Ask HN: What are good life skills for people to learn? | Hacker News Reader

Ask HN: What are good life skills for people to learn?

254 pointssmarri270 comments

My initial thoughts; learn to drive, first aid, a sport, play an instrument, a language, how to manage finances, to speak in front of people.

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I always think of this poem by Ralph Waldo Emerson:

    To laugh often and much; 
    to win the respect of the intelligent people 
    and the affection of children; 
    to earn the appreciation of honest critics 
    and endure the betrayal of false friends; 
    to appreciate beauty; 
    to find the best in others;  
    to leave the world a bit better 
    whether by a healthy child, a garden patch,
    or a redeemed social condition; 
    to know that one life has breathed easier  
    because you lived here. 
    This is to have succeeded.

Lovely quote, attribution likely apocryphal (and I don't think it was a poem). https://quoteinvestigator.com/2012/06/ is a nice writeup (assuming you trust its citations).

That's a beautiful poem, thanks for sharing.

love it. Thanks for sharing

1. How to spend less than you earn. Lots of people desire “financial freedom”, meaning they can spend what they want when they want it. Solving this via revenue leads to the hedonic treadmill, and you’ll never out earn your growing wants. Instead solve this by controlling your wants, and you’ve achieved financial freedom immediately.

2. How to take risks. Finding the balance between recklessness and absolute risk avoidance is about managing downside, so you get a chance at the upside with acceptable consequences if things go wrong. Get this right, and the world is your oyster, even if this is your only skill in life. Get this wrong, and it will swamp every over accomplishment, skill, and strength you may have.

3. Know what you want, and why you want it. The worst thing in life is time wasted winning at unfulfilling endeavors. The “winning” sucks you I’m and keeps your trapped in a local maxima, where all roads look like moving backward. (Usually, this means understanding and controlling your need for status vs your other needs—-and that requires a lot of introspection.)

1. Spoken like someone who has been lucky. Before I was a dev, I worked less profitable jobs. I was no where near the poverty line, but life is expensive and you can only reduce expenses to a point. Sure, you can probably ease the burden by spending less, but at a certain point spending less means living an ascetic life, free from any frivolous pleasures.

The term financial freedom doesn't just mean "making more than you spend". Above a certain income level you get the freedom to splurge. Being able to sit at a restaurant with a friend and not always choose the cheapest option is financial freedom. You can't get that by belt-tightening.

2. Risk isn't the same for everyone. it is fundamentally easier for certain people to take risks. If you make $200k per year, you can probably afford to gamble a little. But what if you only have a couple of hundred dollars to spend after rent and bills every month? Sure there are occasionally successful people who come from nothing, but starting a business or pivoting careers is much easier when you already have money.

1. I have been lucky, but I’m also a 2nd generation immigrant. I remember how many things my parents had to deny themselves (and me) growing up. Of course this mileage only takes you so far, but on many incomes, there’s real power here. The fact that it’s painful to deny yourself these things is the point. Most bad financial things happen to people who won’t tolerate that pain, so they get locked in marginal situations with little room to take risks or have anything go wrong. Eventually, something always goes wrong. This is the only way to protect yourself. It doesn’t mean it doesn’t hurt.

2. This is the exact point. Each of us have to judge the consequences of failure for each decision. If you only have a couple hundred dollars left after expenses, risk aversion is the right call—-and falls well within the real of managing your risk.

Not sure why you're being downvoted. I lived what you're saying. It's a reality for a lot of people.

Cheapest option at a proper restaurant: glass of water. I had times where that was the only option that I could manage, unless my friends insisted on paying for me. I'd feel bad, but they were better off and didn't mind (at least they said they didn't mind) and otherwise I might not have even gone out with them.

Splurging for me was going and getting 4 items off the dollar value menu at Wendy's instead of 2 or 3.

But it wouldn't really matter. I'd get sick, have to go to the doctor, get a bill I couldn't pay, it'd go to collections and wreck my credit, then my car would break down the same week, then it breaks down again in a different way a few months later, and will keep doing so because it's an old piece of shit but you can't get anything better, and there's just no getting ahead. Just sinking further and further into debt.

I didn't break out of that cycle until I got a job that almost doubled my salary and dedicated a couple of years to just digging myself out of the hole I had gotten myself into.

I'm a lot better off right now. Actually have savings, some investments. House, dogs, wife, spend more money than I should on stuff I don't really need. But I'm way, way behind others my age in my industry, and my credit is just okay now, not great.

I've been in the same boat (see other posts). It sucks so much. And so much of the problem is the expense of transport, which is externalized onto regular folks rather than being paid for with taxes.

Even when I was broke and living in NYC, I could still afford my subway pass. I mean barely, but I afforded it. That meant I could always get to the temp job I needed to get to without worrying.

If you think of car ownership as a "tax" because it's required in most parts of the country, it becomes a very expensive regressive tax indeed.

> which is externalized onto regular folks

You appear to be very mistaken about the meaning of "externalized" (this is, of course, the charitable interpretation). Paying for a good or service you yourself consume does not constitute an externality. In fact, the exact opposite is true: if you forces others to pay for your open transportation, that would be an externality.

In NYC and other major cities, the mid-century city planners were convinced / bribed by oil and car companies to tear down their elevated tracks and install freeways; remove their cable cars and replace them with slower, less efficient bus routes.

The common good of affordable and reliable public transportation was transformed into an everybody-must-own-a-car system.

Thus you and I and other people are paying tens of thousands of dollars to own and maintain cars because business interests felt it would be better for us to do so.

This reply confirms my suspicion that you are mistaken about the meaning of "externalize". What you describe does not constitute an externality, although I do appreciate the explanation. This holds even though I tend to agree that what happened was a bad thing, though for different reasons.

However, it is important to remember that words mean something, and anyone who tells you different is trying to sell you something (usually something involving the deaths of millions, but I digress...).

> I had times where that was the only option that I could manage, unless my friends insisted on paying for me.

I expect that you returned the favor, although maybe not to the exact same friends. :-)

That's true, I have, to other people.

> I'd feel bad, but they were better off and didn't mind (at least they said they didn't mind)

They didn't mind. It feels very good to do something nice for a friend. If it didn't, they wouldn't keep inviting you.

Also, when I could only afford water, I learned how to say something to the effect of "That's okay, I already ate, I'll just have some water," or if at a bar "No thank you, I'm a designated driver, just some water," to make it seem like it wasn't because I was broke. Probably didn't always work, but no one said anything about it.

1: In 2002, long before I was a dev, I made about $14,000, working at a local YMCA. I had plenty of money. I paid rent (shared), I went out to eat a couple times per week (mainly the $13.50 all-you-can-eat crab at the chinese place), and I spent my leisure time how I wanted--for me that was primarily gaming, fishing (from the shore), programming, and coaching youth sports. I drove a beater car and did not have any luxury in my life, but I had a nice PC, a few nice fishing rods, etc.

I managed to save money without much issue, and I moved out of that place with $12k cash.

It was a very good time in my life, probably the best time. I think you maybe have a different idea about what makes you happy--those "frivolous pleasures." Simpler living is not the same as asceticism.

I am in a position in my life now, having bought a rural property ($60k for 40 acres and a home), where I could live for much less than I did at that time. Some things I find rewarding there are raising a few animals, gardening, hunting, camping on my own property, woodworking in my small woodshop (hand tools are cheaper and I find them particularly rewarding), repairing/restoring things, servicing my own vehicles, and relying more on myself and my own talents. Some of the best times are spent sitting in a chair on my shop porch--a type of meditation perhaps. I don't feel like an ascetic, and I realize that it's not a life for everyone, but surely it's a good life, and preferable to being a drone with no free time and no money to spend in any free time.

2: I think they were speaking less about financial risk, like risking your savings, and more about other kinds of risks. Later in my life I moved to Costa Rica for a time (on an aside, I lived there about as cheaply as I did in my YMCA days). I was scared to do it, by myself, etc, but I looked at worst case scenarios, and it was like...I squandered my savings (10-15k, I don't remember), I was alive, bruised ego, and I went back to the US and got a low-paying job. I held out an amount of money equal to a plane ticket in case that scenario presented itself, and I had a great time in Costa Rica. I moved back with more money than I left with.

Just curious -

$60k for 40 acres and a home

What state are you in and how far from a big city?

It's in the Ozarks, and it's 2.5 hours from Little Rock, 90 minutes from Branson. So quite far.

What's the broadband like?

“Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure nineteen nineteen and six , result happiness. Annual income twenty pounds, annual expenditure twenty pounds ought and six, result misery”

― Charles Dickens, David Copperfield

1, I see clearly as skill.

2, risk management skills can be learned. Risk taking though, I've always regarded as a question of temperament. I'm personally close to zero risk affinity and don't feel an emotion (yes not reason) to take any financial risk, at all (other risk, too, really). To the contrary, mind and body squirm at the thought.

3, this seems unnecessarily tied to "winning". What if I really don't care about winning? Also, if this is really a skill, what is it called? How does progression look like?

3 - I'd agree that it is not really a skill so much as an effect with many possible actionable causes, some of which can be trained. I think you and OP are actually coming at this from a similar angle if you indeed don't really care about winning. OP's point is that many people get sucked into doing things for reasons other than their impact on their long term happiness. Competitiveness, addiction, lack of experimentation can all lead to inefficient return on effort. There are likely many skills that can improve on these, but introspection towards your feelings/emotions to understand how your emotions respond to externalities is probably a cornerstone of many of them.

That’s a fair response.

The reason I’d call this a skill is because you could screw it up on purpose—-it’s not random.

To achieve this outcome you need to know of your values, be aware of your current emotional state (and the outside factors influencing it), and have the techniques to exert more control over your internal state than the outside factors are seeking to exert.

To me, it’s like driving a van in very windy conditions. The skill is to not get blown off the road.

> To me, it’s like driving a van in very windy conditions.

Love that analogy!

I`ve made a reply to your original post, but I`d like to add to my earlier question. Any books or resources or suggestions on defining values, techniques to exert more control over my internal state?

Thanks again.

I've been thinking about how to answer your question, and I realized I just can't do it in this form.

One of the things I've learned over the years is that advice must be tailored to the individual to be useful, and I don't know anything about you.

Feel free to reach me at biren@birenshah.com.

For #2, I can’t speak to your values. It seems unlikely you’ve never taken any risk in your life. Of course, not knowing you, I can’t say for sure, but I’d bet you only choose to pursue “sure things”.

I’ll save you the philosophy about missed gains, but instead ask—what if your “sure things” were only 99% probable? They’d be at least somewhat risky, no?

