$1 hearing aid could treat millions with hearing loss
sciencemag.org
sciencemag.org
That said, the hearing aids vendor lock-in is really atrocious and can use a disruption. They don't like users configuring the aids themselves, you are expected to make appointments with audiologist - in fact several of them because every hearing loss is different and it's hard to exactly measure, so usually the aids won't fit on first or second try. The algorithms are strictly proprietary - when there's 40dB difference between responses to different frequencies such as I have, usual equalizer won't do. To enable bluetooth the rule is to buy expensive add-on streamer.
1. Get hot. I don't want a +60C FPGA in my ear.
2. Eat up the battery. The batteries are small and fiddly to replace for an 85 year old with bad eyes and arthritis in the fingers. They should last for at least a week before needing replacing. No they are generally not rechargeable in the device. That would require a connector, which takes up precious volume. Wireless recharging requires a coil with the same problem.
3. Take up way too much PCB real estate. They are just too big to fit in your ear. Sure, you can run a wire to a box outside the ear, but that messes with the fashion statement. Most hearing aid users want small and discrete, so the world isn't reminded they have a disability.
Besides, why would you put an FPGA in there? Hearing aids already feature some of the most high-grade low-power DSP ASICs available, custom made for that companys DSP algorithms.
Couldn’t a “connector” just be a tiny gold contact to meet another in a charging cradle/case like a smart watch or wireless earbuds? Would that be too big?
Here's the colour range for one modern aid: https://www.fmhearingsystems.co.uk/PDF/FocusColours.jpg
Rechargable: https://www.phonak.com/uk/en/about-us/rechargeable-technolog...
Are you saying that it’s “professional” to hide your disability if you have hearing loss? If so, then I strongly disagree. It’s a personal choice.
Even if you can be “right” you’ll be alone on Merit Island, let it go it doesn’t matter have some fun and let others have their “things” too.
Behind the ear is great when you still have reasonable hearing in a good chunk of the spectrum, so the dome from the BTE provides the boost that is additive to the natural signal.
Wireless earbuds' counterparts in the hearing aid world are called "in ear" or "in canal" or "completely in canal" or "hidden", and they provide some benefits, but do have a couple of drawbacks: they can often give the impression of a plugged ear because they keep the natural signal out (exacerbating tinnitus, which is common with hearing loss), and they can irritate the ear canal from all the friction (that part of our body is very sensitive). They can also prevent the natural outflow of cerumen (wax) and cause its accumulation.
Think about a dumb hearing aid, with a microphone and bluetooth connection, which is able to connect to any compatible phone and phone does the processing.
I would worry about the latency of a round-trip over Bluetooth. Google search tells me it’s, optimistically, 100ms single-trip, so 200ms round trip (https://www.headphonesty.com/2020/07/fix-sound-delay-bluetoo...)
You're a tad bit incorrect on Bluetooth round trip a few centimers being 150+ms. Plenty of game controllers operate on or on top of Bluetooth and do not have 150ms latency. Headset Profile (HSP) bluetooth also does not (usually) have 150ms+ latency, usually more along the lines of maybe 30ms latency while many Bluetooth controllers will have <10ms latency.
https://www.reddit.com/r/RocketLeague/comments/8wvf9u/contro...
I'm not the person who designs codecs, but I'd wager most of the lag seen with Bluetooth audio systems come from the codecs. Bluetooth devices are often incredibly power constrained, so codecs operating over Bluetooth are usually trying to balance quality with computational complexity and dealing with packetization of the audio. When you're listening to an audio stream, it appears like a continuous stream of data. In reality, its chunks of data. You're listening to a previous chunk of data while the device is waiting to get the next packet, apply error correction to it, decode the very highly compressed data, and have the waveform ready to go out to your ears all on usually pretty cheap and highly power constrained equipment. It then has to be a bit tolerant to the above mentioned spread spectrum and a potential dropped packet here and there while still seeming to just be a continuous audio stream.
So in short, there's latency in a lot of Bluetooth audio codecs because the designers of the codecs felt the latency tradeoff was acceptable given the bandwidth, compute, power, and quality envelopes based on technology available at the time of crafting the codec.
