FAA issues emergency directive on 2,000 Boeing 737 NG, Classic planes
reuters.com
reuters.com
Measure the clearance between the flapper bushings at both locations on each engine bleed air 5th stage check valve. If the clearance between the flapper bushings is a minimum of 0.004 inch (0.102 mm) at both locations, the engine bleed air 5th stage check valve at that location has passed this inspection.
I knew that aviation engineering dealt with tight tolerances, but boy, it must be difficult to make a call like that when you're dealing with thousandths of an inch. Do field technicians have dependable tools and methods of measuring with such high degrees of precision?
I used to be involved in some intermediate gunsmithing work, and we had these tools called 'dial calipers' which have a little gauge you read and you can measure extremely precise things. We used it for getting cylinder diameters or clearances that needed that degree of precision.
I can only imagine that in aviation, there are even more advanced tools, especially with a well-respected corp like Boeing.
I would think also, that when there are these clearance issues in parts, part of the concern that makes it worth raising flags over is the fact that it's consistently off amongst different aircraft. If someone were to bring me a rifle that had some important gas clearance off, I wouldn't be that concerned, just do the work and get it back in the field, but if guys are bringing me the same rifle with the same issue over and over, it makes me really uneasy because it's inefficient for my shop, and it points to carelessness from the vendor, which raises suspicion when dealing with orthogonal issues from the same vendor.
If these flapper bushings are bad consistently, and they had a spec and didn't meet it, what other corners did they cut?
Just my two cents. I don't know shit about aviation, but I can appreciate the systemic concern.
757 to replace the 727 when the 727 was doing quite fine. That said the 757 is a great plane and proved out well, just had a high price tag that really held it back.
The delay and screwing around with getting the 767 out there for fear it would mess with 747 sales. Let airbus get ahead with wide-bodies and took longer than expected to get the ER variants out.
Post McDonnell Dougals:
The handling of the 717 (basically shutting it down when there was demand). Could have had an impact if they wanted to bring it to the regional space (to go against the crj900+ and EMB ejets).
Oh so much in the planning and execution of the 787.
The continued extending of the 737 well beyond what it should be (see the 900, the MAX).
[edit] remove a word
They can regain respect by building new good products. Or by admitting mistakes, surely not by laying blame on the pilots.
I am less forgiving. If you want to forgive them, that's your choice.
Mostly obtained by acquisitions.
In current production only the 737, 747, 777 and 787 and T-7 originate solely from Boeing.
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aerospace_manufacturer#Largest...
787 - Historically over budget and delayed. Failed static wing deflection test, showing how much we can trust the FEA work. In cockpit battery fires led to a historic worldwide grounding of Boeing commercial aircraft. A NTSB report blamed (in part) Boeing engineers for not considering worst case scenario for a lithium battery in a cockpit compartment that contained no fire suppression system. A grounding like the one OP linked is not unprecedented, it is of the 'the plane is grounded until it passes an inspection' type. The battery fire issue led to a 'all planes are grounded until Boeing has a fix.' I believe that this is the first time that Boeing had an aircraft grounded in this way. I believe it was 3 months for Boeing to have an FAA approved fix. Incidentally the 'fix' was a heavy duty sheet metal box around the battery, with a vent to outside the aircraft. I suppose time will tell how reliable a fix this is. Finally there have been issues with debris being left in fuel tanks, metal shavings in wire bundles, etc. Allegedly in aircraft delivered to customers.
737 MAX - A half-baked software bodge has left hundreds dead and all these aircraft grounded worldwide. This is the second time Boeing had a commercial aircraft grounded worldwide with no end in sight. As with the 787 there are issues with debris being found in "complete" aircraft, with foreign object material being found in fuel tanks AFTER the aircraft has left assembly and passed inspection.
KC-46A (Air Force Refueling Tanker) - Years late, over a $1B over budget. Egg on face issues like not having the (required) FAA approval for fuel pods and drogue system. Repeated issues where Air Force refused delivery because of... debris in fuel tanks.
Starliner Crew Capsule - multiple critical software errors that meant the capsule never docked with the ISS and was nearly lost.
There are some common threads here. Bad software for 737 MAX and Dreamliner. Foreign object material ending up in wings and fuel tanks over and over.