Would you still do them? And, for the things you have done, how can you be certain of the outcome, any outcome, beyond that level of confidence?

Maybe for someone as risk averse as you, #2 is beyond the point of diminishing returns. But for anyone who doesn’t fit that bill, I’d say #2 is critical.

How do you know what you want?

For starter, https://psychclassics.yorku.ca/Maslow/motivation.htm

The funny thing about “knowing what you want” is that it’s incredibly simple—on paper.

All you have to do is have the most basic level of experience (any 18 year old has enough). Pay attention as you go, and do more of what brings you “joy” and less of what makes you feel bad.

Good and bad feeling are terribly defined in the English language, so to be clear, joy in this sense is more a mix of flow, fulfillment and a sense of high regard rather than anything that might be more linked with pleasure. Dancing can bring you joy, going to the club, getting drunk, and finding a one-night stand probably won’t, even if there’s music involved.

In practice, it gets hard because there are so many external forces imposing themselves on us, shouting so we only hear them, intentionally drowning out our inner voices. They do this on purpose so they can control us. The message is usually in the form of what “high status” is and telling us what we have to do to achieve it. There’s rarely any overlap between what they tell us to do and what brings us joy.

I guess this all boils down to: if you want to know what you want, learn to listen to yourself only, in the face of all this noise. Status is a siren song.

In my view, risk is probability times impact. On average, risking a dollar and spending a dollar are equivalent.

Where I think we get risk wrong is how we estimate its magnitude, often due to emotional fear of loss, or underestimating our own ability to innovate our way out of problems.

First time I've heard about "hedonic treadmill". Found a little bit of information about the concept, very interesting, but can't seem to find a similar concept/translation in spanish.

"No ser menos que los demás" seems to be the same concept as "keeping up with the Joneses." For "hedonic treadmill" I imagine something similar to "carrera de ratas" would be closest. Would be interested to hear if anyone else has an oft used translation!

1. For some reason I always ignored ebay auctions. I wanted a guarantee and a fixed price. Although used items are available through this model I never bought any because the seller demands e.g. 50€ for an obsolete soldering station with hard to source tips.

Turns out, most of used items are actually sold for a reasonable price at those ebay auctions. Nobody on earth is going to bid 50€ on that soldering station, so you will actually find good deals. You can often get away with paying the minimum price as well because nobody else bid on that item. I got stuff 50% off which makes buying used actually worth it. I'm talking about stuff that one uses for a few weeks and then just collects dust in a drawer. Like a raspberry pi 3 kit with power supply, case, SD card selling for 40€ including shipping. If you bought this stuff used for a fixed price you'd pay 70€ for it so most people just buy everything new for 80€. I know that because that's what I've done my entire life and I always felt like this was a waste of resources.

Your number 2 point, ‘learn how to take risk’ isn’t something you ever master, like “learning to play piano” or another discrete skill where you develop a level of proficiency that then guaranteed you can perform successfully at an arbitrary level. Trading is incredibly frustrating in that regard. (Yes, trading is not the only form of risk taking, but it’s my profession and what I focus on). Even after doing it successfully for 20+ years o can’t really explain or teach how to do it, like I would if I was an experienced carpenter , musician, accountant.

I think the important lesson that SHOULD be learned about risk is very simple but incredibly important to long term success— avoid existential risk. In trading this typically manifests as people “selling wings” — ie selling very low probability options that have enormous downside in the exceptionally rare case they come to the strike price. Another variation I avoid is taking personal leverage on my own investments. Yeah I don’t make as much in the good times, but I also am never annihilated by a margin call.

  These two things happen all the time, and way more often than everyone but grizzled survivors appreciate.

Thank you for sharing your thoughts!

Could you point me towards books or some other resources that go in to more detail about number 2. that you`ve found useful, and others(although they are more or less self explanatory).

In the modern era the single most important skill is to manage distractions. There are so many things, this site included, that can prevent you from accomplishing your goals via distraction.

Obviously a little distraction and fun is good. But these days it easier than ever to waste an entire day or two watching Netflix and staring at your phone.

I want to emphasize this one. When I'm on deadline, I am amazing at avoiding distractions and as a result, I'm super productive. When the deadline is far out, I yield to distractions. Avoiding distractions is a key way for me to be production.

> But these days it easier than ever to waste an entire day or two watching Netflix and staring at your phone.

It is also worth looking at all these distractions (which turn to addictions sometimes - addictions playing the same role) as means to avoiding emotions which arise when we look at real problems and start to solve them. Somehow our emotions pull us back into this lake of low level, auto-pilot functioning where status quo is maintained and nothing new happens. Emotions trick us here.

For anyone interested, Indistractable by Nir Eyal is a good read on this topic. The premise is that distraction is a mechanism that the mind uses to deal with discomfort. He talks about solving the the root cause (emotions) rather than just trying to solve a proximate cause (technology).

> entire day or two watching Netflix and staring at your phone

More like years, nowadays. Some people (most?) never recover at all, because it's cheaper and more addictive than smoking. Apple's detailed time tracking was a revelation. We discovered that my wife (who is currently out of a job due to COVID) was speding 8+ hours every day on her iPhone and iPad alone, and I myself was spending entirely too much time on my mobile devices as well. I managed to cut down to about 1.5 hours a day. She's still struggling with it. And it's hard. I have to leave my phone upstairs so I don't relapse.

What do you do with all your extra spare time? Are you learning some skill or are you relaxing in some other way not related to technology?

There's plenty to do: I can have hobbies again. I have finished a lot of old projects in the past 6 months, some of which sat in my garage for almost a decade. It's really satisfying. I'm practicing on the guitar again, too. That alone will soak up all the spare time you might have.

That's cool to hear, and motivational. I'd like to learn how to play the guitar and how to draw. Getting started is challenging though, especially with the distractions from phones.

Exactly. Every time going gets hard there's a temptation to just fire up the browser or youtube. You have to make a conscious effort to _not_ do this. You have to also be _bored_ to do anything of value. It's very easy to be entertained nowadays. Similarly to cake, entertainment is good only in moderation, though.

Probably the most important skill people are skipping is etiquette. Which I think says a lot about HN.

Communication (texting, listening, etc), maintaining and creating relationships, avoiding injury, relaxation, exercise, cooking, healthy eating, self defense, first aid, swimming, types of reading (fun, searching, learning), searching, separating truth from fiction, knowing when to seek help, a hobby, cleaning, maintenance, organization, managing money, taxes, investing, personal grooming, shopping, transportation (public transit, biking, driving etc.), reading a map, looking for work, putting something together from instructions.

PS: Maintaining physical and mental heath is not really a specific skill, but much of the above falls under that category.

Social etiquette drives me up the wall sometimes. I get it, it's necessary, and I do follow it, but there are some that just make zero sense.

In fact, most of them make no sense. It's just social constructs made by people, and some go to war over it. Ridiculous. I don't want to shake hands, I don't want to smile, I don't want to sit down if you do.

It's like, why does it matter to you? I literally couldn't give half a fork about it, so if I can learn to forget the more detailed bullshit, so can you. Focus on what matters, not whether I'm slouching or not.

Etiquette is really a language. If you mean red and say blue people can only go by what you said. Specific words have specific meanings because of convention not some innate property of the universe.

Similarly, body language has a specific meaning based on convention, so people will assume you mean what your saying.

PS: The posture convention is based on norms of physical fitness and body weight which make standing up strait close to the default. Assuming being overweight becomes the long term norm things may change.

Eh, isn't that why language was invented? Late Stephen Hawking would've had a hard time with body language and even intonation. Fortunately, we have words that convey exactly what we want.

Edit: To your point, physical disabilities are meaningful, but hawking is in large part known for his difficulties communicating not being rude. Etiquette still applies to the written word for example.

Anyway, you can’t speak without interrupting the speaker, but you can gesture. Similarly, people don’t constantly walk around repeating I am angry/sad/happy/etc. Etiquette is a constant framework and channel of communication where spoken language is for specifics. The words you say can be less important than the volume, timing, etc of how you say them. Grunts may work assuming they fit in with social conventions.

The grammar of etiquette is similarly important. Prisoners may fight each other, but the vast majority of the time their doing something else. Fail to communicate well, and it may just get you killed.

PS: Though I may be overusing the etiquette as language analogy, it’s a very close fit.

> Fortunately, we have words that convey exactly what we want.

Words can be just as fuzzy as body language. Sometimes, this can be done intentionally, for dramatic effect (e.g. "The duke yet lives that Henry shall depose"). English can have syntactic ambiguity, which limits the understanding of a phrase. In the sentence "I saw the man on the mountain with the telescope.", was I using a telescope to see the man on the mountain, or did I observe that the man on the mountain was himself looking through a telescope? [0]

Whether words are to be taken literally or metaphorically depends entirely on the context and the audience. Heck, the same word can be functioning both literally and metaphorically within the same sentence [1]. In the sentence "He took his hat and his leave", the word "took" is literal in the phrase "took his hat", but metaphorical in the phrase "took his leave".

There's an entire class of errors [2] related to encoding of thoughts to speech not matching the decoding of speech to thoughts.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Syntactic_ambiguity

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeugma_and_syllepsis

[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aberrant_decoding

Edit: This may have come off a bit harsh, but that was not my intent. I had the same understanding ten years ago, that the uncertainty of communication can only be shackled by the rigidity of language. I found that I had built my house upon sand, for there is nothing sturdy to be found within language, and seekers will find only chaos and descriptivism.

Good answer! Wittgenstein’s philosophical work also adds an extra critique to this view of language.

[1] https://philosophyforchange.wordpress.com/2014/03/11/meaning...

> metaphorical in the phrase "took his leave"

How so? Surely "took his leave" is quite literal, meaning he left. See https://www.lexico.com/definition/take_one%27s_leave

I think it telegraphs if you care about us or not. If you dont care about what I think, what will happen if down the road things get rocky? You probably wont care about me then either and will bail or be unreliable.

What? And if you force me to do your social song and dance, does that telegraph that you don't care about me?

I care about the person and the work. Not about whether they hold their spoon and knife in the right hand.

