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Comment by MauranKilom | Hacker News Reader

> There is no meaningful data that any hiring process--good or bad--improves the outcome of a hire. If there were, everyone would be using it.

I can say with confidence that certain resume features are incredibly strong predictors of interview performance (at least in the related measures, in the field and/or team I'm working in). I'm not HR, but your statement seems to also deny the possibility of this empirical observation.

> Given this, why not hire lightly and fire lightly?

Because it would be a complete dick move to have someone relocate (possibly involving change of country) and then fire them 2 weeks later? That's not even looking at the formal, bureaucratic or training overhead, or any of the other factors in this industry that make hiring and firing a bit more complicated than handing someone (and later taking away) a hardhat and a shovel.

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> it would be a complete dick move to have someone relocate (possibly involving change of country) and then fire them 2 weeks later

This. I hold a slightly lower bar (meaning more willing to take a chance) on someone who is unemployed than if they're working now. Worst case if I take someone unemployed, hire them "light", and they don't work out is they're back where they already were, whereas if someone quits their job to come work here and gets fired, they're worse off than they were before.

Shouldn't that be the employee's choice, not yours?

You're still interfering with that unemployed person's job hunt.

I’m not sure I understand. Someone is unemployed, applies, interviews just a whisker under our normal bar, and if I offer them a job, I’m the bad guy in this story?

Can you share what those resume features tend to look like?

Disclaimer: This is for a quite particular set of positions, and it's not in the US (so I have no reference on US GPAs). The EU supply/demand situation is also different from the US, so your FAANG mileage may vary.

Here are a few (at a level of detail that I'm comfortable sharing):

- Outstanding (in either direction) performance in certain subjects in school is a very strong predictor.

- Cover letters are mostly noise, but incoherent, overbearing or careless ones don't go very far. Lack of curiosity and interest is also a negative predictor (but these are of course easily feigned).

- Relevant extracurricular engagement and/or industrial experience begets more well-rounded engineers.

Let me be clear though that we consider applications on more than these factors. These are just predictors, and sometimes they are wrong. I have interviewed actuaries that couldn't calculate dice roll probabilities, C++ programmers that were confused by the class keyword and C# programmers that hadn't heard of virtual.

Do you hire experienced people too? I someone has 35 years, does it makes sense to judge them on school results and extracurricular engagement?

These are people who were in workforce 10+ years.

You are correct to observe that what I listed is primarily relevant to people who have less experience. While prevalent, that's not exclusively the demographic of our applications, and of course the weight of these factors is reduced for someone who has been in the workforce for longer. But they remain good predictors nonetheless.

"C# programmers that hadn't heard of virtual"

No offense, but that is a very silly thing to consider "foundational" in 2020. The heavy, all encompassing use of inheritance patterns these days is much less prevalent than 10 years ago, even in the C# community.

Extremely silly, I got a C# job recently after I went about 7 years without touching C#. I forgot virtual existed until my first day when I had to look it up. I would have failed the "what's virtual?" question, yet I am very good at my job (just got a big raise).

I'll add a few more I've noticed over time.

Certifications are a strong negative predictor. Someone who turns up with a lot of corporate certifications is unlikely to do well when asked difficult questions.

People who have only ever worked in low grade or low tier banks tend to do poorly. There are a few exceptions. GS has good technologists. Most big investment banks have a few programmers (older ones usually) who have solid experience - but who are unlikely to put any creative effort in and may have a "here's why it can't be done" attitude. May not matter for some roles.

People who list a very large number of short roles tend to do poorly.

People who give a list of projects in their resume experience for which they only assert they were part of the group that delivered it, without concrete claims of tech leadership, often do poorly - generally it indicates a "hiding amongst the crowd" problem in which someone is a poor performer and attempts to hide lack of any actual achievement by reference to group projects.

People who list obscure programming languages as a skill do relatively well, people who list obscure products as a skill do relatively poorly.

> I can say with confidence that certain resume features are incredibly strong predictors of interview performance

But what about actual job performance?

See above.

Does interview performance have anything to do with job performance though?

In light of this particular team having been very successful at recruiting (i.e. extending offers based on interviews) and retaining people that succeed at the challenges they face for the better part of a decade: Yes.

But again, I'm not claiming this to be universal. Just that it's possible.

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