Meanwhile, you're sending out pings on a device with keys on the keyboard bigger than the battery on a lot of bluetooth headsets with many orders of magnitude more processing power whose wireless connection is not normally that much of a power concern encoding/decoding extremely basic data to one of the companies with the most privately owned fiber with billions of dollars of computing equipment.
LE Audio: Announced in January 2020 at CES by the Bluetooth SIG, LE Audio will run on the Bluetooth Low Energy radio lowering battery consumption, and allow the protocol to carry sound and add features such as one set of headphones connecting to multiple audio sources or multiple headphones connecting to one source It uses a new LC3 codec. BLE Audio will also add support for hearing aids.
NOT being pedantic, just trying to be helpful / educational (esp given the large % of non-native English speakers on HN)
I would say that this latest generation of hearing aids (Phonak Marvel) is the first generation where I've felt like they've got it right. Direct bluetooth connection that just works, and with a very wide range of volume adjustment (older models that used add-on streamer would not go loud enough). People receiving my voice over bluetooth, using the hearing aid's onboard microphones, report good sound quality. Magic.
Now I have a plan with a different employer that doesn’t cover them at all.
I use an Airpod in my right ear and leave one HA in my left for those situations - but its fiddly and annoying to keep switching things in and out. The new IOS14 feature where I can tailor the Airpod audio response to my hearing frequency loss is simply amazing! However, being able to connect/stream audio directly to my HA will be even better.
They are seriously pricey though - cheapest model is Aus$2700 (US$2000) and the top line model is Aus$8400 (US$5900). However, given I feel I got made redundant from a previous job five years ago due to my hearing loss (1), I'll basically spend 'whatever' to ensure I can hear as easily as possible.
(1) In that job, I was wondering why as the years went on, I felt like I was struggling to pickup new concepts or get a handle on projects as fast as I used to. I seriously felt like I was getting stupider. After I got my hearing aids, I realised how much speech I was missing - I was heavily relying on lip reading and also using the context of conversation to fill in the gaps of words I couldn't hear. Which is passable in general conversation - but when managing new projects or new technology concepts, you don't have the experience to generate the context that fills in the gaps. It was literally life-changing when I got my HA. Go an get your hearing tested if you ever feel you are even remotely struggling with your hearing!
What feature is it? Can’t the same be achieved with EQ?
I'm not sure ... i was under the understanding the that EQ function on iOS only applied to music. I guess the other advantage is that audiogram function makes it a one-click accurate configuration of the 'EQ' based on a hearing test.
I don't disagree that those are not cheap, but custom in-ear monitors for musicians are almost exactly the same price range.
It doesn't seem like the medical profession is actually gouging people in this instance.
Bluetooth 5.2 LE Audio will solve the vendor lock-in. So the future looks bright for us with hearing loss.
Edit: And with iOS 14 you can use AirPods Pro as hearings aids by adding an audiogram to the Apple Health app. Works really well.
Edit: I am not an Apple guy but needed some cheap AF development hardware.
“With Live Listen, your iPhone, iPad, or iPod touch can act like a microphone that sends sound to your AirPods or Powerbeats Pro. Live Listen can help you hear a conversation in a noisy area or even hear someone speaking across the room.”
It even supports hearing aids (a few? Some? Many? The most popular? I wouldn’t know). See https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT210386
Source: I've built a hearing aid and done extensive latency tests :)
Well-designed, expensive hearing aids have extremely low latency, but there are theoretical limit. The more frequency domain processing you want to do, the more samples you need to do it, and the more delay you're going to have even in the best-case engineering.
Smartphones are unfortunately typically not able to meet these kind of specifications. Much longer delays are acceptable in voice communication because you don't hear your own voice and the delayed voice at the same time.
Point being, it really has to be a specialized device designed from the ground up to keep the latency close to the theoretical low limit.
That's a huge change in a deaf person's life.
My understanding is that it's like a low-sighted person being able to see contrasts and outlines of things. It's enough to differentiate things, but significantly less than the detail of regular ability.
There's no telling where I would be without my cochlear implants, but they truly have provided me a second chance at life. I got married, went to a great graduate program, and have a high paying, fulfilling job - all products of being able to communicate effectively.
