DoorDash doesn't allow a tip of $10 because “The amount is higher than expected” | Hacker News Reader

DoorDash doesn't allow a tip of $10 because “The amount is higher than expected”

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32 pointstrextrex30 comments

I don't know if they have changed their tipping practice but last time there was a backlash they just deducted the tip from your order. E.g. you earn $10 from the order and get a tip of $15. They deduct $10 from your $10 order so you're basically getting paid nothing except the tip so you get $15 in total.

Here is the thing. If the tip is lower than the order e.g. someone tips $7 on a $10 then you still only receive $10. Now that they have capped the maximum tip to $10 they have eliminated the only way to make money off of DoorDash tips. When you're tipping on DoorDash you're tipping DoorDash, not the worker.

Maybe they changed the tipping system and what I'm talking about doesn't make any sense but I'm not optimistic when it comes to DoorDash.

That is so highly unethical. No matter if they only did this in the past or still doing, doing something like this should be illegal or at least a big pr fuckup.

I don't think ethics are the top priority of these companies: food delivery businesses traditionally take 30% from the food, take additional delivery fee from the user, and sometimes even a couple of dollars from the tips.

It might sound naive, but as a user of these services for the last couple years, I only just recently learned this. Eg that they take a cut of each food item on top of their delivery fee. I always assumed the delivery fee was their cut. It was only when my wife mentioned she chatted to a local store who we ordered regularly from, that they mentioned they make crap all money on Uber/Deliveroo/etc orders.

We’ve deleted their apps and now just call ahead for pickup and go grab it ourselves. I feel shit for not looking into it sooner.

It's difficult without digging into the topic that these commissions exist because those kickbacks are fundamentally unjustified (and largely contested by restaurants). The current situation has caused restaurants to be more and more dependant to this revenue stream and are not in a position to negotiate.

Which is why it's so important for restaurants to organize and defend themselves.

https://www.protectourrestaurants.com/

Drove a Grubhub sales rep around. Usually between 15-30% depending on the package they picked. Which would also determine where they ranked on the site when someone searched for their cuisine. This was when they were just starting out their delivery program.

I've also noticed the food prices are marked up by $1-2 on uber eats, even if doing pickup; Im not sure if its uber or the restaurant doing it, but I've verified the markup exists on multiple shops

I'm down to use an alternative. All it needs is an iOS app, a website, a support line for order issues and to remove restaurants that repeatedly have issues, and secure payment methods. One app to aggregate all the restaurants that don't want to get screwed by the Ubers and Grubhubs. Since 2014 I haven't seen such an app. If one exists, please let me know, and the millions of restaurants as well. Perhaps a non-profit intermediary or collective could exist here.

The rule against wage and tip theft of hourly and tipped workers was revoked a couple of years ago.

Can you give more context to this?

Actually the revocation is still under way though the Department of Labor announced that they had stopped enforcement in mid 2017.

In 2012 the DoL required that tips given to workers earning less than minimum wage are property of the worker. Until the, some restaurants had pooled all the tips, giving some to dishwashers and such (rather than paying them minimum wage) and even some to restaurant managers and owners, where that “some” for managers can even be the majority of tips paid.

California allows this under strict rules (involving the amount earned by the workers making tips, and very strictly who qualifies for a share). However at the federal level managers are once again free to keep some or all of tips. Supposedly “market forces” are adequate to restrain this. Note that the federal minimum wage for restaurant workers is different from the regular minimum wage: 2.13/hr rather than $7.30/hr — because they supposedly get tips!

I never tip through the app, i always give them cash

Doesn’t work if you’re trying to do contactless delivery in a pandemic.

Couldn’t you just leave the tip in an envelope on your doorstep?

Wait, are you saying when I use "tip my dasher", that does not go to my delivery person?

I'd like to get this picture straight because I will never tip again if they are being stiffed...

It's word games. The delivery pay is normally, say, $10 without tips. If you tip $5, that goes to your delivery person, but they also reduce the delivery pay to $5. So in practice, DoorDash always pays the driver $10, and your tip is to the company, just with some sleight of hand for them to say "your tip is to the dasher"

I honestly can't comprehend the lunacy of this policy. This is very eye opening and incredibly deceptive.

I think this was revoked a year ago after a major outcry.

Still doesn't excuse them though.

They did change it: https://blog.doordash.com/working-to-strike-a-better-balance...

The issue might be with the credit card processor. Typically the way it works is when you initially charge the bill the card processor with authorize the amount of the meal plus some percentage (Pre-Auth - I forget the amount or it may vary) and then after the bill is signed you do a second transaction (post-auth) to record the final amount being charged and this releases any difference. Depending on the card processor it may not be possible to post-auth more then a certain percentage of tip because it exceeds the amount authorized and/or they are flagging tips beyond a certain percentage as possible data entry errors and declining so that it does not result in a chargeback. So if you want to tip your waiter $1200 for a $20 meal, you ought to plan on doing it with cash.

An unfortunate side effect of "no touch" orders has been to make it difficult to leave cash tips for delivery people.

On the upside, from a federal perspective, this is fighting undeclared revenue and beneficial to tax revenues (and so, supposed to benefit the whole society, and then in an ideal world, the government could support those who are unpaid or regulate minimum wages to force companies to pay higher).

So only the rich can now do tax evasion.

The rich do tax avoidance, completely different thing. Of course they have the luxury of doing it 'legally', which is not something you can do without a certain amount of money.

I'm not in favour of tax evasion (but I live in a low-tax country where "only" 40% of your work is taken by the government).

From my perspective, someone evading tax, is like someone directly stealing from my wallet.

If someone doesn't pay his taxes, then I will have to pay more to compensate.

There is also a negative feedback cycle with people not paying taxes. If the neighbour doesn't pay his taxes, then I will not be motivated to pay my taxes, etc. So it's better to break this circle early.

The problem of underpaid couriers should be solved at the root with the delivery companies and work-force laws.

The whole tipping culture is a big question itself and one of the leading cause for extremely low wages. In comparison, the quality of service is extraordinary in Japan and the waiters are clearly driven by other values than Tipping Money as God.

An overall tax rate of 40% is extremely high; in most places, even those with mandatory social insurance on top, low-wage work like DoorDash doesn't get that kind of cut.

> The whole tipping culture is a big question itself and one of the leading cause for extremely low wages

Potato, potahto. American work culture in this area is just very strange, a huge collective action problem that people can't dig their way out of because the discourse is so dysfunctional.

I’m concerned about theft by the delivery company, not theft by the recipient

Uber has a cap on the tip you can give depending on the cost of the trip.

Use cash. Also ensures they get all of it.

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