Comment by throwaway_ruok | Hacker News Reader

Comment by throwaway_ruok | Hacker News Reader

Not okay.

It's a worrying time being a Chinese person. On the one hand, I don't support CCP (hence the throw away); I find the dictatorship very troubling. Furthermore, the growing patriotism and nationalism makes me anxious about the next generation of Chinese.

On the other hand, many people outside tend to treat Chinese people and CCP as a whole, and denounce and dismiss everything we do. More and more people suggest severe measures against Chinese products, even when no evidence of foul play is found. Simply the potential of being malicious is enough to warrant doubts, scrutiny, and dismissal. If this trend continues, I don't know how to live in the west anymore. I can't imagine one day submitting a code change, and my code has to be reviewed by a specialized security expert, because my family lives in China.

Personally, I find no place to stand. The future looks to me like I'm going to be on an island of ideology, where the other Chinese despise me for not being loyal, and the westerners suspect me of being secretly loyal to CCP.

In the big picture, it feels like another cold war is coming, and, that has a crushing weight on me. All I ever wanted is a simple life, stable income, no need for luxury stuff; but if the cold war were to actually start, I don't see how I can build that life.

Hell, even an actual war might be looming, during which I and my family have a significant chance to die, given the existence of nuclear weapon, the effectiveness of the modern army, and the stubbornness of governments. And I just really don't want to die like that; it's so meaningless to die in a war.

I guess I just wrote this post to vent a little. It's something that I have absolutely no control (or even impact) over, but it looms over my shoulder every minute of every day. Every endeavor and achievement of mine pales in face of a global conflict, so I'm exceedingly demotivated to do anything these days. It feels like nothing matters, and everything is going to crumble anyway.

Apologies for bringing so much negativity. I hope everyone else is having a good day.

I kind of think there’s a lack of understanding amongst Americans regarding the Chinese people.

Ever since American CEOs decided to sell out the American worker with decades of offshoring manufacturing to China and our transition to a service economy, It’s been easy to channel the resentment away from the Americans responsible, and place blame on China. If China does things we don’t like, well, American Greed legitimized the relationship with the West in the first place.

None of that is the fault of the Chinese people; but our powers that be seemed to place the blame and hatred there. The fact is we’ve been pushed into a constant cycle of deteriorating civil decorum and mutual respect for each other. The coronavirus pandemic only exacerbates things.

I think if anything could help the bridge the divide, it would be to convince Americans that China is not full of people who lack the notion to think for themselves, and that people are not uniformly aligned on all issues. Individualism of thought is not a unique characteristic of the West.

I feel your anxiety as a chinese expat/immigrant/diaspora. However it's worth reminding that a lot of these feeling might come from online sensationalism or social media amplification. Real life is a bit different and you are more likely to deal with rational people. I've been living in a few European countries for more than a decade and fortunate enough to have acquainted folks from all walks of life in many cultures. The general public is surprisingly kind, knowledgeable, and tolerant towards sensitive or even ideological issues. I think communication is key and understanding can build many bridges. More bridges will eventually become a plane.

The world is a strange place right now and I often wonder if the people of generations past felt equally out of place in the various turmoils of their time.

Disinformation, willful ignorance and mass manipulation by anyone that can control the discourse of online communities is taking over the web that I grew up using and loved.

I fear all countries are slowly trying to become more isolationist at the expense of the rest of the world and the global community.

I have may friends with ties to China and they are like you, they don't support the CCP, but having family over there still means they feel like their hands are tied behind their backs.

I hope you find a way to fight for what you believe in and that you and your family stay safe throughout.

> The world is a strange place right now and I often wonder if the people of generations past felt equally out of place in the various turmoils of their time.

I think they did.. Not going too far back, I've heard tales from within the music sphere about much of the wanton drink/drug/smoke/sex culture and its general tie to the persistent feeling that the world was on the brink of nuclear war and collapse, and the lack of any feeling of control or ability to navigate it. Sadly, some didn't survive that, but they didn't presume they would anyway—just figured that something else would get them first.

Some grew older and maybe more wise and calm. Others grew older and more cynical and some of those are responsible or at least benefiting from our current set of turmoils.