Communication underpins fulfillment and self-worth. Any product that helps those in need communicate better is a net positive.
I am trying to see how different this device is compared to sound amplifiers marketed as 'miracle hearing aids' found in any ecommerce site. The last thing HN wants is to fall victim to an advertorial disguised as a scientific discovery.
Note: I worked for a company that wrote 'scientific' articles like this as landing pages.
Agreed about the disruption in this space.
> They don't like users configuring the aids themselves
I get the feeling most users don't want to configure the aids themselves, and even if they did, wouldn't feel comfortable doing it or don't have the ability or audiology knowledge needed.
Later on you mention how helping with hearing loss is not quick or straightforward, which seems to support that the default of encouraging sessions with an expert is right approach, at least to start.
This claim is totally false for cochlear implants. I am a cochlear implant recipient and before the implant I had essentially no hearing in my right ear ("profoundly deaf"). With the implant in my right ear my hearing has been restored to 90%+ of normal hearing.
I did a whole raft of audiology tests and for the speech comprehension tests in particular I scored 90%+ compared to people with normal hearing. (They're tough tests too, trying to pick out a sentence from a lot of background noise which is a worst-case scenario for hard of hearing people.)
I was told that my outcome was better than average, but I was a younger than average adult recipient given than I was in my early 40's, compared to most (in Australia at least) who are 60+.
And yes I can now distinguish all notes on a piano.
I don't think any of this is particularly relevant to understanding spoken language, but I'm just curious about your outcome.
I'd be surprised if a majority of current CI users could distinguish e.g. middle C from C# (not identify the note, but just perceive a difference between them), but I don't know that many CI users.
Note though that I had perfectly normal hearing until my late 30s, and only have an implant in one ear. After my implant operation my brain "knew" what it should be hearing from the implant signal. This is apparently true of many adult CI recipients and the unexpected plasticity of adult brains to adjust to the CI signal is an active area of research.
I think that the typical outcomes for people who have cochlear implants when they are born deaf would be quite different to adult recipients like me who grew up with normal hearing.
It turns out these things are all important in clinical outcomes for listening comfort and intelligibility. I've built a modern hearing aid and done extensive patient testing - the details matter and it's not just electrical or algorithm problems but tough mechanical and UX challenges to get something more state of the art.
While I haven't worn many neck mounted devices, the Bose Headphones can get crazy feedback and the feedback path is similar. This would cause squealing discomfort for patients and everyone around them.
The other issue to contend with in his grandparents demographic is the perception of being deaf and being seen wearing such a big bulky item. Image consciousness is a large hurdle to overcome these
Great ingenuity but commercially it's hard to see it take traction
So I found the pdf in the zip file where you can see what it is. It's a MAX 98306 amp. The only peripherals are the typical filter capacitors, resistors, volume pot, microphone, etc. So, it's basically this: https://www.adafruit.com/product/987
I suspect there are cheaper class-D IC's that could be used than the MAX98306, but for a prototype why not.
It also puts the volume control potentiometer on the amplifier output which seems wasteful for a battery operated device.
[1]: https://www.maximintegrated.com/en/products/analog/audio/MAX...
Would love to see a low-cost open/hackable hearingaid/hearable though. For example BOM of 5-10 USD. But then it should use a reprogrammable chip for the signal processing, so that one can make improvements in software. Even the cheapest and simplest hardware is harder / more expensive to improve than software.
We just brought my father progressive glasses for 100usd (would be 400+usd here at a 'normal' store). Now he needs a hearing aid and we're dreading the multi-hundred payment on top of what is covered with insurance for a basic device.
So.. What's the catch with these cheap hearing aids? Why would we not buy these?
The question is always valid but the answer isn't always the same.
I'm thinking specifically of cheap eyeglasses.I've had nothing but good experiences buying glasses that cost 10-20% of what I would pay from a local store.
My biggest complaint with Zenni is that shipping can sometimes be slow. I've waited 4 weeks for glasses to show up and other times it's only a week. I think it depends if they come from China or their US facility.