Etiquette sends a strong signal that you're socially reliable. Working in groups is difficult and you can't just brute force it by waving your hands and saying you only care about the work or about being nice or whatever. Disagreements happen constantly and you can't just fight or disband the group every time you don't reach consensus, or you can but your group will be quickly outcompeted by a more functional group. Etiquette and other social skills allow for continued cooperation in social circumstances with many moving parts and competing interests. Doing things like sitting down when others sit down, etc. are really just table stakes. If you don't have the basics of reading a situation and applying rudimentary social norms appropriately you're kind of socially radioactive and will be treated accordingly, i.e. you won't move on to the more interesting interactions and you'll be placed in a baby zone unless people need to negotiate with you for specific resources. Programmers can get away with this better than most because it's a skill people need, but it's still kind of a disaster not to get decent with this stuff and you probably won't even understand how much it's damaging you.

It's quite sad that you've needed to put that much thought into an explanation.

It actually does take that much thought though! Social dynamics are extremely complex to model, and they are way more important than we think. There is a lot of complex game theory and metagaming going on. Most of it goes over my head, but people's "gut feeling" about others takes a lot of things into account(what they know that I know, etc...). Communicating while maintaining good gut feelings is not easy! We basically need to hack our own minds to get things right.

And if they did something more extreme like for example literally eat like a walrus? That wouldn't weird you out even a little bit? Nothing in the back of your mind would say "watch out for that guy, he seems a bit psychopath-y"?

It shouldn't, because the best people at playing the etiquette game are the ones you shouldn't trust.

Which is why it's an important skill to learn. Because you too can exploit it for personal gain.

> because the best people at playing the etiquette game are the ones you shouldn't trust.

Evidence?

This assumes that “the etiquette game” is fundamentally untrustworthy, unimportant, or trivial.

I guess it is if you treat it as a game. I'm kinda surprised that even things like shaking hands and smiling are treated with so much disdain by some people. It just seems like Being Friendly 101 to me.

Agreed :). I mean I think it’s both. When learning new social norms, or, in certain environments there is a game-like aspect.

But I don’t use the word game as a pejorative.

> The best people at playing the etiquette game are the ones you shouldn't trust.

I can totally see that this is true in some circles(e.g. sales people). But in other circles (e.g. education/some types of customer service), etiquette can be a good indicator of how willing someone is to assist. Like many things in this space, this varies so much depending on someone's situation(e.g. line of work, culture, industry, circle of friends, etc...)

Once you accept human nature for what it is, etiquette makes sense.

Truthfully, to not accept the scientific findings on the human animal (social, not always rationally, powerfully influenced by appearances, emotion, etc, you know — human) is irrational.

Lol which doesn’t make it any easier sometimes ;).

My two cents.

Social etiquette is about respect and care for others as well as yourself, lack of etiquette in my mind is a display of lack of self awareness at best, and self centered/narcissism at worst.

Etiquette is often about social status, and social signalling of group/clique belonging: perhaps that is the part you rail against?

A sibling comment says: “I think it telegraphs if you care about us or not“, but I would translate that to mean whether you care to show you belong to their group or not.

I also loath some etiquette because it is meaningless: more about exclusion than politeness or showing you care.

It is extremely similar to dressing appropriately for the social crowd you are interacting with: you can use your own social norms but people won’t accept you so easily.

> avoiding injury

The average life expectancy for a girl born in the UK today is ~90 years. The bodies of our children are nearly century long projects. Health is a real concern for them.

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/healthan...

Keep in mind that etiquette is highly subjective and culture-specific. As English speakers a lot of ours is derived from traditional British customs, even if you’re not a native of a former colony.

For instance, saying “excuse me” before you barge in front of someone to get something off the shelf at a shop. I’m American, so that is obvious. I live in Estonia, and here you either 1) stand awkwardly and wait for them to move because you don’t want to interact with them or 2) just shove in front of them and grab what you want and leave.

The first time I took my then girlfriend to the UK she did that and the woman she dove in front of looked at me like “WTF?”. I apologized and then had to explain to my girlfriend that that isn’t acceptable in English-based countries. She was genuinely confused and asked how she should do it instead. Even though she speaks English fluently, there is only so much you learn from Cartoon Network (I kid you not, many have learned English that way) and YouTube. She wasn’t trying to be rude, she just genuinely had no idea it was coming off that way.

The same also applies to standing in lines, getting on and off public transit, and many other things.

Edit: oh, and table manners. My $diety, the table manners... I don’t expect you to be able to set a formal place setting (though I can), but we aren’t animals, you should know how to use a napkin, not to double dip your chips, etc.

True - but I’d also say that part of good etiquette is to make an effort to learn the basics of the culture in which you’re participating. If I’m traveling to China for business it’s incumbent upon me to learn the order in which people should be introduced, how to exchange business cards etc.

Indeed, being able to quickly perceive and adapt to the prevailing etiquette of your surroundings is the graduate level of learning etiquette.

Table manners too are so culture specific though. Who am I (a Briton) to insist that roti should be eaten with fork and knife, rather than finger-formed into a shovel, at an Indian restaurant? Or to object to slurping from bowls hovering off the table at a Chinese one?

That said, if the setting is English, (/French/¿European?) I despise seeing, for example, fork and knife cack-handed.

(I wouldn't worry about your chip 'double-dipping' being a snobbishly high bar!)

Listening.

Spending 70% of what you make(either make more or spend less). Save 30% of what you make (make more or spend less)(see the pattern?)

Read books. Minimum 6 per year. Aim for 1 per month and see how it works out.

Pick your news sources carefully. Don't read ALL the news. Reading about the imports of Beetroots in Slovenia has zero impact to your life (unless you are in the beetroot business in Ljubljana).

Chose what to click/read. Everyone and everything wants your attention/time/money. Give it to the things that YOU will benefit from (to avoid misunderstandings: volunteering for -unpaid- charity work is good for YOU/your soul).

Edit - News: I scroll in the "front page" of 5-6 websites, read just the titles. I only read the analyses that seem intelligent, opinion articles that will challenge me. Just the facts, without aby analysis and or historical references can be misleading.

As someone who finds many "social etiquette" practices painful, cringe-worthy, and the cause of many communication breakdowns, I would actually like to learn more about the benefits of social etiquette, and how I can improve on it.

Does anyone have any good resources to point me to?

Etiquette is a signal to others that you are a good person and follow the rules of society. This is extremely important in a world with an increasing population, in which you only have a few seconds of contact with most people. In these few seconds, people judge your character based on the only information they have available:

1. How you dress

2. How physically fit you are

3. How you conform to societal standards

I would argue that most people should not judge a person's character by 1 and 2 (although they are good measures of affluence). What is left is number 3.

If you are someone that breaks some small societal standards, how do I know you won't break larger ones? If we don't share the same assumptions on how we should behave, how can I possibly feel safe around you?

Miss Manners' books/articles are good.

With the exception of listening every single one of the skills you've listed is about yourself. There's nothing about empathy, sympathy, helping other people, or even understanding other people.

If you want to really get ahead in life, learn to understand other people, know what pains they're suffering, and figure out how to solve them. You will never do that well if you're entirely focused on yourself.

How do you think it’s possible to create and maintain relationships without empathy, sympathy, helping other people, or even understanding them? I genuinely don’t understand why you think these are separate.

Among my top recommended life skills that I think may help people is the ability to manage one's feelings. You can train yourself to respond to fears and anxieties in productive ways, navigating through challenging life situations without being reduced to a minimal version of who you are.

Don't take the following as an authoritative source on the subject. Use it to get started on your own path of development.

1. Meditation. It's in fashion for a very good reason. People continue to recommend it as the single most valuable practice one can adopt to improve oneself. As you grow more mindful of your feelings, you can better manage them. Meditation is a practice. You can think of it as going to the gym for half an hour and training on one single muscle. The more you train, the stronger that muscle gets!

2. Cognitive behavior therapy (CBT). This is a broad subject. A therapist is very helpful, if you can afford one, but own your self improvement and try not to depend on financially unsustainable counseling. Therapy is very helpful and sometimes essential. Use it to acquire life skills. The aspect of CBT that I would like to draw attention to involves the ability to manage fears and anxieties, and consequently depression, using the process of identifying cognitive distortions and reframing concerns. A great intro book to the subject is "Feeling Good" by David Burns, who recently published a sequel, "Feeling Great" after almost forty years of development since the book was published. Burns has a blog, podcast, and teamed up with product folks to create an upcoming mobile app.

3. Rest and recovery. Initially, I was just going to mention sleep, which is a very tough subject, especially when dealing with insomnia. Not resting enough taxes the system. Plan down time and protect it. Address insomnia holistically.

Be well, my friends.

I think you should have mentioned the single most important aspect of CBT: what you do can (and almost certainly will) affect how you feel. Since changing what you do tends to be easier than (just) changing how you feel, CBT encourages people to change their behaviors as a pathway to feeling better.

Cooking cooking cooking. You’ll eat probably until the day you die. Might as well figure out how to feed yourself in a way that sustains you and brings some joy to you and possibly to others.

This is by far the most important thing I can think of, followed shortly by being able to maintain a regular, high-quality exercise regimen.

Meal prep is the key to keeping the discipline in terms of cooking cheap, high-quality meals for yourself. If you understand some fundamentals about how to store food and scaling recipes up, you can leverage your time very well. In a given week, I spend ~2 hours in the kitchen total. Of this, about 1 hour is spent per week doing meal prep. The other hour is time spent re-heating or preparing the final meal for consumption across each day.

The most powerful way to engage this is using simple, predicable, efficient tools & processes. I use very few tools in my kitchen. Iron skillet, 2.5qt iron pot for frying, and an instant pot for pressure cooking. That's about it. I prepare stuff in ~1 week batches, usually on weekends.

I spend ~$150/m on groceries, and maybe $100/year on food that I don't make for myself. Every meal I eat is arguably of very high quality compared to available alternative vendors. Watching others order door dash every single day as their sole source of sustenance has me somewhat disappointed in society. The amount of money most people spend on food is incredible to me, especially considering the quality in most cases.

Do you have this process documented anywhere ? Would like to learn it.

I don't have it written down, but I have been applying things like lean manufacturing principles to the kitchen. I.e. looking at and optimizing various subtasks and figuring out why they take so long or why the cleanup is such a PITA afterwards.

I would say that my process is probably incompatible with the preferences and physical kitchen layout of others, so you need to find something that works for you specifically. If you are having trouble figuring it out, start asking the following:

> What do I like to eat?

> Am I willing to cook it for myself on a weekly basis?

> (presumption) Why not?

> Here is where you start getting recursive with why-why-why.

I've been doing Blue Apron and then Sun Basket for years now. Definitely very different than bob1029's plan - I spend 3-4 hours per week cooking, and something like 4x the price. (My main reason is choice / planning fatigue).

