The idea that Uber is somehow more dangerous than a black cab or minicab - neither of which keep any record of who is driving, where they took you or who you are is just silly.
Taxis in London were just terrible (and expensive) until Uber
Taxis in London were just terrible (and expensive) until Uber
* Quite possibly just someone in a car pretending to be a taxi.
* 20 minutes on the phone to 3 different companies, to find out they won't come for two hours and they don't turn up anyway.
* Dirty.
* Terrible driving.
* Rude.
* Refuse to go where you've asked after you've already hailed one and got in.
* Only take cash.
* Take the long way to run the meter up.
* Use other tricks to get paid more - 'Oh the meter's broken. That'll be $lots'
* No way to see when they might arrive, or if there are any in the area.
* No way to know anything about your driver.
* No way to see which is your taxi when it arrives.
* ...
Taxis around here since Uber:
* Some have an app that only works for their company, and is terrible.
* Some have signed on to an app that works for more than one local companies, and is terrible.
The rest is pretty much the same.
https://www.icaew.com/insights/viewpoints-on-the-news/archiv...
This is the problem with having conversations about tax law: the vast majority of people have no idea what they're talking about. Worse: the vast majority of people think they know what they're talking about.
Ref. https://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-uber-britain-tax/uber-face...
Unless you're a taxi driver, when you need to register regardless. They carved that out.
The ato claims this is because[1]: 1) to avoid the confusion that would be created if some taxis had to charge GST and others did not 2) avoiding the added problem that would arise if a passenger was using a taxi for a business trip (creditable acquisition). In this instance, the passenger would want to be able to claim an input tax credit for the GST included in the fare 3) meter rates are set by each state authority and after 1 July 2000 all meters were adjusted to reflect the GST. If some drivers were registered and others were not, all would be collecting the higher rate. This would disadvantage drivers who had to be registered if the ordinary registration turnover threshold applied.
Interesting point of view in that specific case.
[1] https://www.ato.gov.au/Business/GST/In-detail/GST-issues-reg...
Is this true in London? Do people privately own black cabs?
I think London has a 2-tiered taxi system - black cabs and minicabs - and I suspect faking a black cab would be much harder?
At the end of a night outside clubs, there'd be (illegal) minicabs everywhere, offering to take you wherever for much less than a black cab, and sometimes that's just all the money you have left. Usually they'd get lost or be terrible in some other way very well-described above.
How is uber not given massive credit for reducing the dangerous waiting-around-in-some-random-place-you-don't-know time from 30mins+ to 3mins+
That must have saved a few thousand muggings on its own by now.
Taxis, Uber, they're all the same. Give me public transport anyday.
never experienced this. does that actually work? I thought the initial quote was binding.
> Driving dangerously because you're on 5 apps and hitting cyclists
I've certainly had some aggressive uber drivers, but nothing that stood out as less safe than the typical cab experience.
public transit is great when it goes where you need it to. unfortunately I live in the US so...
Secondly, uber drivers have ratings (unlike cabs) and a set of consistent low ratings for dangerous driving will flag the dangerous behavior
So there's a strong incentive for them to act properly - unlike a black cab where they know full well they'll never see you again.
How hard would it have been for black cabs to have an app offering Uber’s features - easy location-aware ordering and seamless payment? Technologically, it wouldn’t have been terribly hard... but of course they had their own misaligned incentives to not do so.
So on this front... bravo, Uber.
:)
This is a fun way to make tourists feel insecure.
Call them out, where you wait on a foreign police, prove your identity, file a report -- in a non native accent / language -- in the best case...
or in the worst case, where they'll take you where you don't want to go (or other cabs to pickup), potentially drive off in a dangerous way as you forcibly exit the vehicle, and blacklist you from other cars
-- all while you're hoping to make it to a hotel, airport, tour safely and on time.
Most people forget that. Tourist places are a literal gold mine for fraudsters and other kinds of bad people.
Meanwhile, the last time I got a black cab, the card machine was broken, and the driver "helpfully" offered to take a detour to an ATM, with the meter running, on my dime of course.
Of course, only do that at the end of the ride.
