Hacker News Reader

I don't get why Google creates problems for themselves by relying on unproven tech or working backwards. Case in point: adaptive battery. Androids have historically had poor battery efficiency (mah vs. screen on time) against iPhones. Rather than optimize the OS and the apps and provide a larger capacity battery, they size down the battery and introduce software-based battery management with AI. Common responses to complaints on /r/GooglePixel about piss poor battery life are that the user hasn't waiting long enough for the system to develop a proper AI/ML model.

Another example: RCS. A protocol that neither carriers nor users actually want. 7 years after iMessage took over the US, Google is still unable to provide a functional E2E encrypted multi-device messaging service with all the doo-dads that come with iMessage.

So many more textbook examples out there.

Google got wedged between the desire to create a imessage competitor, and not alienating every carrier / OEM.

RCS works. I am glad it's here. It would have been far more helpful 3 years ago though.

The most boggling decision is what has happened with Hangouts.

> Common responses to complaints on /r/GooglePixel about piss poor battery life are that the user hasn't waiting long enough for the system to develop a proper AI/ML model.

Oof, this sounds like the sort of thing that could go really frustratingly wrong in some cases. Do you happen to know if this results in apps being erroneously killed when switching to the background? My phone killing whatever is playing on Spotify or Podcast Addict when I switch to another app has been a recurring annoyance for me on Android. I've always been able to find a fix but, bewilderingly, the fix has been different on almost every phone I've had.

The Americans waited for their phones to develop a proper AI/ML model. The Russians used a bigger battery!

Apple and Google aren't both just using jabber for messaging?

I bought a Pixel 3A a few months ago and my battery lasts 2 days without charging it. I use it for regular browsing, Instagram, twitter, and it is constantly using networks because I have Whatsapp always on on my computer.

I've been wondering for years what the hell people were doing with their phones to make them run out of battery in a day. I can't remember the last time any phone I've had got below 50% on a day with normal usage.

I guess people play a lot of mobile games?

I think it _very_ heavily depends on what apps you have installed and how much they do in the background (especially while you have the screen off). Similarly, screen time plays a huge role (e.g. someone with 2 hours a day vs 4 hours a day).

Yeah, I think it's mostly screen time. Someone getting 2 days out of a 3a isn't using it 6 hours a day. But some people do.

I'm playing podcasts and music using the phone's speakers at high volume and cellular data with poor reception. Drains my iPhone XS in about 8 hours. Using my AirPods instead of my phone doubles my battery life to a more reasonable 16 hours.

And yes, 8+ hours continuously streaming audio. My brain can't stand any long periods of silence.

A heavy tourist day with lots of navigation and photos will eat my 3a battery before the day is over if I'm not careful.

I have had a pixel 3a since they came out. I noticed recently the battery life seems to have been improved with a firmware update. At the end of the day I used to have 30% and now I have 60% with what seems to me no change in use. Just anecdotal so I may be dreaming, but this phone lasts two days easily if I need it to.

Yep, I bought a Pixel 3A when it first came out and I'm still consistently getting 2+ days battery with every charge. It's honestly amazing to not have to worry about batteries anymore; whenever it gets low I just charge for 15-30 minutes back up to 75% and I'm good to go for at least a day (repeat ad infinitum).

It's a perfect encapsulation of why I just can't wrap my head around phones without a headphone jack. Why would you want to worry about managing battery levels on more devices? Going from 1-->0 is the dream and I don't think I'd ever upgrade to a phone where I have to worry about battery again, let alone a phone where I have to worry about two batteries.

Same, my little 3A is a battery life trooper. The only reason I am looking at the 4A is because one of my family members 3A phone screen was cracked by a coworker. That 3A still works and is mostly still usable, even if the screen perspective is a little off.

I'm not a huge Apple fanboy by any measure, but one thing I do appreciate is that they consider wireless charging to be a table stakes feature, and include it even in their "budget" phones. They clearly understand how dramatically it elevates the user experience.