In the beginning, 2 serving meals would take me ~hour. Now, 4 serving meals take me ~30m, and I usually end with a clean kitchen.

As bob says, key to that is "very few tools". Generally, cutting board, knife, pan, metal spatula (love it), sometimes mixing bowls.

Another key: Plate (or store) everything immediately, and then rinse it all. Bonus points if the pan's still hot enough that it cleans itself when you rinse. Basically no mess this way, it's amazing.

Do you have details of your process and recipes put online? Maybe some other useful links?

I didn't know spending this little time on cooking was possible, would love to learn it myself.

One trick these days is to take advantage of semi-prepared food (sliced mushrooms, chopped onions, etc.) in the supermarket. It probably won't be quite as fresh and will end up costing you a bit more--so I don't usually do it--but it's a way to do stir fries, pasta, etc. pretty quickly and easily.

Even before the pandemic, I was mostly working at home when I wasn't traveling. But when I was going into an office regularly I tended to have a list of recipes that I knew I could throw together in 20 minutes or so.

The other way to optimize time is to make stews and casseroles that will often take a bit longer but which you might get 3 or 4 meals out of. (You can freeze some so it doesn't get too monotonous.)

Now scale this for a family, 3x per day for different tastes. Can be done, but this is where the true skill of cooking and planning shines.

I am envious of your food budget. A mere pound of chicken breast at my local grocery store costs ~$10/lb, though they range from about ~$5-10lb. However, at the cheaper end, the meat is a demonstrably lower quality, with odd texture issues due to chickens growing so fast (the condition is called 'woody chicken'). Your budget would get me 15 lbs of protein. That's just not enough food for 2 people (my household size). I spend about $400/month grocery shopping (like you, nearly all meals eaten at home).

My grocery expenses are similar to yours for two people, and we do most of our cooking at home as well. I have the same problem with meat that you do. It's hard to buy good meat cheaply.

Vegetarian meals don't have to be sad. Indian cuisine is often veggie and exceptionally good. Meera Sodha's book Fresh India [0] is a goldmine for cheap veggie recipies that you wouldn't miss meat from (I say this as someone who likes meat!)

[0] https://www.amazon.co.uk/Fresh-India-Delicious-Vegetarian-Re...

If budget is a pressing concern maybe don't get chicken breast? It's far from the most affordable source of protein.

Depending on where you live, you might be able to buy live chickens and have them butchered for cheaper than $10/lb. If you get really lucky, you might also be able to find a farmer that raises, butchers, packages, and sells chicken directly. We've got a place like that here (Idaho), but it's really out of the way. When we shop there, it's usually 3-4 hours to get out there, buy a bunch of meat, and drive back. Really high quality stuff though -- it's a night and day difference from the stuff you buy at the grocery store. Same applies to beef, especially if you've got freezer space for large quantities. Occasionally, we'll split half a cow with one or two other families. It's a few hundred dollars of expense up front, but in return, you can be really picky about how the cows were raised, know exactly where the meat came from, get specific cuts of meat, etc.

If meat is important to you in your diet, I highly recommend looking around for something like that! It's a bit of work but I've found it to be extremely worthwhile.

Cooking is essential. Jumping into meal prepping for there, is another thing. Meal prepping saves you some time, but if you actually like cooking and enjoy fresh meals, this is not necessarily a good thing.

Meal prepping falls into the productivity porn category for me.

Sort of depends what's meant by it I suppose (unless it's a well-defined term I haven't come across before) - I enjoy cooking, and that includes pickling, canning, other things that aren't meals but might result in a future meal being pretty quick and easy. That's not why I do it, but it is a result.

Best example I can think of is my current addiction (almost every weekday lunch) to chopped courgettes, onions, and whole cherry tomatoes pickled in distilled vinegar & olive oil with (home-grown ;)) rosemary & thyme, on top of thick slices of (home-baked ;)) bread, few spoonfulls of the vinegar & oil for good measure, then topped with slices of decent (but not too expensive, and sadly not home-made!) cheddar and then put under the grill (aka AmE broiler). Served with pickled chillies.

Takes maybe five minutes to make that lunch, given I've already made the bread and pickled the vegetables. But I don't view it as 'productivity porn'. (But then, not 'meal prepping' either.)

Also, if I make say lasagne, there's one of me, so the other 5-7 slices go in the freezer; presumably that's 'meal prepping' too. But I do 'actually like cooking and enjoy fresh meals', so typically what happens is I have to stop cooking and eat the stuff I've frozen because the freezer's full so there's no room for new leftovers!

> In a given week, I spend ~2 hours in the kitchen total.

I have been thinking about it because I spend significant more time than that. Maybe, you make only salads

2 hours in the kitchen for a weeks' worth of meals is ludicrous if you're doing anything that I would call cooking. The cleanup on some days alone takes 1 hour. And if you're using more than a handful of ingredients, how would you even cut and peel and blend.

And definitely no baking or fermenting or any other chemical processes.

Relatedly: meal planning. Turning raw ingredients into food is only the last step. Just as important is figuring out what meals to prepare, what ingredients you’ll need, how to efficiently use those ingredients, how to take advantage of leftovers, etc.

And then the next extension of cooking and meal planning is knowing about good nutrition. An hour or two learning about things like protein, carbohydrates, fats, fibre, salt, vitamins and minerals, and calories can make a huge difference to how nutritious and well-balanced your meals are forever.

You can always switch ingredients. It helps if you are out-of-stock for one then you are able to switch for another

In our community (garhwalis), we are taught to cook from a very young age informally. Identifying spices, combinations, tempering, different ways of cooking, different curry preparations and how to optimize/ prepare with different ingredients is a common theme of growing up. To be honest I am quite glad it is still being taught and probably I will pass it on to my kids as well. Absolutely indispensable and important.

Here's Lazarus Long's list, from Heinlein's "Time Enough for Love", which I had actually just posted on another thread recently:

"A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects."

I'd possibly leave out the militaristic stuff, but the rest of it is pretty much spot on :)

Counterpoint from Mr S. Holmes :)

Only learn skills that are truly applicable to your life.

"You see," he explained, "I consider that a man's brain originally is like a little empty attic, and you have to stock it with such furniture as you choose. A fool takes in all the lumber of every sort that he comes across, so that the knowledge which might be useful to him gets crowded out, or at best is jumbled up with a lot of other things, so that he has difficulty laying his hands upon it. Now the skillful workman is very careful indeed as to what he takes into his brain-attic. He will have nothing but the tools which may help him in doing his work, but of these he has a large assortment, and all in the most perfect order. It is a mistake to think that that little room has elastic walls and can distend to any extent. Depend upon it there comes a time when for every addition of knowledge you forget something that you knew before. It is of the highest importance, therefore, not to have useless facts elbowing out the useful ones." "But the Solar System!" [Dr. Watson] protested.

"What of the deuce is it to me?" he interrupted impatiently: "you say that we go round the sun. If we went round the moon it would not make a pennyworth of difference to me or to my work."

I actually sort of agree with that. It doesn't have to be stuff you need to do but you do need to pick and choose.

For example, while I'm not ignorant of how a car works, I did make at least an implicit decision a very long time ago that working on cars wasn't going to be one of the ways I spent my time. And while I do certain things around the house, I get someone in for major jobs and for electricity/plumbing generally.

Completely agree that having a fundamental understanding of most things is good, but that it’s more important to know what you don’t know than to really and truly know something.

Changing a tire? Yes, you should know that (or, honestly, be able to intuit it, it’s not exactly complex). Being able to change the oil, a fan belt, or coolant? Yeah, I know I could if I had to, but with the hazardous waste and all it’s far from worth it for me to try to.

Of course, "run-flat" tires are increasingly common these days and the crap jacks that are almost always the from-the-factory standard can make it near impossible to change a tire in non-ideal situations.

And you should also know how to jump-start a vehicle which is almost certainly something you'll need to do sooner or later. Also add washer fluid.

But yeah, the engine compartment isn't some mysterious magical box to me but the vast majority of things I get done for me.

(My parents also never did any car work and I didn't own a car until I had a professional job.)

Note that every single item from the parent comment is actually applicable, practical skill, unlike the knowledge about the solar system.

It's very unlikely that I or the OP will ever,

butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, build a wall, set a bone, or pitch manure.

And recognizing that these aren't personally valuable skills is a worthwhile skill.

I'd argue that at least knowing the basics of splinting is a good skill to have. (I keep up to date on wilderness first aid.) And many people know and sometimes use the basics of sailing/seamanship--it's not something exotic. I wouldn't really say I can "design a building" but I know some basics of construction which I think is pretty common.

This never made sense because people are different.

Plenty of awesome people with valuable skills would be unable to do half of those things.

Is there a wiki-how compilation for all of these?

I've got the first one down, but lose steam at "plan an invasion".

My dad was an officer in the Marine Corps and spent time working on contingency planning—basically, planning invasions just in case they had to carry them out. He ended up being resentful about the Grenada intervention because his plan (written in the 1960’s) was far more efficient than what they ended up doing.

The only actionable advice I remember is basically to think critically about the information you’re given. If your plan hinges on storing fuel in a tank that seems to exist in the middle of a farm for no obvious reason, investigate a little more deeply. Maybe it’s a sugar cane farm and a tank of molasses. If so, not a solution for storing fuel.

Kipling's If:

  If you can keep your head when all about you   
      Are losing theirs and blaming it on you,   
  If you can trust yourself when all men doubt you,
      But make allowance for their doubting too;   
  If you can wait and not be tired by waiting,
      Or being lied about, don’t deal in lies,
  Or being hated, don’t give way to hating,
      And yet don’t look too good, nor talk too wise:

  If you can dream—and not make dreams your master;   
      If you can think—and not make thoughts your aim;   
  If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
      And treat those two impostors just the same;   
  If you can bear to hear the truth you’ve spoken
      Twisted by knaves to make a trap for fools,
  Or watch the things you gave your life to, broken,
      And stoop and build ’em up with worn-out tools:

  If you can make one heap of all your winnings
      And risk it on one turn of pitch-and-toss,
  And lose, and start again at your beginnings
      And never breathe a word about your loss;
  If you can force your heart and nerve and sinew
      To serve your turn long after they are gone,   
  And so hold on when there is nothing in you
      Except the Will which says to them: ‘Hold on!’

  If you can talk with crowds and keep your virtue,   
      Or walk with Kings—nor lose the common touch,
  If neither foes nor loving friends can hurt you,
      If all men count with you, but none too much;
  If you can fill the unforgiving minute
      With sixty seconds’ worth of distance run,   
  Yours is the Earth and everything that’s in it,   
      And—which is more—you’ll be a Man, my son!

