Comment by Mz | Hacker News Reader

Comment by Mz | Hacker News Reader

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The more you try to manipulate people, the worse the culture becomes. Karma and such are technical solutions, which are tools and have their uses but the problem here is one of culture, it is a people problem. And people problems aren't readily resolved with technical solutions. One factor here is growth: It has grown too fast to absorb new members at a rate which allows for inculcation with the culture, so the culture is being damaged. Another is "popularity": Comments are "worse" because you have a higher number/percentage of people who are not as educated/savvy/cultured/whatever. Punishing people for simply not being as well-developed won't develop them -- or, more accurately, will develop them in exactly the wrong way and actively encourage that which is reviled here.

I'm getting tired of howling into the wind and beating a dead horse. My thoughts on such things are essentially ignored here while everyone who is respected (mostly technical sorts, who all want a technical solution to a people problem) rehashes how to manipulate the people with some new technical solution. I only tossed this out in hopes it helps you with whatever startup you are working on (and because it is 4:24am and I am suffering insomnia).

Peace.

I don't think it's that people aren't interested in your ideas, it's just that they are very obvious and don't offer a solution. The only possible solutions tried so far are the technical ones, because that's the nature of the people. If you have ideas on how to solve the problems you list in another way, that would be a major breakthrough.

I do have ideas and it is a major breakthrough. And it likely won't get picked up on because I'm too low on the totem pole.

I joined a forum a few years ago at a time when I was very ill, doped to the gills and had major trouble "behaving" myself, so not at my best. It had been around for a few years and the owner whined constantly that he wanted to increase membership, especially international membership, and couldn't figure out how. I was there six months and membership began going up dramatically, especially international membership -- so much so that they eventually created some subforums aimed at the international members. But I don't think anyone really knew it was me that engineered it. I wasn't even a moderator at the time. You don't have to be a moderator to treat other people well. In fact, it probably helps in some ways if you aren't a moderator because then it is simply an example of a decent human being, not a person with a duty to set the example.

More recently, I joined a forum with 300 members and almost no discussion. After I joined, people began talking to each other. Last I checked, it had 1800 members and has probably become the Go To place for its niche, likely displacing a more long-standing group for that niche. Why? In part because I got thrown out of the long-standing place. The fact is that in some ways, where I am, that's where the action is. Except I'm not a hacker. I don't expect to be all that influential on HN. I come here because I get to be treated like a normal human being and people, oh, talk to me instead of dividing up between those that worship me like a rock star and those that desperately want to shoot me down and put me in my place. So I am content with being a Nobody on HN and I have diabolical plans to remain a Noboby on HN so that it can remain a decent social outlet for me instead becoming ruined for me socially like every place where I ever became Somebody and then after fostering discussion generally on the forum, I was the only person no one would really talk to.

Still, I'm compulsively helpful, I tend to care, I have this unusual expertise (or insight or some such) and it just annoys the crap out of me when I can't give it away. Maybe some day I will come to my senses and stop caring about others and just use it the way most socially insightful people seem to use their skills: As manipulative ass-hats, for personal gain, because they know something others don't know. But I'm not there yet.

Peace.

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