The hard part about hearing aids is making them work in noise. You don't want to just amplify everything or you just hear more noise. Also you need to tune it to your hearing loss otherwise you may damage your hearing. They do things like expanding the dynamics or compressing to prevent loud noises. They suppress wind noise. They can focus on the voice of someone in a group of people.
So the catch with the cheaper hearing aids is that may not help help your dad with understand speech as well as a better quality one.
I'd suggest you watch the videos of Dr Clif Aud on Youtube. He is very informative.
I think there is room for optimizing the whole process but anything medical related tends to move slowly. I still find the phone app a little slow and cumbersome. And switching between bluetooth devices is a pain. I wish Apple and Google would put more effort in improving that aspect.
(I have a genetic condition that tl;dr impacts hair cell substrate material leading to hearing loss by early teens. Being able to hear natively again would be ... words fail me.)
Really dude?
Yup. https://m.aliexpress.com/wholesale/hearing+aid.html?channel=...
Big market, not super-complex tech, it's only matter of time when cheap solution comes.
Here's the organization building this thing: https://shop.tympan.org/
I'm kinda excited about the four microphone board, where you can subtract the ambient noise behind the listener from the noise in the direction they're facing.
Edit: there is also a video showing the building process: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e0gnbOJ3nDo
https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal...
I believe that most of their hearing aids support bluetooth, but only when you get a pair. I only need one, so no bluetooth for me.
I've had fittings by two people at Costco. One is an audiologist and the other was less credentialed, but I forget the title. I could hear better when fitted by the audiologist.
https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal...
It's a crude, bulky, ugly, and fragile thing and the $1 price is not realistic - but it would be less than $10. It seems like a decent product for the poorest places - which is their goal.
The hearing aid biz in the US is glaringly inefficient and obviously ripe for disruption - but this product will not do it here. There's definitely a demand for hearing aids in the couple-of-hundred dollar range that doesn't require audiologist visits and insurance hassle - but the entrenched interests will not help bring it about.
So this is not a 1 USD hearing aid in any way. And if current units are 500 USD, then going down to 50 or 10 USD would already be a huge improvement.
Here's the BOM which shows the full breakdown coming in under $1.
https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal... (Table 1)
Also, I'm not sure where he's getting the prices. Prices for the MAX98306 and MAX9814 seem higher, even in high quantities, than what he's showing.
This is starting to smell like an exercise in making an incorrect BOM to justify the result they were looking for. Nobody will 3d print you a case for $0.06. If what they meant was that they'd 3d print the case themselves, then it should be the filament or resin listed on the BOM. You probably can get a plastic part pretty close to that price, but not 3d printed, it would be injection molded.
Note that the pricing in there is organized around the idea of a very massive custom purchase by a large company.
It's the incongruency of the materials listed with the actual materials that would be used in a mass production scenario that I find unscrupulous.
https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2380057.m...
It's the microphone amplifier. This unit still needs an external microphone, as well as headset/plugs.
You read the article and know this is intended for DIY assembly, correct? That it's not a commercial product?
I guess ultimately you're limited by your interface to the brain (something maybe neuralink could address?), but even still shouldn't there be some "magic" machine learning stuff going on in this space? Not at all an expert in audio processing, but I would imagine that we could do a decent job distinguishing voices from background noise, automatically thresholding sound in different environments, and possibly modulating sounds into different frequency bands when there are e.g. multiple speakers.
For all I know, stuff like this is already going on.
Over the years her hearing aids have improved in battery life, gotten smaller, and improved in things like filtering background noise. Every new hearing aid would start by sounding distorted and weird but her brain adapts to the new sounds after a couple of weeks.
The single largest life improvement I've seen for her was about 10 year ago when she could finally get a hearing aid with bluetooth. Suddenly she didn't have to decide between the "whistling" (feedback) or not hearing to talk on the phone. We got her an iPad and she stopped watching TV almost entirely and now watches YouTube and Netflix. And she can do her yoga over Skype.
Her biggest challenge, at this point, isn't a hearing aid problem but a bluetooh one. Her iPhone inconstantly switches between her hearing aid and her Volkswagen (pre-CarPlay).
I agree hearing aids are stuck in the past, but I'm also convinced most of the problems are lower hanging fruit than a neuralink :).