Timeless. Thank you.

This is the only "life advice" that i have framed and put up in my room. Very idealistic and hard to live up to (we are biological Animals after all) but nevertheless something we should all strive towards.

Learn to control your primordial[1] mind.

The next time you have elemental cravings for food, drink, sex, and other more-short-term dopamine hints (people pleasing, superficial personal relationships, appeasing, etc.), not in line with your goals, stick to your goals.

This is a big part of military courses.[2] You're capable of a lot more than you think (at a physical level, what you think of as your max is likely 30-40% of your capacity.. be cognizant though that 70-100% borderlines on death, but it's unlikely a person not training for a long-time would have to worry about hitting those limits).[3] The same thing applies up each level of Maslow's hierarchy.

Many consumer businesses are built on you not doing so and conflating convenience and activities slowly detrimental to healthy life goals. The best thing you can do is practice slowly not doing those things. Every time you stick to your pre-frontal cortex and don't give in to your primordial mind, you become stronger at more difficult things. And it compounds. Each basis point (eating healthy v. eating unhealthy; learning how to cook something well, etc.; putting down that TikTok feed; persisting with that design or SaaS side project, etc.) compounds.

Charlie Mike.

[1] https://www.amazon.com/General-Theory-Love-Thomas-Lewis-eboo...

[2] https://bootcampmilitaryfitnessinstitute.com/media/tv-docume...

[3] https://www.forbes.com/sites/chrismyers/2017/10/06/the-40-ru...

Cooking (proper food not junk), growing your own food, personal finances, how to manage emotions, carpentry, welding, how to enjoy time by your own, languages (the more the better), how to do basic fixing of appliances (see RepairCaffe), learn the joy of not to stop learning, sleeping habits, health habits, be conscious what you want at work to be happy (depressed Manager or happy technician)...

To be continued... nice thread!

Habits for Eating, Sleeping, Exercise, Finances (as we live in a capitalist system), Learning, Self Awareness.

How do you manage emotions? Do you have any tips?

Practice mindfulness. You don't have to actually meditate, but just try and take some time each day to conciously think about something that made you feel emotional, and why you reacted the way you did; I normally do it while taking a shower. Eventually it'll become a habit where something happens that would normally trigger an emotional response, and you'll be able to react in a way that helps with the situation instead of just having an emotional outburst. You don't have to stop feeling emotional, but you shouldn't act purely on emotion.

> growing your own food

Some people like doing this one and really get into it, but for the most part, no one grows food with enough macronutriets to sustain themselves. Potatoes are the main exception.

Learn how to take care of yourself first. That includes: * learning to cook and prepare your own food. * learn proper sleeping habits and make a routine that feels comfortable. * learn to exercise - pick an activity and do it consistently with some goals in mind. * learn to budget money and manage expenses. * learn to groom yourself and maintain a regular cleanliness routine * learn to entertain yourself alone - without the internet (ex. reading a book, telling a story, etc) * learn how devices you own work and how to troubleshoot/repair them (ex. fridge, ac, oven, car) The general theme I have is that "the things you own, end up owning you", if you are not accountable for them. Start with the things you can't get rid of like your body and then question everything else you introduce into your life to eliminate clutter. Examples: - if you don't know how to prepare food your diet depends on what restaurants offer and you have little control over ingredients, portion size, calorie intake... - if you pass out in front of the tv and wake up on the couch it is unlikely that you will feel motivated in the morning. Likely you will pick up McDonald's breakfast on the way to work cause you are running late. - if you give up on exercising your body you will quickly feel powerless when you have to move something heavy.

Develop critical thinking. For example, examining a news article. Why is it news? Who is reporting it? What is the intent of their reporting? Etc.

Develop inquisitiveness. Related to critical thinking. Always be asking 'why?'.

Develop grace, encompassing manners, humility, self-control, compassion, etc.

Learn how to interact with government and institutions. For example, how do you even hire a lawyer? When should you?

Personal finance, as others mention, but I see a great many false prophets in that area. IMHO there doesn't seem to be any proven method. One rule I follow is 'never borrow to consume', though that may depend on how enlightened the society you live in is. Everyone needs to eat after all.

For practical skills,

Cooking. It may become obsolete in future, but being able to cook a basic meal is useful and satisfying.

Gardening, basic farming. Again, eating a lettuce you grew yourself is quite satisfying.

If you didn't get a standard western upbringing, then all the basics; learn to swim, ride a bike, tie a shoelace and a necktie, basic knots, basic music/play an instrument, host a party, basic painting/drawing, sportsmanship, read, write, at least, algebra, etc.

How to manage yourself when tragedy inevitably strikes

How to take advantage of people... that way they are less likely to be taken advantage of

Restraint enough that, though they know how, they don’t take advantage of others

How to look for sense of self satisfaction within yourself rather than in the approval of others

Not really a skill, but a habit of intense exercise at least 30m a day. Running and swimming are great for this.

Similarly, a habit of reading books.

Personal finance

> How to manage yourself when tragedy inevitably strikes

This is a place where, in my opinion, religion is seriously overlooked in modern culture.

The times when my religious upbringing have been most useful to me have all been in the face tragedy.

Another benefit of Religion is community. I recall back when we went to Church we had tons of people who took the time to reach out when things weren't going well.

That's easily the difference between being an isolated island of a person, miserable thinking the world is against you. Or being a bit down, and getting a hand up.

Completely agree. It's frustrating to see so many people dismiss the value of a religion when it has the potential to offer so many benefits. Of course there's plenty of dogma but what we've replaced religion with does not seem to be significantly better.

Def a utility of religion. You can find it as well in various schools of philosophy

I used to be religious, but I came to a point where I just didn't believe it anymore. Religion is no longer useful to me, not because it was ever real, but because I've convinced myself it's not real.

I've replaced it with philosophy and meditation-- it actually seems to do the job much better, and doesn't require any particular leaps in logic on my part.

> I've replaced it with philosophy and meditation

Philosophy and meditation are just religion by another name in my opinion. At least in terms of the practical application of religion, which is sadly neglected by most branches of modern Christianity.

> Philosophy and meditation are just religion by another name in my opinion.

I agree that they may be similar in practice, but I want to make sure you understand that they are fundamentally different in every other aspect. The biggest difference is that religion believes it has a monopoly on an explanation of the metaphysical, and therefore shuts out other philosophies. This is the height of human hubris.

There are many different philosophies, and all of them are merely ideas, and none of them claim to be the exclusive explanation of the metaphysical.

Meditation is just the practice of looking inward, and many studies show benefits. Whereas, many of the reported benefits of religion come from the practice of it, and are most likely due to placebo.

So yes, in practice they are similar and they have many of the same benefits. What I can not get behind are the potential/probable drawbacks of religion. The narrow mindedness and the arrogance come to mind.

I appreciate your second point. I like to think of it as:

- Recognizing when someone may not be acting in your own best interest

- Setting personal boundaries with other people (esp. people who may be doing the former)

If you're in an environment where cycling's viable, I'd rank that alongside or even above driving (it can be cheaper, healthier, more sustainable, consumes less parking space at home and in the community, produces less pollution, and generally provides easier self-maintenance options)

I think it's hard as an adult. I never learned as a child (grew up on a very narrow and winding country road) and I did kinda/sorta teach myself as an adult but I never gained the confidence to ride on roads with traffic.

>even above driving

And I have trouble agreeing for most people. Many need cars on a day-to-day basis and even if owning a car doesn't make sense for some people even in the US, being able to rent one and go someplace on the weekend or for a trip opens up a lot of possibilities for many. I wouldn't even have been able to do my first job if I couldn't drive.

Traffic's certainly a large barrier to entry; I learned to cycle as an adult too, and it took a long time to become comfortable cycling on anything other than quiet local roads.

And you're right that many people can't currently practically use a bicycle in preference to a car. Some of that's no doubt due to the logistics involved in more remote communities, some of it could be related to urban infrastructure historically designed with large vehicles in mind, and some of it's likely due to limitations of bicycle travel itself (like the challenges of carrying large loads and dealing with weather conditions). Not to mention that it takes time for people's habits to change.

I'm biased because I would probably say cycling's the most useful non-software-related skill I've learned - so take with a grain of salt - but to me cycling's a vast opportunity: an empowering, open, low-cost technology with the potential to improve lives both individually and collectively.

In that context traffic and other limiting factors become issues to understand and find (genuine, win-win) solutions for, rather than impassable obstacles.

Circumstances certainly matter. I live in a small exurban town and, as a practical matter, I'd never use a bicycle for anything other than pure recreation. I also just don't have great balance in general so the relatively rare occasions when I do ride a bike on a forest road/carriage path, it's always a bit more of an adventure than is probably ideal.

There are adult cycling classes out there, with instructors who have (I am told, I learnt as a kid so I've never taken one) some pretty well-polished programs for getting folks from "never sat on a bike" to "reasonably stable and aware of the rules of the road, both official and unspoken".

Once you start cycling around town regularly, you build a new layer on your city map: what's the shade like on this street? how bad are the potholes on this back street? how dense is the car traffic? can I find effective detours that trade off a few minutes for not having to cross six lanes of traffic coming straight off the end of a highway?

Cycling's pretty useless if you live in a suburban sprawl though. Great for an actual city.

Just walking the last mile, taking the stairs consistently at work can be enough if biking isn't practical.

Finding and choosing a spouse. Possibly the thing that affects you the most and rarely taught.

First create a life for yourself that is content enough on its own.

how?

If you're single, dating. Especially online dating. Depending on you upbringing, this is similar to personal finance, where nobody really teaches you what to do, and there's a lot of "seduction" or "red pill" toxic nonsense out there. Dating is also a relatively recent modern construct, and it's a skill that doesn't come naturally. There's a certain etiquette to it that might vary from place to place and in time you're in. But generally, it's about keeping it simple to start out with, getting more adventurous as dates progress, and being assertive, organized, and clear in your communication, while trying to forge a genuine connection with someone. It can also equip you to handle other emotional rollercoasters you might encounter.

Can you recommend any resources to learn this better?

I like Hinge's blog: http://hingeirl.com/. It has some solid tips. Besides that, I haven't found anything else too useful and mostly learned by putting myself out there and making a ton of mistakes. That's not to say there might be some other useful material out there.

I'd be weary of taking advice from reddit or similar communities. Most people who frequent those forums and give advice tend to be plagued with relationship problems themselves.

