and down and across (covered around 6000 miles over a month)

The dirty little secret is that other studies have found that these low-range PHEVs (the three cited above have a useful electric-only range of <10 miles), unlike the Volt, are not often charged by their owners. And, even when they are, the short range means that most miles are driven on dino juice.

So, emissions when not charged are extremely relevant. That’s not editorial bias. It’s reality.

The Volt (and Clarity PHEV) are almost in a different class. Their large batteries make them more similar to an i3, and a 5-8 year old Volt has more range than a similarly-aged Leaf (unless the owner was extraordinarily lucky and lived in a cold climate)

a plugin hybrid with less than 10 miles of range shouldn't be considered a plugin hybrid. So, this would seem to be against a certain class of PHEVs, not the concept in general. I would argue that any PHEV that the government wants to recognize as such, should be required to have a minimum range of 40-50 miles.

I think 30 miles is fine for some user's daily commuting.

depends where one lives, but 30 miles range would have been difficult for my palo -> san jose and back commute if I couldn't charge near work and deffinitely not enough if I would do anything else on the way to or from work. that's why I think a 40-50 mile range it lets you commute + do errands.

but at the end of the day, we somewhat agree, there needs to be a significant amount of electric range where its not just a gimmic or a glorified prius type hybrid. just because a car can charge from a socket, shouldn't make it regulatory a PHEV.

And I would agree with you... but... the vast majority of PHEVs (by number of models and by sales volume) are "mild PHEVs". Volt and Clarity are the exception, not the rule. Even the Prius Prime (the second, better Prius PHEV) has only 22 miles of electric range.

You missed this line:

>"The BMW X5, Volvo XC60 and Mitsubishi Outlander emitted 28-89% more CO2 than advertised when tested by Emissions Analytics on a fully charged battery in optimal conditions.

Hybrids are designed by manufacturers who want to pass emissions legislation, and bought by customers who just want a car (in my experience, here in the UK that means "I want an oversized car so I feel safe as I blast around small roads at excessive speed).

Can't speak for the UK, but in the Netherlands the tax deduction laws have changed (already 4 years ago) to no longer give lease-car drivers a tax advantage when driving a hybrid. Only full electric cars were eligible for a lower tax rate - the hybrids were taxed like regular ICU cars.

I have personally driven a C350e - a hybrid with an amazingly short range - and I really like the concept. If you compare the fuel consumption with similar cars (same, weight, size) it is much more fuel efficient. And indeed, that greatly depends on how disciplined the driver is. I charge wherever I can, manually set the car to 'full electric' until I run out of charge and don't "blaze around small roads at excessive speed". The 1600 kg Mercedes can run a comfortable 1 liter per 30 kms and more.

So sure, the fancy stories told by the salesmen, you are never going to see happen. But better fuel consumption without the charging stress (anyone seen the Tesla's waiting in line for supercharger-stations during the previous winter when we still were allowed to ski?) is easily done.

And if that weight and cost budget was just used for batteries, instead of an engine and drivetrain, you'd get a much better electric vehicle.

If you took the BOM cost of the ICE components in a hybrid car, and spent it on the electric drivetrain, you would end up with a very poor performing EV (at least, the range would be abysmal).

This is less and less true every year. Similar to the x86 vs ARM performance chart, or any disruptive technology really.

I think the crossover will happen in less than 10 years. After that point an ICE vehicle will be worse in every performance metric, and cost more for less.

Compared to the supply chain for an EV motor, the supply chain for an ICE is incredibly complex and ripe for disruption. When that disruption occurs things are going to get real interesting, real fast.

(As one indicator to watch, Bosch is a German conglomerate that alone makes a surprisingly large fraction of the ICE supply chain and key parts in almost every major ICE from at the very least US and German manufacturers. Bosch has rumored a pivot for several years now that the time for them to get out of ICE vehicle parts is coming up as all the German manufacturers plan to go EV only. If Bosch makes that pivot they would hugely disrupt ICE costs. That's just one conglomerate of a dozen or less capable of that kind of disruption right now.)

I went through 2 Chevy Volt leases and loved that car. Averaged 150mpg lifetime.

Now I’ve got a Pacifica Minivan plug-in hybrid which has a similar value proposition but the drive train is noticeably different than the Volt’s all electric plus a generator approach.