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Comment by mey | Hacker News Reader

Using Kotlin without IntelliJ tooling is a pain.

I find using any language without IntelliJ tooling to be a pain. Not sure that's relevant.

FWIW I strongly dislike IDEs and avoid them at all costs (my reasons are varied and off-topic, and controversial so I won't mention them now). I've been able to use Vim + plugins to develop in a dozen different languages/platforms except Java/Kotlin. While it is doable it is a nightmare compared to other langs. A ton of Java/Kotlin/etc code is written with the expectation that the user is using an IDE, in some places I've worked they ever require a specific IDE.

I see you have your reasons so I am not going to try to sway your opinion. But other languages I have experience with, recently, are Go and Rust and there is no better platform to code like the JetBrains IDEs. I've tried VSCode myself and I know people who were trying other platforms, VI included. It's just no comparison.

Some people have strong preferences and that's fine but for general audience I strongly advise - try JetBrains IDE for your language od choice. Try it for a month and then go back to your old tool. In my case, JB IDEs are so convenient, accurate, feature rich and just fun to use that I find going back not pleasant experience.

That is another of their goals, sell IntelJ licenses.

Eclipse and VSCode plugins tend to be a bit behind, and good luck for other IDEs or editors.

Before downvoting this comment further, take a look at their stated goals for the language.

https://blog.jetbrains.com/kotlin/2011/08/why-jetbrains-need...

>The next thing is also fairly straightforward: we expect Kotlin to drive the sales of IntelliJ IDEA.

Kotlin is available in the free community edition of IntelliJ and in Android Studio

Naturally it is available on Android Studio, how else could Android team drive Kotlin adoption as Java replacement?

As for community edition, try to debug Kotlin/Native with it.

Fwiw, I've found that working on Java without IntelliJ to be a pain. Imo it's way more feature-rich than VSCode or Eclipse at this point.

ever try to use Swift without xCode?

Swift and xcode are owned by Apple, for iOS/macOS/watchOS also owned by Apple, to replace Objective-C, also owned by Apple.

Objective-C and Swift runtimes are also owned by Apple.

Not the same kind of comparison.

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