Of course, dating in a Covid-19 world might be tricky, and it's not something I feel is worth the effort, though YMMV. (fwiw, I used to think the same about online dating, and I was completely wrong.)

I am skeptical of dismissing the "red pill" entirely. Feynman tested being jerk to get laid and it had worked for him. However he did not continue being jerk because he found it hard to be against his nature or he had moral dilemma about it. I forgot exactly why he stopped using the method

Gell-Mann seemed to insinuate that Feynman just made up most of his stories [1]. And even if they were true, he lived in a different era. Social norms have evolved considerably since then.

Still, IME it's clear that gender dynamics are clearly in play today. Men tend to take the lead most of the time in heterosexual relationships. I feel most of it is still nurture and not nature; I heard in Europe gender roles are less prominent in dating vs. the US.

By "red pill" or "seduction" advice, I meant snake oil silver bullet advice. There aren't any shortcuts.

[1] https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/the-curious-wavefunctio...

I haven't seen knots mentioned yet. Learning a few basic knots from different categories may only be occasionally useful, but on those occasions it can be quite valuable and rewarding. Practicing knot tying requires minimal resources, and it can be a great activity to wind down at the end of the day.

Oh yeah, great one. I love knots. When I don’t have a technical puzzle to mull over while drifting off to sleep I like to visualise knots - it’s surprisingly tricky to follow along without a line in your hand.

Everyone should learn the bowline because it gives you a lot of bang for buck. One I discovered on the brilliant website below that I’ve really come to love is the tumble hitch (quick release hitch on a bight).

https://www.animatedknots.com/bowline-knot

https://www.animatedknots.com/tumble-hitch-knot

Thanks for the links, that's a cool site!

How to learn: if you learn well, you can acquire new skills more quickly and easily.

Some keys: be calm and stay in the beginner's mindset. If you're frustrated and reactionary, you will learn much less effectively. Be like a happy child, curious about new things, and be interested in self improvement always.

Yeah this something i have been trying to improve. Taken Barbara Oakley's "Learning to learn" course and read the book(it is essentially the transcript of the book). It def help me better understand theory behind learning. On top of it i have been using Anki - spaced repetition tool - to solidify what i learned. Having a knowledge repo or a collection of notes that are written with your own words helps immensely as well.

Enough carpentry and building skills to be able to build decks, porches, sheds, renovate rooms in your house, etc. If you're a homeowner and can improve your home with little help from contractors, you will be able to affordably increase the value of your house immensely, as well as the quality of your home life and that of your family. The return on investment can be crazy -- imagine being able to take a couple weeks off work for a project and increasing the value of your house by ~10% during that time.

So, more generally, you could say that you can save money by doing a task yourself that you usually leave to a professional specialist. In most cases, this is clearly ridiculous. I'm not going to start sewing my own clothes, or doing maintenance on my car beyond maybe changing my own oil. What makes home repairs different?

> In most cases, this is clearly ridiculous.

I disagree.

I would guess most of us have thought before, "I sure get paid a lot for what amounts to not that difficult of work."

Most professions are like that.

> I'm not going to start sewing my own clothes

My wife enjoys sewing and makes or alters the majority of her clothing. It's more work than buying, but the fit is better and she has fun doing it.

> doing maintenance on my car beyond maybe changing my own oil.

Lots of people are into car repair. Having delved into it a little in the past few years, you can get surprisingly far with a decent set of wrenches, some jack stands, and a torque wrench.

> What makes home repairs different?

They really aren't. If you own the house you live in, then why wouldn't a naturally curious person like most of the people here try their hand at some of the work?

It's a very easy thing to tip toe your way into and gradually build your skills.

Get a hammer, a saw, a tape measure, and a drill and suddenly the world is your oyster around the house.

If you want to hire a professional for every little thing, then great. That keeps them in business.

But most of the work is hardly beyond the abilities of the average person. Especially given that you can start with the easy things and build from there.

It's not just about the money. Doing things yourself is rewarding. It also makes you good at more things than making and spending money. This could be useful if the economy goes south, or if you lose the ability to work.

Fixing things yourself also means that you don't need to deal with professionals, which can be hard to pick and have weird schedules.

Also keep in mind that you pay other people with your post tax income. If you both charge the same rate, you'll need to work for more than one hour to buy one hour of their time.

Maintaining your own car is not ridiculous. Ive spent less on vehicle repairs over the last 15 years than most people spend in a single year on car payments for something "reliable". How much does getting your brakepads replaced cost you? For me it is $15, and I buy better brakepads than most. The tools consist of a set of sockets and a jack. Some random sensor goes bad? I can get 4 different sensors that are literally are plug and play for the same cost as just having a mechanic tell me I got a bad sensor. In some cases you could replace every major sensor in your car for less that the cost of having a mechanic find and replace a single bad sensor himself.

Not OP, but I just rebuilt a big wall outside for 85 bucks in materials and a week off from work by reusing the old materials, where a contractor quoted me 12000 to build a new one.

By all means call me ridiculous. You do you.

Take nothing personally. The good or the bad. Build a community. You NEED friends that you get to hang out with every now and then . This online stuff doesn't count.

One of the more rewarding experiences I had last year was attending Meetups with people significantly older than myself.

The older you get , the harder making friends becomes. It's so bad I'd suggest to comp sci majors to consider a Liberal Arts degree instead if they're having trouble socializing.

Learning how to cook would be fairly near the top of my list. More specifically learning how to cook a few dishes well (ideally ones that you like).

If one is looking for silver linings in the current situation, I saw some McKinsey data the other week suggesting that doing more home cooking is one of the pandemic behaviors that is likely to last longer term.

Or you could learn to eat (and even enjoy) any food... it's much easier heh

I wish I could upvote this twice - I came to say the same thing. Being able to cook is one of the best things I've learned. And not just cooking, but being decently able to cook a variety of things.

I've been able to have wonderfully comforting meals after moving overseas, change my diet while still enjoying my food, and actually eat cheap but good tasting meals, a small joy if you are pretty broke.

I found the America’s Test Kitchen books to be great as a starting point. The recipes are good, and generally made from easily accessible ingredients. There is also always a page or two of discussion about developing the recipe (what worked, what didn’t, etc) that includes some instructions on technique. I often give the Best Recipes book as a gift to younger relatives who are just learning.

Being able to forgive yourself.

You're not perfect and mistakes will be made. Becoming a father showed me that I've sometimes said and done stupid things in front of a very impressionable small person, but all I can do is to promise myself that I won't do that again, find a way of avoiding that situation in the future, and move on.

Berating yourself over ancient history is incredibly toxic for mental health.

Understanding yourself in different dimensions would be at the top of my list. It takes a lifetime to do it well though.

Learn to cook and prepare food, especially your favorite foods. Then you can make better decisions when buying packaged food, when eating out and also not be dependent on someone or some establishment for something as basic as food (of course, you can take this further and get into gardening and such, but just start with cooking from ingredients you can buy).

Listen to people without interrupting and trying to solve their problems. Listening is a gift to others and to yourself.

Learn to write better, since we (the readers and writers here) depend on written communication a lot more than people from the last century and before.

Learn to manage expenses, followed by learning to manage investments (start by understanding the power of compounding).

IMO, playing an instrument and learning a sport are hobbies, not necessarily life skills.

How to establish and maintain relationships with other people. And all that goes with that. How to listen, how to express yourself, how to be empathetic, being able to accept and offer help. In your personal and professional life, your relationships are likely to be the most important determinant of your happiness and your success.

How to build and maintain relationships

How to take care of your physical and mental state

- That might mean meditation or mindfulness or whatever else it takes to deal with adversity and difficult situations

- Understand what your specific body needs in the way of activity and diet to keep the engine running as best it can

With those two under your belt you can generally build and acquire any other skills you need for your specific situation to the extent that it is possible

Here are some more ideas from a thread a few months ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23757396

And another (posted by yours truly): https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23758188

Learning about nutrition and fitness, even if you don't do either rigorously.

Patience and also how to firmly and kindly say, "no."

Art is a pretty nice hobby that works your ability to observe and visualize. Sort of like meditation when you're in the "flow" of it.

Playing an instrument is similar. Having a hobby that is active, not passive, and relaxes you is great.

Learn how to make habits and replace habits.

Learn how to take smaller steps.

Learn how to balance.

Learn how to focus.

Learn any moderately complex system very well.

From past personal experience: get an old vehicle and make like new; learn linux on machine not best-suited to it; and, with out getting overly specific, gain skills by getting involved with people outside your milieu--volunteer, or get a side job that teaches you a useful skill via mentors with perspectives you do not normally encounter.

In my experience, learning a complicated system translates well to another.

Finally, and perhaps this will sound a bit life-coachy--sorry: learn to suffer, dynamically. Learn that your limits are often imagined, and that you can "put away" unpleasant feelings in order to perform adaptively within, or even enjoy, struggle. This a skill of mine that not many people have. It's probably not crucial, as people without it seem to function fine, but it does afford me unique opportunities.

Endurance is absolutely a great life skill. We can do so much more than we think we can when we learn how to manage our thoughts. It is what enables people to become navy seals, cardiologists, pioneers in one's field, or all of the above if you are Jonny Kim. Jonny spoke at great length on Jocko Willink's podcast if you are interested in his story of personal triumph: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yujP3-AxXsI

Have a viable exit plan from working life. You don't always get to choose when you can no longer work.

Eerily timely advice for me. I've developed a persistent pain in my right wrist over this weekend. I guess RSI is finally getting me :/.

100 things can cause this, everything from mild food poisoning, to a specific food, gout, 100 things.

Could be you just had a bad meal.

I thought the same thing about a month ago, but then it went away.

Have you tried a vertical mouse?

Mouse ball helps too. Theragun and learning all the trigger points to release for carpal tunnel has kept me out of the surgeon's office so far.

This is where it's good to have a life partner. My mother didn't when she died, but was lucky enough to have her siblings and son nearby. She did leave this world completely broke, as dementia care is extremely expensive in the US.

Without family or wealth, once one cannot work here in the US, I think most people go where it's cheapest and eventually become homeless, then die.

A few things that are helping around the house:

- water and electric installations. Most things that usually break in a typical house can be easily fixed by the average person with some tools, water is easier, electricity is extremely risky if you don't know what you are doing, but fine if you do (you don't need a college to be an electrician). I would also mention some carpentry, but that requires more tools than what people keep around the house.