It's difficult to evaluate hearing aids because they are proprietary. Reading about the features in a brochure for a hearing aid is like reading the features for a TV set or stereo. Who knows what those trademarked terms really mean when it comes to how the code works?
There are a lot of challenges with putting this in a hearing aid: low latency inference (10ms), small power budget, consistent performance, fault tolerance, etc. Still a fair amount of R&D to be done, but change is coming.
For now it looks like it's going to be a behind-the-ear hearing aid. Maybe in 5-10 years it could fit in your ear canal.
Glad you're excited about it!
Public Service Announcement: If you're operating power equipment, wear your ear protection! I didn't, and now have permanent hearing loss. Be smarter!
That's why the neural implant that Musk recently demonstrated excites me to no end. Everything is inside the body, no need to amplify or filter anything, just interface directly with the nerves and compensate for the damage. I hope I don't have to wait more than ten years to get one.
Individuals with APD usually have normal structure and function of the outer, middle, and inner ear (peripheral hearing). However, they cannot process the information they hear in the same way as others do, which leads to difficulties in recognizing and interpreting sounds, especially the sounds composing speech. It is thought that these difficulties arise from dysfunction in the central nervous system
This is semi OT. I use a hearing aid every day. the hearing aid features are turned off, i just use it for bluetooth streaming and phone conversations. it is a receiver in canal hearing aid, and I've put a non-occluding ear dome on it so I can hear normally with it in, but when I play music, the music just arrives in my ear. its also very discrete, people dont notice it unless i tell them its there.
Why someone doesn't take a cheap android/iphone bluetooth-compatible receiver in canal hearing aid and sell it not as a certified hearing device (heck, disable the hearing aid part in sw) but as a discrete wireless headphone set is a mystery to me.
Wireless headphones give me earaches with pressure on my ear canal, over the ear headphones give me headaches with pressure on my ears, then glasses, then skull. Custom in-ear monitors conform to my ears just fine but block out most other sound and have wires to deal with.
These? I put them in, forget about them for a long time, and have sound just floating into my ears when I turn on music.
It's my go-to startup idea.
* This is intended to treat presbycusis, or old-age hearing loss, where the highest frequencies are lost first. It would not be effective for noise-induced hearing loss, where the frequencies around 4 KHz are lost first (the "s" and "f" sounds in speech). This matters in the low-income countries it's targeted for, because occupational health is not as strict and PPE is not as widely utilized, so people are more often exposed to damaging levels of noise at work.
* It does not handle loudness recruitment, a common effect of damage to the outer hairs in the cochlea which causes loudness perception to become non-linear. Someone with a moderate hearing loss would hear an 80 dB sound as just a few dB softer than someone with normal hearing, but a 40 dB sound as many dB softer than someone with normal hearing, and a 20 dB sound as not audible at all. So if you do what this hearing aid does and boost it all by 15 dB, the 20 dB sound becomes barely audible, the 40 dB sound is perceived as "about right", but the 80 dB sound is perceived as nearly 95 dB (really freaking loud). You have to have some non-linear compression in there to adjust for this, and not just overall -- it needs to be per frequency band (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bark_scale) to match the way the ear works.
* Another commenter mentioned that the "bandwidth to the brain" is not available. That's only true in the case of damage to the inner hairs of the cochlea. What's more common is damage to the outer hairs, which amplify the sounds, and that can be compensated for with a hearing aid.
What we really need is a common way to program a hearing aid, so we can have apples-to-apples competition. Right now, when you go to the audiologist, you get an audiogram, which tells you the minimum threshold of sound that you can perceive at each frequency band. But beyond that, there are proprietary adjustments for compression, noise reduction, profiles for different types of loss, and so forth. It's not like getting glasses, where your prescription fully defines the lens, and you can take it to any vendor and have them make it for you.
Edit: If you're really into this stuff from a technical perspective, http://refined-audiometrics.com/wordpress1/ is worth a read -- it's a project by an engineer who experienced a hearing loss later in life who has built a software system to make music sound right for him again, basically building a "super hearing aid" running on a desktop CPU to do more fine-grained processing than what is possible within the power budget and form factor of a regular hearing aid.