They are not allowed to pick up passengers if the machine (or meter, or lots of other things) is broken. If it’s genuinely broken and you still want to pay, you can call the number displayed below the machine and pay over the phone.
It's not as satisfying as yours but my general technique that works everywhere in the world where cabs are competing is: ask them if they take credit cards and their reader is working before you get into the cab. If they say no you find another cab. (In my experience they never say no anyway. But I learned to do this every single time I use a cab anywhere because this scam is so unbelievably common everywhere in the world.)
I got on Uber really early and cashed in big time on those sweet £20 bonuses for EVERY referral.
I'd just stand up at the end of a party and shout "WHO WANTS TO GET HOME FOR FREE" and be set for taxis for the next month or so.
If you want a larger car, you can get it. You'll just pay a bit more.
> Aren't the levels of Uber that allow a Prius to be used much, much cheaper than a black cab? If you want a larger car, you can get it. You'll just pay a bit more.
> On paper, sure. In practice, I find that Uber is nearly constantly in surge pricing in London. I've had it several times now where I Was riding in a group, same start point same destination - some people in ubers, some in black cabs. Again, with normal pricing Uber should be cheaper, but since it's very often at 1.5x-2x multiplier, it works out the same or actually more expensive than a black cab. And sure, there is the higher tier of ubers too, but it's usually showing me 20-30 minute wait for a cab for a nicer car.
Seems like the fact that there is constantly surge pricing and long waiting time means that there are too few Uber drivers, even in "low quality" cars, to meet demand. Your complaints sound like the old joke about prison food: it tastes terrible and the portions are too small.
What an odd thought leap! It seems like your comparison to the prisoner would apply to anyone who thought the price of something was too high for what you were getting, so doesn't actually seem like a compelling point.
Comparing a Prius to one of those black cabs ("Hackney carriages" as they're called) is like comparing a car to a cattle truck. The former at least attempts to be comfortable, the latter is just designed to move cattle as efficiently as possible (for the operator) without any concerns for the cattle itself.
In my experience this is only true since the rise of Uber. Prior to that it was rare to find a cab which took card in London and even if you were in one, often the card machine was conveniently out of order
Everyone wins. Even if you prefer black cabs in all circumstances, as there’s now less competition in flagging one ;-)
The barrier to entry for becoming a black cab driver far exceeds that required to be an Uber driver.
Drive for Uber: get a PCO license (about £400-600); own an appropriate car; have appropriate insurance.
Drive a black cab: do the knowledge (2-4 years); get a black cab license (in excess of £1k); get a black cab (likely at least twice the price of a Prius); have appropriate insurance.
Pretty sure the number of Uber drivers who might have been black cab drivers is very, very small.
I call the taxi company its automated asks me to push 1 or 2 for the last two trips or 0 for an operator.
I tell the operator where I want to go and my name and I get a sms message with a link to a map and another one when it has arrived.
So now you have a bunch of "gig-workers" scraping by, often mis-accounting for the deprectiation of using their own vehicle, while often not being properly insured to carry passengers commercially. Meanwhile, Uber corporate is a money burning enterprise.
However, for wealthy urbanites, they can now get to where they are going cheaply and conveniently, so the trade off is "good".
I remain confident that if Uber (and its drivers) had to charge "true costs" this entire story changes.
Guide dogs are basically the same thing. Dogs shed, and some people are allergic, so drivers avoid them since they don't recoup lost time or money if they have to clean their car afterwards. That one's easier to fix, though. Uber is just going to have to take a hard stance on it.
I am curious if the drivers know that they are legally required to allow guide dogs. I also wonder if Uber drivers are liable under the ADA in the states where they are still independent contractors.
Additionally, private entities providing
taxi service cannot discriminate against
individuals with disabilities by refusing
to provide service to individuals with
disabilities who can use taxi vehicles
and/or use service animals, refusing to
assist with the stowing of mobility
devices, or charging higher fares or
fees for carrying individuals with
disabilities and their equipment than are
charged to other persons.
