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Comment by partiallypro | Hacker News Reader

I get the criticism, want, and need...but comparing a $120K+ Porsche to a $20K average car isn't exactly a fair comparison, even when it comes to headlights. The replacement cost on that headlight is probably astronomical, where I can replace a bulb for $40. I don't even know if the Boxster which is around ~$60K comes with these headlights. A quick lookup and those Porsche headlights cost ~$2K EACH.

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> I get the criticism, want, and need...but comparing a $120K+ Porsche to a $20K average car isn't exactly a fair comparison, even when it comes to headlights.

You get matrix light as an extra from nearly all manufactures in in Europe (or at least Germany). Certainly from all "premium" manufacturers but e.g. also from Opel or Volkswagen. In fact Opel (formerly owned by GM) was one of the first to introduce them.

Matrix LED are available with most large manufacturers in Europe. You can buy a $30k car equipped with those as well. They always cost extra but are not exclusively sold with high end cars.

My Peugeot has these lights, cost me £16800 new.

The lights last the lifetime of the car.

You probably could take them out after the car dies and use for another decade or two, if you found a good use for them ;)

>Peugeot

>after the car dies

I see what you did there :D

> A quick lookup and those Porsche headlights cost ~$2K EACH.

That sounds low. My Toyota's headlights are $1,200 each.

But you can replace your bulbs for less than $100, it would appear due to the housing mechanics, etc you'd have to replace the entire headlight unit if one went out for this particular setup.

Also the quote I looked at was used, someone else here posted it might cost more like $5K each, new.

No, I can't. There are no replaceable headlight bulbs on my Toyota either. Just like this Porsche, you replace the entire unit if it goes bad. This is the norm for OEM LED headlamps -- they're considered lifetime parts, not wear items.

I'm not sure why you think this but it is very incorrect. I can't speak for your Toyota, but most car headlight assembly's absolutely allow for replacing the bulbs inside them.

Your dealership may not tell you this because they're incentivized to sell you that 2k housing, but do some research and you will almost certainly find that you can replace the bulb for $50 or less.

> most car headlight assembly's absolutely allow for replacing the bulbs inside them.

Yes, because the vast majority of OEM head lamps are still not LEDs.

You must be thinking about HIDs.

OEM LED housings almost universally have no user serviceable access for their LED components, nor do they have standardized "bulbs". You can find plenty of videos of people 'opening' LED headlamps on YouTube [0][1] -- it is a destructive process. The housings are sonically welded with the LED components inside, and the only way in is by cutting them open.

While there are retrofit bulbs for halogen housing (made in the shape of halogen bulbs) for the aftermarket, no OEMs use these for factory LED lighting.

But you don't have to take my word for it:

1. Go look up any vehicle with factory LEDs on the websites of Sylvania, Philips, Hella, etc. You will find that they do not list bulbs for those lamps.

2. Read the owners manual or parts diagram for any vehicle with factory LEDs -- you won't find bulbs in the parts diagrams, and the owners manuals will explain that the housing must be replaced.

[0]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Im62XNqgFU

[1]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uqIV0M9fpY4

It’s a really poor argument and also very misleading. They make it sound as if this is something special that is not found on this continent. Many manufacturers have excellent LED headlamps. They just have a static beam pattern. I’m sure over time as cost becomes less of a factor and as regs change these adaptive units will become more common.

The ones on this website say they are £3,800 each for a 2019+ 911 Turbo (992).

https://www.design911.com/Porsche/Porsche-992--911--2019--/9...

Yeah, I was looking at used prices, but I can't tell if your link is for the pair, or just for one.

What a bargain! The Ferrari ones are $2600. /s

As with all automotive parts, eventually the price will come down. Currently they are luxury, in some years they will be commodity.

They're also from a luxury brand that commands a premium price above and beyond its actual cost of supply. Give it five years and an entry level Hyundai will come with equivalent headlights and they'll only cost $100 to replace.

Brands like Hyundai and Toyota have been coming out with sealed LED units for years, and they cost thousands to replace

The headlights are not that cheap. Expensive optics, expensive LEDs with carefully selected emission spectrums, cooling solutions.

I checked and wow, you're right, they're expensive! Cheapest I could find for replacement LED headlights was $620 or so per headlight.

But do they break down as often? If it's about physical breakage (car crash), you're going to change more than just the light bulb for either tech. And it will cost more with traditional bulbs, too.

Why would you want to replace LED headlights? LEDs themselves are typically specified for 50k hours, a much longer useful life than car engines (~10k hours / 180000 km). Also, because these are individually dimmed array lights, even if a single element dies, it's not a big problem and wouldn't require replacing the unit.

Maybe in case of a fender bender?

By then, the lights will be tied to your VIN number and only replaceable by the dealership.

>eventually the price will come down

Not for Porsche owners. They sell at a premium, all the time.

A bit like dual clutch transmissions - a few years back only to be found on exotics now I have one on my very modest 1l Škoda.

>but comparing a $120K+ Porsche to a $20K average car isn't exactly a fair comparison, even when it comes to headlights

It's not fair but it gives software devs an opportunity to bike-shed on the tech and clutch pearls over other people's behavior (god forbid the poors install $10 Ebay LEDs that aren't even as bright as the halogens they're replacing) so 300+ comments later here we are.

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