Most Americans don’t have enough assets to withstand 3 months without income
today.oregonstate.edu
today.oregonstate.edu
And there's the crux of it. "The system", when it's working towards a sustainable civilisation, must provide some level of protection for those who don't have the ability to make good decisions. Scammers and advertising as one example. Regulation and fines that are enforced and sufficiently discouraging.
It's too easy to profit off the bottom end.
Finding where protections intersect with personal freedoms / responsibility is the perpetual impossibility.
Someone without retirement savings is declared to be unable to retire. Except for Social Security and Medicare. They paid into those. Those are saving.
What these miss is that plenty of saving is being done by people, but it is done through government programs so it does not get classified as saving.
A large fraction of people have debt, such as student loans, mortgages, car loans, etc. If they have a significant amount of extra cash, they'll use it to reduce their debt, because money sitting in a bank account makes less interest than the interest on a mortgage or any other sort of loan. So if you look at these peoples' bank accounts, they don't have any savings. Scary, right? But most of them do have lines of credit, so if they have a financial setback, they won't lose the ability to buy groceries, they'll just take on additional debt.
1. Although I agree it’s a problem, this isn’t new news I don’t believe. I don’t have good references to point to right this second, but I swear I hear almost monthly if not more often that most people couldn’t come up with $500-1k in an emergency, much less multiple months of expenses.
2. The article points to COVID-19 exacerbating these findings, but on top of the cash every US tax payer received who made under the defined threshold, there were a ton of things put in place or implemented like aid, loan forbearance plans, rent extensions etc. as apart of COVID-19. It seems a little (but I guess not totally) surprising that this crisis is what brought to light this issue.
As in, their advice is worthwhile, in as much as it helps you live your life in a way that makes you happier. Beyond that, they're just as stupid as everyone else.
You don't want to get ill and have no emergency money left besides.
Low-to-Moderate income, if defined by the median being moderate, would count up to 50% as a whole group.
77% of 50% of the population is NOT "Most Americans", another deceitful headline not supported by data.
The headline may be wrong, I'm unsure, but you aren't even looking at the data.
Banks and businesses prefer consumers this way, and any attempt to get people to live "within their means" will fail because of the push back from that side as well as the general discomfort and distaste for living less well (and less healthily, at least in the US - quality food is expensive).
A far better solution is to address income inequality and to bring equity to the results of everyone's work. Wage growth has been too low for decades which has been great for corporate owners and investors, but bad for society.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bowling_Alone
Things are never as good or as bad as they seem, but it sure seems bad right now.
This logic breaks down when you get an unexpected medical bill, or the car you rely to get to your job breaks down and you get fired, etc.
The latest iPhones and Androids are quite affordable compared to healthcare and rent in this country.
What you call unnecessary spending is what actually floats the entire economy. If everyday folks’ disposable income dries up, the whole country will suffer, even your bullshit startup in a converted loft in SOMA or whatever it is that you do that earns you a six figure living.
I get tired how this argument is used to justify so much BS.
I think this pandemic has debunked this. You forget the other part that is saving is what generates real capital to invest, not debt.
There seems to be some logical disconnect here. Saving diligently will help you tide over the things you mention. How is this an argument against saving ?
NPR has a good series on medical bills that comes out pretty frequently. Here is one where the 14 weeks of dialysis for a new kidney cost about a half million dollars. The person's insurance is via the spouse who is also a MD. The family is likely going bankrupt :
https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2019/07/22/7431809...
Scroll through a few of them, NPR has pretty good reporting on this issue.
The US medical system is a revolting tragedy.
How?
I have experienced all of those things -- except replace "getting fired" with "my business failed".
My "oh shit" fund -- six months' worth of expenses -- got me through every one of those personal disasters. It gave me peace of mind, and the financial space to take care of myself, recover, and get back on the horse.
It was empowering.
Anybody can do this, if they want. It isn't easy, mind you.
It takes a big shift in mindset, time, and in my case, paying the price for a lot of poor decisions.
You aren't going to live in a trending part of town, or hit the bar every week. You'll cook at home a lot, probably live in a shared house, might even share a car or ride a bike to work. I've done all of those things.
And it is harder than it used to be.