- build, maintain and repair a bicycle; it is extremely easy if you spend a bit of time doing it and it is extremely useful if you do mountain biking and you have a problem in the middle of nowhere; also it is a lot cheaper and quite fun to fix or upgrade your own bike or spend some good time with friends working on their bikes

- fixing small things on a car or motorcycle, like changing oil, brake pads, bleed the brakes. It does well with the bicycle skills, some are transferable.

- if you like hiking, knowing how to pack light, to find a good place to mount a tent, first aid and a bit of survival skills are useful

If you like hiking, depending on your country and area you spend time it would be a good idea to learn how to properly carry and use a firearm for self-defense against wild life. Where I go there are plenty of bears and boars, they are both stronger and faster than me, I had a few encounters but it was either from a distance or I was not on foot, so I left in a hurry :) Less applicable in West Europe (no bears, some boars) and in Eastern Europe (no guns allowed), but still something to think about

- cooking. It's a hit or miss, but you can try. Anyone knows how to make tea or some eggs, it's trivial to do French fries or a steak (not a good one, but something you can eat), so for me cooking means to do something more complicated than basic food.

Learn not only to drive a car, but a bicycle, a motorcycle, a manual transmission car and even a small truck. You never know when one of these can be useful and they are partially related, so it's not that much to learn.

The art of learning and educating oneself.

Our world is changing faster than ever and the only way to catch up and remain relevant is to master the art of learning. Learning through failures, learning through experience, learning through active discussion or learning through teaching—doesn’t really matter the mode, but find one that works for you and master this art. I find myself learning best through application, so I constantly find small opportunities in daily life and at work to try new techniques.

I’m believe that formal education (the kind you get an education loan for) is no longer sufficient to get ahead in life. Learning to self educate is key.

What I have trouble with but for a time i managed it. I think is one of, if not the most essential life skill is learning to initiate a lot of conversations with total strangers. I do want to emphasize the 'a lot' part, because this is not about being good at conversation (some people are, some aren't), but doing this a lot. Using this, you can make friends, but you can also get professional opportunities or dates or you can find your way about a foreign place. It takes a lot to get over the inner awkwardness but if you manage to do it consistently the rewards are just as consistent.

Language.

I've learnt several physical stuffs (e.g. bodybuilding, music), several emotional stuffs (e.g. meditating, music) and other intellectual skills (e.g. game theory, the humanities and programming of course...) and if I had to choose one to recommend to the HN community, it's language.

Unfortunately, it's high reward [0] also comes with high effort. Even with the best resources, it will take time and patience. But you can start at anytime of your life and at anywhere.

[0]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MMmOLN5zBLY

I agree with language, but I wasn't thinking about any neurological benefits. Just speaking a few languages can unlock so many opportunities in life.

Learn to apologise. Learn to get over yourself if you have had a fight or an argument, and be the first one to apologise.

Knowledge in philosophy, particularly strict epistemology and logic (binary vs trinary), with the intent to constantly apply this knowledge through life.

Enough knowledge in psychology and neuroscience such that you can have a decent understanding of how the human mind works (and ways in which it fails imperceptibly). Time spent in psychedelic and spiritual realms seem to be quite practically useful for this type of learning.

Systems thinking - gain an understanding of the presence and importance of unseen systems, and the unseen complexity and causal relationships contained within. For example, we live in a system (that itself is composed of numerous subsystems), and each of us is a system (our mind, itself composed of two distinct parts, the conscious and subconscious, each consisting of numerous subsystems). Such things are very easy to forget in real time, but even if remembered, our perception of the state and behavior of these systems is extremely inconsistent (sometimes even backwards) with how they actually are.

Realize that outside of the hard sciences, we are rarely dealing with facts, but rather coarse approximations, and that this is often completely not realized (to put it mildly). It seems this can be decently learned from an abstract perspective, but the degree to which this abstract knowledge can be drawn upon in real time seems extremely inconsistent.

(Meta) In general, people's minds (and broad Western culture) often seem to find these sorts of ideas instinctually repulsive, so exercise disciplined skepticism with those who dissuade you from study.

How to generate meaning in one's life. This normally comes from taking on responsibility. Then, one continually increases the amount of responsibility one takes on.

One thing most human beings can do as a shortcut to this: have a child.

- "Consumer science (a.k.a. home economics) as a college major" https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17894550

In no particular order:

- Food science; Nutrition

- Family planning: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Family_planning

- Personal finance (see the link above for resources)

- How to learn

- How to teach [reading and writing, STEM, respect, compassion]

- Compassion for others' suffering

- How to considerately escape from unhealthy situations

- Coping strategies: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coping

- Defense mechanisms: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Defence_mechanism

- Prioritization; productivity

- Goal setting; n-year planning; strategic alignment

Life skills: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Life_skills

Khan Academy > Life Skills: https://www.khanacademy.org/college-careers-more

I should mention meta skills, skills that are more general:

1. Learning to learn. When you learn to play an instrument or a language you should learn to learn better. So learning something new becomes easier.

That is learning about space repetition software and how your memory works. Physical and mental fatigue,moderate stress, diet, relaxation times and sleep.

One of the best abilities that you could master is the ability to learn from the masters in any discipline, what is called in psychology "modeling", and it is natural for kids. That usually takes letting some part of yourself to die, accepting that you are wrong at something, and it for adults is incredible painful and rewarding at the same time.

2. Managing your emotions in front of your opposite sex, in front of threats, in front of a big audience. In front of important work to do.

Getting gradually out of your comfort zone. Taking and handling bigger and bigger risks while knowing your limitations. Again that means accepting (a small)suffering as a routine.

Being conscious about what you are feeling at every moment and knowing what to do helps you master procrastination in you and in others.

That makes you incredible attractive and resourceful person.

To speak in front of lots of people you need to have something important to say to them. You need to find something more important than yourself.

In general those skills are counterintuitive, like doing routine exercise means suffering a little every day but over months or years it improves you so much most people just wont be able to compete with you at psychical or metal tasks.

Honest self appraisal, giving a proper apology, empathize with people you don't like, giving and receiving praise for work well done, setting boundaries

How to actually listen to other people.

Yep. Probably in part due to a negative and emotional upbringing, I have needed all of my adult life to learn that listening is a foundation skill.

The few great leaders I have known were each great listeners in their own ways, and capable of making decisions based on what they hear without, it seems to me, concern for "ego."

To me, this seems like a superpower.

A lot of my ideas are already listed, so I’ll add Drawing. A lot of things can be made so much clearer through a drawing, and learning to draw effectively is easier than you might imagine. That doesn’t mean anyone can easily become a master — but practicing fundamentals can get you from 0-1 pretty quickly, in terms of being able to express ideas.

Judging experts because you won't be doing most things on the basis of your own original reasoning. Prioritization otherwise you get attention hijacked too much to accomplish your goals. Emotional stability or you get jerked around by current events. Communication or you don't get any buy in on your positive visions.

Diagramming.

I'm serious.

The more I (as a developer trying to master design) delve into the product design space. The more I see that there is no more fundamental skill in design than that of constructing 'information architectures'. Essentially, mapping (or diagramming) the most important pieces of a design that you are making.

It is literally the key to creating a great design.

I wrote more about this in a guest post here: https://simpleprogrammer.com/information-architecture-develo....

Think about the design of Apple products, is it really just the way they look that makes you love them. Or is it more subtly, the way the work (of which UI is a component), and how that makes you feel?

Definitely worth thinking about.

Do you have any other recommendations for this? I checked out the link you shared, but was greeted by a screen-filling popup to sign up for something. I navigated back.

I would highly recommend reading the article for a fuller picture behind this idea.

But if you want a shorter primer, you can check out this one that gives a short summary of this concept: https://planflow.dev/blog/ux-planning-starts-with-informatio....

Failure. It’s part of every aspect of life but we as a society don’t teach people how to handle it well.

Everybody ought to learn whatever they need to learn given their individual circumstance. Therefore, probably the best skill is learning to discern what to learn (critical thinking, perhaps), followed closely by learning how to learn (largely a self awareness thing).

For me, excluding the obvious ones like driving is dressing up nicely. Although I value ones looks less as I grow older, since appearance is transient (someone can be having a bad day), I appreciate the skill needed to combine an outfit, which I lack and can't fathom.

By nicely I don't mean like for a wedding or expensively, just plain nicely with your day-to-day apparel. Combine garment styles and colors and subtle details. I have a feeling I would have it easier on some occasions if I just payed attention to how I look instead of just making sure my weewee isn't in the open and the cloths covering me are clean. When I do try, I turn out looking goofy so I stick to my plain, bland, inoffensive elements.

I think spending the time to learn how to be your own best friend, perhaps this might be especially valuable or undervalued among the HN audience. Speaking from my experience I feel that I'm relatively driven but that often goes together with being my own very harsh critic. One way to descriibe this is that I wouldn't spend any time with someone whom spoke to me the way I sometimes speak to myself when things go wrong. The times when, instead of beating myself up, I'm able to say to myself it's ok not to be where I thought I would be by now it my life, I've been more peaceful.

So my answer to OP's question is: learn to be compassionate with yourself.

Self analysis. Think carefully about your motivations, decisions, feelings - be honest with yourself. Don't just let things happen to you and react, understand why you feel like you do and either accept it or change it.

Don't double down out of pride or get flustered when you are wrong if you know you are wrong. To boot, nothing will make people remember you were wrong more than you making a fuss about whatever you are wrong about.

It took me a really long time to learn this. You have to be secure enough in yourself that your mind can even contemplate the idea of taking the initiative to say something negative about yourself in front of others. On top of that, you need to have the courage to actually do it.

And it's so easy to let it slide. You'd hardly be the first. But it really is better to do it. Contrary to what insecurity tells you, reasonable (and non-adversarial) people will respect you more.

1. The power of asking the right questions. For example, if you find yourself doing learning a bunch of difficult things at the same time, the following questions can help you/ a.How many subjects am I currently learning intensely? b.Do these subjects have any relation to each other? c.Why am I currently learning the subjects? d.Have I truly made progress in any of the subjects?

To find out more about questions, this article https://leveragethoughts.substack.com/p/do-not-engage-the-mi... is fantastic.

2. The power of writing. Writing puts thoughts to paper. When you write, the structure of your thoughts becomes more visible. It can tell you if you think properly or not. By writing, your thoughts process becomes more refined. Writing is a feedback loop to your thoughts.

3. How to build relationships. We humans are social creatures. We are quite inter dependent. To navigate through life, we will need to co-operation of others. The book https://amzn.to/3mYvmqo how to win friends and influence others is incredibly good.

4. How to show our work. You can create the best invention in computer science but if it does the right audience do not know about it, the invention languishes in obscurity. This article https://leveragethoughts.substack.com/p/cracking-the-who-you... is one of the best at explaining it.