Drink/drug/smoke are all the same thing and faux nihilism is often an excuse for hedonism.

Said faux nihilism was also a product produced by the music industry and sold a lot of records.

I live in Europe. China is often hard to understand and seen as a monolithic block. In Poland if something doesn't make any sense it's common to say "it's Chinese to me". The language, especially the characters, is probably the biggest barrier. I vaguely know that China contains a bunch of peoples and languages, regions with distinct cultures. But very little beyond that.

People fear what they don't understand. I think you could make a difference if you made it easier for outsiders to learn about China and Chinese. You don't need to start a blog or a youtube channel. Just point out some existing ones which give foreigners a decent idea about China. Or maybe some movies which illustrate (aspects of) China pretty well and are still accessible to typical Westerners. No, it won't work for people on the street. I don't have a solution for that.

Anyone have recommendations for where to start browsing https://youku.com for someone with nearly nonexistent language skills?

For instance, I still haven't run across a chinese lockdown clip equivalent to https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4BEPFJh4A9M yet I'm sure they must exist.

Zweig's The World of Yesterday captures his views on being caught in similar situations, in early and mid-twentieth century europe. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=24235877

Throwaway_ruok, try to stay positive and take care of your family and friends. It's better to worry about things we have a great deal of influence over than those which we do not.

    涸辙之鲋
    塞翁失马
    相濡以沫
    积少成多?

> I vaguely know that China contains a bunch of peoples and languages, regions with distinct cultures. But very little beyond that.

I know this is fairly off topic but I found Prisoners of Geography [1] a very accessible introduction to geopolitics. (Of course it only represents one point of view, so looking at some other sources would be advisable.) It has one chapter for each large country or continent, including one for China. I'm tempted to put a one-sentence summary of that chapter here based on my half-remembered interpretation of it, but I think that would do more harm than good!

[1] https://www.amazon.co.uk/Prisoners-Geography-Everything-Glob...

On a more fun note, what is considered "Chinese" varies greatly by language (it's Greek in English): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greek_to_me#In_other_languages

In German, wikipedia claims "Polish in reverse" (though there's no other reference to that phrase on the Net, other than Reverse Polish Notation).

As a German, I've never heard "Polish in reverse", but "Spanish" works exactly that way ("Das kommt mir spanisch vor").

"Can't you understand what I'm saying? Am I speaking Chinese?" is pretty common as well.

https://languagelog.ldc.upenn.edu/nll/?p=1024 has a directed graph.

I'm not surprised at all - it turns out Polish is one of the hardest languages to master. Norman Davies, a British historian fascinated by Central/Eastern Europe with a particular interest in Poland makes a couple of errors per several minutes of speech. Typically with noun genders.

https://donald-static.s3.amazonaws.com/userimage/8cabf28c970...

Thanks for a nice, honest post. I feel similar in some ways though I'm in the EU (well, I'm a brit and what we're due to drop out soon enough so even more worrying).

I have much the same aims as you, a decent, calm life with no luxuries, well I don't care for them. All I can usefully add is, where it's possible to have say in your governance, you need to invest the time and get involved because it doesn't come for free. I grant as a Chinese person you may not have that option, for those of us who do, we need to.

The world seems to be going slightly mad at the moment and while I expect us to get over it, it's an uncomfortable time on several fronts.

Good luck!

I have a few Chinese colleagues and a couple more Australian colleagues of Chinese background. I have been a little worried about how the first group are handling the strain lately. I hope they are OK. My feeling is anyone with an Australian accent is a local, anyone who I can communicate with easily can be a friend and anyone who I can communicate with can be a valued colleague.

No apologies necesaary.

Nationstates, ideologies and those who profit off their miasma are all bastards, but there are still actual people out there and you're one of them. If it all amounts to nothing --- it has still been great hurtling through the cosmos on a wet rock screaming in terror with you brother.

Quite the opposite, you bring value into all of our lives by sharing your perspective — Insight is one of the most precious gifts. Thank you for that.

There is nothing for you to apologize for.

Hey, hope you are ok. I for one do not equate CCP with Chinese people,and I try to make that point where it is needed.

Hope you are able to come through this ok.

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