Compare that to every Android manufacturer who either don't offer wireless charging at all or gate it to flagships, it's a really sad state of affairs for someone like myself who won't even consider a phone without wireless charging today.

Never used wireless charging but also never really understood what is so dramatically elevating about it. Is it just the requirement for 1 hand vs. 2 hands that people find so life-changing? Doesn't it waste a ton of power in the process?

(Not using wireless charging either)

One advantage is that it does not destroy the USB port. Constant plugging and unplugging can really wear some ports after 1-2 years, depending on manufacturing quality. To the point that it won't charge anymore. (Hopefully will be less of an issue with USB-C which seems better designed than microUSB). Plus the convenience.

To counter that though, it's not nearly as efficient and the additional heat definitely puts more stress on the battery possibly lowering it's lifespan.

My hunch is that you're probably correct about the heat effects of wireless charging on battery lifespan to some degree, but I'd love to see more emperical studies on the topic. Especially comparing it to usage of wired quick charge solutions that tend to result in much higher spikes in temperature than wireless charging, but over a shorter timespan. It's not obvious to me that one would be more harmful to battery lifespan than the other.

Newer wireless chargers also usually have some form of active heat management (i.e. fans), and anecdotally my phone only ever gets lukewarm to the touch, even with a somewhat bulky case on it.

At the end of the day though, I personally wouldn't mind having to upgrade my phone slightly faster than I would otherwise in order to enjoy the convenience offered by wireless charging, but definitely speaking from a position of privilege here.

A cheap workaround for me is to use magnetic USB connectors & cables. They are small enough to have a connector permanently attached to most my devices and I have several matching cables on my desk, in the car etc.

I found about this option on a motorcycle forum where a specific helmet headset was quite sensible to breaking the micro USB charging port. I bought a couple of cables and several micro-SUB connectors, then I bought a handful of USB-C ones and a few more cables and now everything is by default using magnetic connections.

Seems like an expensive way to workaround a weak port

It's one of those things that you don't think you'd need until you have had it, and then wonder why you've gone so far in life without it.

As someone who constantly has to step away from my desk during the day, I don't have to think about charging the phone anymore. It automatically goes on the wireless stand (directly in front of me) when I'm back at my desk. I can be certain that if I choose to go out for the evening after work, I wouldn't have to worry about being stranded somewhere far from home because my phone died. (Side note: Uber and Lyft have really decimated the taxi industry, even for a downtown area in a medium-size city.)

Oh I see. But putting it in the charger all the time just makes the battery die more quickly, right? Though I see the value now if you don't care about that.

It might lose some life from keeping the battery at a high level, but it will gain life from using the battery less.

If you can keep it from charging too high, it's all upside.

The last 10-20% of the charging causes most battery wear (many times more than in the mid band). So charging from almost-full to full many times per day is going to be harder on the battery than charging fewer times per day.

This is especially pronounced on phones, where batteries are already calibrated to have a high charge cutoff (ie battery longevity vs capacity compromise is heavily at the capacity end).

What I don't get is why phones can't be configured to just never charge past 80% or so, for people who rarely need that 100%, and would rather the battery wear less.

It's a thing for some laptops; e.g. Lenovo specifically advertises such a setting.

Apparently you can do it on rooted Android, though I haven't tried it (eg https://www.androidexplained.com/battery-charge-limit/)

Apple specifically has software features to protect the battery from the consequences of that usage pattern.

https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT210512

You need it to work around the inability to charge while using headphones.

Completely agree. Given that a lot of smartphone maker's model has been to wait for Apple to do something and then copy it (whether it was a good idea or not) I was really surprised that wireless charging didn't become a standard feature for Android phones after Apple added it.

Is wireless charging like this having any negative impacts on phone battery with daily usage/charging patterns?

My Nexus 4 had wireless charging back in 2012; the Nexus 4 very much being a budget phone.