[1] https://needgap.com/problems/22-enabling-hearing-aid-feature...
I have always wondered why it is so difficult to make hearing aid which can be connected to a bluetooth enabled TV or Mobile phone, so senior citizens can watch TV or talk to their loved one. Whatever is available on the market is so expensive.
They are actually two pieces, one is a match-box sized thingy that can connect to Bluetooth devices and that she wears around her neck that transmits to the devices in her ears and also has a microphone, it is very handy as she can easily answer the phone by pressing a button on it (leaving the telephone in the bag, it works as hand-free) and it also has two buttons that can regulate the volume of the hearing aids (the volume of her hearing aids can be regulated also through a teeny-tiny button on the back of the hearing aid, right hand one up, left hand down, but she simply cannot find/push them properly).
We got the above first to better adjust volume and for the telephone use, then she started getting issue with the TV and we bought the following.
Then there is a small transmitter connected to the TV that can link to the matchbox-like device (that has a fourth button to connect/disconnect to the TV device), it has both RCA plug and an optical input.
She is very, very happy of this setup for the TV, much more than what she had before (wireless headphones).
Prices are steep, to give you an idea, if I recall correctly:
hearing aids € 2,500
neck matchbox-like thingy € 250
TV transmitter € 300
The TV box thingy is like a "normal" Bluetooth transmitter for a TV, the only differences are that my mom's one has direct RCA and optical instead of an audio jack and a blue led to show it is powered and a brightish orange one to show if the connection is active, here it is:
https://www.hab.online/product/oticon-connectline-tv/
The neck thingy is this one: https://www.hab.online/product/oticon-streamer-pro/
The above (UK) site seems to have all versions of these thingies, here:
https://www.hab.online/product-category/wireless-and-remotes...
The alternative:
https://www.hab.online/product/oticon-connectclip/
we tried but it is too small for my mom to use comfortably.
Here is the manual of the streamer, with more details:
https://www.oticon.com/-/media/oticon-us/main/download-cente...
Check also this:
https://www.ndcs.org.uk/information-and-support/technology-f...
Why would that be, I wonder. Anyone know?
Or thats the average time till they get crushed/wet/stood on by the user?
The most expensive or cheapest are all the same when you have a medium high pitched buzz in your ear all day
https://journals.plos.org/plosone/article?id=10.1371/journal...
And of course in addition to the BOM comes production costs.
Even if the PCB costs 5x the quoted price, you're still rounding down to $1.
That said, I have no idea what production costs are for something like this.
The article's cost assumption is just based on the cost of the raw plastic material, which is hilarious (3D printer time doesn't really come free).
But in more realistic mass production you'd make a mold, and the cost of the mold is dependent on how many "shots" you want to get out of it. Making plastic parts at the cost of takeaway boxes requires expensive high-volume molds.
At 10k volume you'd be happy to get the box for $1 including amortised mold cost (though in reality the box could be much smaller, reducing mold & material costs some).
For injection molding, one would need to make the molds. That would cost probably more than 1000 USD, excluding engineering costs (the design is not injection molding ready). Amortizing the mold costs over 10k units alone would be 0.1 USD per unit. Then comes actually making the parts. Maybe 0.5 USD is doable.
I checked an off-the-shelf casing (no custom molds needed) it was quoted at 0.20 USD at 1K units - but this then needs to be CNC machined on 2 sides to add the necessary openings. Probably 1 USD a piece, at the least.
The costs in the scientific article does make any sense. It is really sad to see that it gets through peer review so easily... I mean OK that the scientist does not really know what things cost to produce, but then they need to consult someone who does! Ask a manufacturing or even a design house for a cost estimate. Quality check your numbers at least a little bit.
Send in the plans for them to check. Put on an expensive looking logo and paperwork.
Done.
Recruit one of them or work with of them to make the devices in bulk.
Buying any Chinese electronics off Aliexpress doesn't excite me too much. Generally, they suck.
There is no real innovation here. The work being done here is closer to a market research: find the cheapest components that do the job.
Cheap is also its only quality. $5000 hearing aids are better in every other aspect. It makes no sense for big hearing aid manufacturers to use anything about this design.