Boomers don't get that.
Wages are lower.
Medical costs are insane -- and neither the establishment Republicans or Democrats have done anything to fix that, mind you.
Society encourages people to make horrible decisions, like borrowing insane amounts of money to buy the "college experience" and earn a worthless degree.
And the more of those traps you have fallen into, the harder climbing out of the hole will be.
Myself, I had to pay off a bunch of stupid debt.
But once you start to live below your means, and you experience that freedom, you never want to go back to the spend-everything-you-make lifestyle.
If you’re in a position where you can easily start a (nonetheless failing) frivolous social app startup you’re already much more comfortable than most of the country.
> And it is harder than it used to be.
That’s the point. Certain individuals can still succeed today, but the fact that it is harder now than it was in the past is a point of concern.
I did work, hourly, for money.
We've added nice perks to the house: deck, redid the bathroom & kitchen etc... but those are for us and making us happy. We didn't do it to keep up with the jones
It would have been smarter If i could have figured out how to work the (fractional reserve banking) system, instead I just avoided it as much as possible.
You have a point, but it comes across as insensitive when you fail to account for the uneven playing field most folks are struggling against. As a former "let them die" libertarian, I think I've come to the place where I realize it's not so clear cut. We have an economic system with non-linear results. Being wealthy usually makes you more wealthy with less effort than it takes to escape poverty.
After being financially devastated by a divorce, I am humbled and understand why people pursue short-term pleasure. Life is short and often brutal. I don't fully blame people who use whatever means available to find comfort, pleasure and happiness. Yes, I know wealth is not a sustainable path to those things, but it definitely works in the short term.
I have leaned libertarian (and still do to an extent) when it comes to many things, but I've never quite identified with the more right-wing 'individual responsibility' / 'poor people are a result of their own choices' perspective.
my personal experiences and having had many close friends who grew up poor or in otherwise very shitty situations make it so clear to me that a lot of the good choices I make are profoundly influenced by my direct surroundings (both physical and social), as well as an upbringing that, while poverty-line, was excellent.
My parents and extended family were great role models, and much as I might grumble about problems in our educational system, it was still pretty good. I was 'funneled' into having friends that also were more of a good than bad influence.
As I entered my twenties and explored the world, I met many people who weren't so fortunate. And as frustrating as it was at times to observe their 'bad choices', knowing the full and often painful story of all the stuff they didn't have growing up (role-models, time to just self-learn, a safe environment, etc.) made me more empathic than judgmental.
That's not to say that I believe nobody has their own responsibilities, or that bad behavior can just be excused by blaming parents or whatnot. Rather, it's complicated and I've been lucky enough to not be able to fully understand (many of the) the complications.
$24 per hour, and presumably that's per worker. Over three times national minimum wage, and nearly double California's minimum wage.
Median households income is $63k as of 2018, meaning all your neighbors are likely above this.
There will always be a tiny percentage of people who are in financial trouble because they had some catastrophic illness, or they got fired repeatedly through picking bad employers, or something else. But the vast majority of people could learn to spend less than they make and invest for the future. It's completely simple.
But it also requires discipline. I think therein lies the rub.
This should be obvious? Wealth can grow exponentially and more or less indefinitely, but income does not. Since 1990, median hourly wages are beating inflation by a slim margin. An investment in the S&P 500 in 1990, adjusted for inflation, would be worth 7x. With 4 companies now in the Trillion Dollar Club, that inequality seems to be accelerating.
Does that imply that Americans are not wealthy because they don't plan their finances for the purpose of growing wealth? Andrew Yang wants to help with UBI, but I wonder if people would simply spend up to their new income and be in the same 3 month boat. They'd have more stuff and more fun and eat better and live in a better location. But many would still 3 months from insolvency.
Personal financial management should be taught as a life skill in high school.
technically, it does, but in practical terms, there is essentially no wage growth above inflation, 7% since 1990: https://www.brookings.edu/blog/up-front/2019/09/10/are-wages...
We’re extremely fortunate because my income covers our monthly expenses, but it was a huge financial blow for us and we are conserving cash like crazy. I can’t even imagine someone who lost all their family income going through the same thing.
So, yes, there absolutely is need to worry.