I am a bit disappointed about how wireless charging was ripped out of Android phones instead of simply being the standard. I thought the iPhone finally adopting it would bring it back to Android phones but it does not seem like the case.

Ah yep, the good old Nexus 4, that's how I was introduced to wireless charging as well.

I bought an iPhone11Pro and bought a charger. Tried it for about 2 weeks, one of 4 times I'd wake up and it failed to charge. I stopped using wireless charging.

I think there's a reason Apple doesn't sell a wireless charger and that's because they couldn't get it to work reliably. So, they can add the feature to the phone but don't have to take any support calls on how flaky it is since they can blame the non Apple charger.

One of the problems with wireless charging is that I typically get a cheap $5 "rugged" case from eBay that lets me drop my phone with harm only potentially happening to my disposable case. unfortunately, those cases block wireless charging

Dramatically evaluate the user experience? It removes inconveniences while adding downsides.

It has been understand that wireless charging causes the battery to heat more, which potentially can decrease the battery lifespan.

People are also constrained in what cases they buy lest it blocks wireless charging.

People cannot use it on the desk when battery is empty.

It is also less efficient when charging, taking more time compared to wired charging.

Now I have higher-end phone (AQUOS zero2) but it doesn't feature Qi to make it lighter, and I love the decision. Previously I had Galaxy S8 that features Qi but I don't use it much because it gets hotter while charging so not seems good for battery health.

Adopting Qi has another side effect: it prevents using metal to back surface, so most high-end phones choose to use glass rather than resin so phones are much getting heavier.

> the Pixel line of phones isn't known for having long lasting battery

Anecdote: I still have a 2XL and it can get me through 24 hours. It's gotten a _little_ worse recently which I attribute to hardware age. The camera is fantastic, so I have no need to upgrade (although having stereo speakers would be nice.)

I also own a 2XL and really enjoy it. Sadly google will stop supplying updates this fall.

In theory, should be less of an issue with Project Mainline now. Of course, we said the same thing with Project Treble. Though it is starting to feel like the idea of an Android Version Upgrade is becoming less and less meaningful with so much of the OS modular and upgradable with Google Play now.

<---Pixel 2 XL owner who really sees little reason to upgrade.

The Pixel 2XL does have stereo front facing speakers...

Oh, not mine. Hardware issue then. Only the "bottom" speaker works.

Anecdote: I have a $250 Xiaomi phone, and it lasts 3 days on average.

> That said, the Pixel line of phones isn't known for having long lasting battery. A feature that I've found to be indispensable is wireless charging.

Note that wireless charging causes a lot of heat, which is like cryptonite for battery longevity.

> That said, the Pixel line of phones isn't known for having long lasting battery. A feature that I've found to be indispensable is wireless charging. I just rest my Pixel 4 on a vertical charging base throughout the day. Otherwise, I'd have to have to constantly plug/unplug the phone throughout the day to charge, and that'd be a huge regression in the user experience.

Note that the 4a actually has a larger battery than the 4, per the article, so this complaint may well be addressed by this device.

About 12% larger capacity. Not enough of an improvement to eliminate this problem.

The 4a also uses a lower power SOC and a 60hz screen, which is likely to make a more substantial difference.

60hz screen at lower resolution as well.

It’s not. Check out the One Plus Nord at the same price. (EU and India only, though)

There's wireless charging adapters, not ideal, no fast charging, but it's something. Or magnetic cables which I find is better solution. Ultimately, nothing beats just having a massive battery and 2-3 day endurance.

In Canada, with tax it goes up to CA$550.73. Not worth it.

what BT accessories did you settle on?

Bose QCII to tune out noise, Bose SoundWear Companion when it's too hot for the QCII, Plantronics Voyager Edge for calls on the go, and Jabra Halo Smart as a backup that lives in bag all the time.

Hands-free calling is quite important to me. :)