[1] https://adata.org/factsheet/ADA-accessible-transportation
Both Uber and Lyft have been hit with a pretty steady stream of lawsuits around ADA compliance, and Lyft has an active settlement with the US Justice Department requiring frequent driver education as well as compliance reporting[1].
[1] https://www.engadget.com/lyft-settles-justice-department-dis...
You're basically saying that Uber should just close and we get back to the fraudsters that are minicabs. Awesome! Let's make people poorer because "social justice".
How is that a government concern? Or, how is that your concern? Drivers know what they’re doing and if they don’t, they’ll be out of business. That’s how markets work. Nobody is forced to ride or drive Uber.
If those all those new gig workers are just scraping by today what were they doing before Uber was even an option?
Let's not blame Uber for our economic policies and the lack of steady employment caused by our shared desire to live in as "efficient" and cheap a world as possible.
And let's not imagine that Uber is all that stands between people and "good jobs."
Secondly black cabs will pick you up from taxi ranks or if you hail them in the street (which Uber and minicabs can not). They are not really that comparable.
So before uber there was already a service which complemented black cabs.
Black cabs have been required to have a functional contactless card reader in them for some time now. Any that don't are asking to be reported for it.
I know that doesn't address all their issues.
I wouldn't be surprised if it was TFL trying to force the black cabs to modernise and compete with uber.
And a year before we had a luxury vehicle ride booked with Uber in London.
I was using electronic payment with black cabs almost 20 years ago, contactless came in ages ago. I genuinely find it hard to believe you've used a black cab, at least in this century.
And my husband has been asked for a blowjob at least twice in London.... some black cab drivers are a little bit too "friendly"...
Private hire cabs were terrible. Hackney cabs (the black ones that do on-street pickup) were generally very good if a bit expensive.
If you didn't mind listening to racist diatribe from the driver and were willing to support their tax evasion as "the card reader's broken guv - cash only".
I hate Uber for a lot of things, but they don't exploit anyone. If anything Uber is the disruptor that stopped straight up mobs owning the market.
They are not employees at all... and they must figure out their own holiday and sick pay.
I'm not a fan of Uber specifically, but they certainly do blend together (most of) the best of both worlds for London cab use I've experienced.
I'd also argue that the Night Tube was really helped by their prevalence, so they've made even public transport better as a result (as a traveller, rather than an operator).
(had the same issue with "cash only" in several cities - Brussels and Washington DC come to mind. That's why I use Uber)
There are two types of license for London black cabs - one for the city center and one for the whole of London. The one that can only do the city center have a green sticker.
Also, if the "for hire" light is on, they are not allowed to refuse to take you to anywhere within their boundary. In practice, if there are a bunch of cabs around, it may make sense to get another one, but if it's pissing down with rain and there are no other cabs in sight, get in the cab first THEN tell them where you are going and insist on it.
As for cash: since 2016, every cab must have a working credit card meter to pick up a far.
AFAIK the opposite is true. The green badge is the 'All London' badge, which entitles the holder to work everywhere in London. The yellow badge is the Suburban badge, which allows them to work in one of 9 specific areas that form a ring around Inner London.
Funnily enough now that you have to wear a mask to drive (at least in the states) this point is a little easier to pull off probably.
Which can easily happen with any other minicab or black taxi.
There's nothing special about people like John Worboys, other than unlike Uber he wasn't traceable from his victims accounts.
Uber and friends effectively forced them (or local authorities) to accept cards.
Where I live the council and taxis have been endlessly moaning about Uber but a couple of years ago they made accepting card payments mandatory for black cabs... Cause and effect.
&%^k them
There’s a reason the cost is so high for cabs in London. Great public transportation and high col. if you’re complaining about the cost of a cab ride , remember the cost would be the same if Uber marketing wasn’t subsidizing your rides.
Black cabs is a different story.
Indeed, that should be banned right off, but as you astutely point out, rich people want to get around faster than the rest of us.
Black cabs (and ubers) have an effective occupancy even lower than private cars.
Uber is only slightly better. It's just an easier way of getting a cab. I was quite happy with service from MyTaxi in Lisbon, better than hailing a random cab.