5. Financial literacy. This is incredibly important. A lot of us go through life without understanding how the financial system works. This leads to us making sub optimal financial choices. I find the book The Richest Man in Babylon https://amzn.to/3mVczMI great at introducing a financial mindset. Financial literacy is also important;Especially for technical people. The life of Nikola Tesla is an example of this https://leveragethoughts.substack.com/p/dont-hinge-your-care...

Never write someone or something off without solid evidence.

How to handle your finances.

I can't believe this basic lesson wasn't taught to me at all during my formative years, either by my parents or in school.

Not only how to handle them, but the theory behind finance, and how it works. What inflation is, what net present value is, what an "asset" is, how interest rates and compounding work.

I admit I could be mistaken, but often when I hear people complain that they wish they had been taught to handle their finances or learned about budgeting, it reduces down to "I wish I had been taught not to spend outside my means." Which reduces down further to "I wish I had been taught self-control." To me, the fundamentals have always seemed relatively straightforward: don't spend more than you have, and only take credit or a loan if you have a plan for paying it back on time.

I was raised by parents with limited education, one of whom was an immigrant, and so I was largely on my own when figuring out the minutia of opening a bank account, getting a credit card, saving up for emergencies, etc. But the general lesson of "don't spend more than you have" was imparted. It seems like a pretty obvious thing, but I guess if your parents or guardians are setting bad examples in that regard, it might not be as obvious as it appears to me.

I sort of agree with that. I have some quibbles with what's taught in high school (e.g. surely basic statistics/probability would be more useful for most people than some of the math that is taught). But MBA capital budgeting and accounting classes aren't really needed. Maybe a penny saved is a penny earned could be updated to a penny saved is a penny earned plus compound interest. But the common problem is, as you say, people spending more money than they have because they want to--as aided by installment plans and the like. (And a lot of people just having genuinely little money.)

If people knew how the stock market actually worked then you would see far less retail investors losing their money. Many people think it's equivalent to gambling and that it is a zero sum game. There is also the common misconception that stocks that don't pay dividends (e.g. they do stock buybacks) can never actually return their investments and therefore every investor is looking for a greater fool until the stock plummets. Lots of people think buying the stock from another investor does nothing for the company unless they issue new stock for financing purposes. Obviously, if you knew even the tiniest bit about the stock market you would know that all of these are wrong.

Stock trading makes money and produces value by providing liquidity but it has diminishing returns therefore it is slightly positive sum. Stock investing makes money off of company growth. Investors can sell their shares via stock buybacks directly to the company (no greater fool needed). Buying stock from another investor increases the market cap of the company which helps it secure funding through traditional means such as a line of credit from a bank even if the company does not sell stocks.

No one on this planet is going to teach you this. You'll have to figure it out by yourself and this is merely information an outside observer needs to know to understand news articles regarding the stock market. Actual investment requires far more in-depth knowledge.

Definitely one of the most important things one should teach a teenager. Why on Earth is it not a dedicated class in school? :/

I volunteered for Habitat for Humanity and learned how to tile a floor. I imagine if you do it consistently you can learn a lot of things.

>if you do it consistently

That's a problem with a lot of home-related tasks. You often do them slowly and poorly the first time around and then you don't have an occasion to do them again for another decade or two.

But did you do it properly? :D

Floor tiles are the worst, a real pain in the arse. I don't want to do that again, ever.

My supervisor said he's never seen such a straight line but yeah, it is back breaking work.

Honestly, I believe don't specific individual skills matter that much, so whatever aligns with your happiness and curiosity. I think it's more important to focus on the skills that make everyone else's lives better, so: understanding how we all feel and react differently and making your work and communication as accessible to others as possible.

How to make delicious, nutritious meals on a budget. Bonus points if the prep work is something you can handle while working full-time.

I'll save you the suspense: the secret is buying a crockpot, putting food onto cook in the morning before work, and then voila! Dinner is ready when you get home. Best of all you can use cheap cuts of meat and/or beans.

The ones that I find myself working on the most as I move into my 40s: Physical strength and patience. They're tightly coupled but the patience is something that I could use more of in every facet of my life. Along the same line of thought, I find myself practicing listening / being present in conversation frequently.

I like your list. 2 of the things you included are the 2 things I would put at the top of my list.

I am 58, and I didn't always know how to make a list like this in a way that makes sense to me now.

Would you mind if I ask how old you are, and what you imagine will be important to you when you are looking back on your life, as an old, old, old person?

Your comment is unattached, therefore the OP can't know that you asked a question.

The number one life skill, based on my own experience is, Self Inquiry (Who Am I?) based Meditation. Know that you are not your body or your mind, but the Awareness or knowing that observes all your thoughts, sensations, feelings and perceptions. Search Youtube for Rupert Spira and watch some of his meditations.

Sing (alone and in a band), dance, cook. A bit of litterature, mathematics, physics, geography, history, psychology.

Cooking

Losing weight/maintaining proper weight (without being miserable, eg not juice dieting), meeting people (since your high school/college friends will move away), good posture/technique (don't get carpal tunnel), the importance of stretching.

Posture! Learn good posture now and have fewer back problems later.

Ability to lie in the grass of a park with your dog by your side for no reason at all other than to enjoy the fall weather and rustling of the leaves.

Ability to grind and realize you can do anything.

Ability to let go of things that hold you back.

Ability to love.

Ability to inspire.

Ability to find peace within.

Off the top of my head:

Critical thinking, note taking, accounting, mindfulness, efficient reading, persuasive writing, chess and/or go, poker, heavy lifting, endurance running, self-defense, and love making.

Learn to love and live boredom. Boring periods (whithout any computer or smartphone or other external stimulation) have a positive effect on your brain. It helps sparking your creativity too.

I enjoy building up my primitive skills and trade skills. If the house of cards we call our current society falls down at least you'll have some valuable skills to rebuild from.

Learn to love problems and look forward to things going wrong.

Learning how to communicate well - how to get your point across, how to debate without shutting down, and listening. Especially verbally/face to face.

Anything that doesn’t require depending on another. If you use anything that requires another person to complete it or entity then that thing is at risk.

Lie!!! How to properly lie is the most important skill you need to learn in life. Nobody ever said 100% of their life truth only, everybody lied. How you lie is the most important skill. Most of them are so called "white lies" which sometime are actually required by social norms. But when you do a "white lie" without proper body language and proper voice inflections you are hurting a lot. Imagine saying "my condolences" to a fresh widow while laughing or with a bored voice. It's an insult.

So yeah, how to lie is number one skill.

Not really a skill but fell running is pretty great. Especially if you can join a club.

It is good to have a thing to do that exercises the body instead of the mind.

Basic car maintenance skills. Changing a tire, adding oil, checking levels for power steering and coolant, knowing when tires need replacing, etc.

I suggest cooking. Its really fun, it will improve the quality of your life and allow you to eat healthier within a budget.

nonviolent communication. It really improved my ability to communicate and understand people.

https://www.amazon.com/Nonviolent-Communication-Language-Lif...

Self defence and how to safely handle a firearm, since any other life skills are useless if you’re dead.

I've thoroughly enjoyed reading through the comments and conversations in this post, thanks all.

Get to know yourself & be humble.

Taking complicated things and simplifying them for others. Makes a big difference in work and life.

learn to swim

See you down in Arizona Bay

Where I went undergrad, they require you to pass a swim test (or take a PE swimming class) to graduate. (Before someone says something, yes, I'm sure there are exceptions for those with disabilities.)

To fix minor stuff around the house, to cook, to relax (via a hobby, reading or other)

Learn how to pick fresh fruit and vegetables and learn how to cook a proper meal.

How to identify and solve hard problems, which if left unresolved block progress.

Take a cue from Uncle Bob (Heinlein) and start working on his list:

A human being should be able to:

- change a diaper

- plan an invasion

- butcher a hog

- conn a ship

- design a building

- write a sonnet

- balance accounts

- build a wall

- set a bone

- comfort the dying

- take orders

- give orders

- cooperate

- act alone

- solve equations

- analyze a new problem

- pitch manure

- program a computer

- cook a tasty meal

- fight efficiently

- die gallantly

Specialization is for insects.

Build a bike wheel. Thanks Sheldon Brown.

How to fight. How to write. How to lead. How to meditate.

spiritual hygiene, mental hygiene, physical hygiene

Listening skills.

Critical thinking and evaluating evidence.

CBT

I know it’s a short search away, but Cognitive Behavior Therapy

I used to have a therapist who's pretty queer. She had a shaved head, tattoos, knew about kinky local things and some about lesbian stuff.

She mentioned this and I had to tell her it's also something else. She was surprised she hadn't heard of the other meaning before.

to optimize for the most important thing in life, time.

effective communication. and financial stability

Critical thinking

Remembering names

Meditation (!)

Working on your own automobile, and welding.

Protecting/Insulating yourself from Machiavellianism (willingness to manipulate and deceive others), Narcissism (egotism and self-obsession), Psychopathy (lack of remorse and empathy), Sadism (pleasure in suffering of others)

* identifying when people are lying to you

* identifying weakness: embarrassment, offense, narcissism, intimidation, hostility (I am deliberately excluding fear from this list)

* writing

* personal finances/accounting

* product design: accessibility, usability, performance, engagement, organization (I am deliberately excluding vanity from this list)

* emergency car repair

* house maintenance

* horticulture

* accuracy with a rifle

* philosophy

* history

* homeopathy (plant chemistry kind, not the pseudo science kind)

* leadership

* listening

* benevolence

* maintaining a healthy marriage

* honesty

* automation

Granted, from SciFi, but I have found this to be fairly inspirational:

> A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyse a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects.

(https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Competent_man)

Change a diaper? Done! Plan an invasion? No. Butcher a hog? No way, I like pigs. Conn a ship? Would like to try. Is learning to fly helicopters an acceptable substitute? (By far the most difficult thing I've ever done - building a pipe organ was kid's play in comparison.) Design a building? How about a tree house? Write a sonnet? No. Balance accounts? Terrible - ask my bank manager. Build a wall? No. Set a bone? No. Comfort the dying? No. Take/Give orders? Yes. Cooperate? With whom/what? Act alone? Yep. Solve equations? Never could do that. Analyse a new problem? Constantly. Pitch manure? Yes, I really have done this. Not recommended. Program a computer? My job. Cook a tasty meal? My chicken curry is world famous! Fight efficiently? Not sure what that means. Die gallantly? Not yet.

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