Finally there is good reading to be had about quality issues in assembly, parts being rejected as defective and then "disappearing." Whistleblowers are reporting that the "disappeared" defective parts such as tail assemblies are ending up on aircraft and being delivered to customers. It seems there is pressure from management to sacrifice safety for profit, pressure to approve designs (thanks to some really good lobbying, Boeing essentially gets to approve its own designs with minimal FAA oversight), pressure to keep you mouth shut about safety concerns (and retaliation if you don't).
These are not signs of a healthy company. By now I think that Boeing has slid into "all-around shitty." The above is my best recollection of news stories from years of watching Boeing, if I have made a mistake then I am happy for any corrections. Let me know if you would like links to any of the particular stories or believe that a [citation needed] is in order.
Do you really truly think that just because the MAX is a POS, that everything that comes out of Boeing can be evaluated under that same lens? Surely you aren't so blind to the reality that engineers do occasionally produce quality work.
To your credit, I wouldn't fly myself or my family in a MAX, but I'm not uneasy about getting into a Boeing aircraft across the board, at the same time. That'd just be irrational.
Perhaps you could clarify your stance, as you may know more than your post reveals.
No I do not. I still wouldn't ever refer to Boeing as well-respected nowadays. Granted, it may be irrational quirk of mine.
To clarify, do I respect Boeing? Yes. But I would not make a post on the Internet and write out "well-respected". I understand Boeing's cultural shift from being an engineering-first company and its MAX fiasco would not warrant "well-respected" in many people's eyes nowadays.
Was Boeing well-respected in the past? Yes. Is Boeing well-respected nowadays? Yes. But to deliberately write it out to me feels like trolling and stoking fire. You surely must understand that a lot of people lost a bit of respect for Boeing in recent years.
I'm a pretty forgiving person, I've spent some time in and around rehab and I've learned personally the value there is in giving people a chance they don't deserve. I know how hard some of the engineers at any big industro-* corp are working, and I choose to have hope that those hard-working folks' ideas and values are represented in the product line that they serve on.
I didn't mean to say that recent events should be scrutinized any less critically, and I disagree with that, especially in the case of passenger aircraft, the utmost care should be taken.
I've read a little bit about 737 MAX, and it strikes me as one of those things where too many boardroom cowboys got to run off and make deals, and the brains and engineers and designers were left with the scraps of an impossible task.
I don't know. I just have a soft spot because I can imagine what it's like for a lot of those guys, going to work and doing their best, and the project is so large that there's just not much any single person can do when it all begins to fall apart at the seams and catch fire. I feel bad that all those people have this terrible mark on them because of the product being a huge, public, terrible failure.
Boeing has done incredible things for the field of aviation, aerospace, maritime, rescue, you name it, they've made a flying vehicle to do it. That can't be washed away because a bunch of guys fucked it up, because it wasn't the people that worked the hardest. So, while I perceive that critically, I respect the name Boeing for what it's given the world in the past.
Anyhow, I wasn't trying to start anything by writing that, I guess it was just part of my thought process that didn't get edited into words very well.
Thanks for your perspective.
>I can only imagine that in aviation, there are even more advanced tools, especially with a well-respected corp like Boeing.
Lol. "More advanced" often being something a long the lines of a $100000 dollar go-nogo gauge because you don't trust your employees to read a measuring tool.
>If these flapper bushings are bad consistently,
Bushings are probably (i.e. "almost certainly" but I wasn't in that engineering meeting so I don't know for sure) a wear item and of course they could build beefy ones but the OEM has to balance between weight and maintenance hours. Doesn't surprise me that a little extra corrosion grit in there makes them go out of spec fast.
>if guys are bringing me the same rifle with the same issue over and over, it makes me really uneasy because it's inefficient for my shop, and it points to carelessness from the vendor
The whole value proposition of a Hi-point or a Chinese pump shotgun is that the manufacturing tolerances are wide opens so that your wallet doesn't have to be.
Thanks for your post, you are clearly much more aware of aviation than I am, and what you've explained makes perfect sense.
I could've clarified that while I wasn't in control of ordinance, I had some level of trust in those who were, as I'd expect the engineers at Boeing have some level of trust in the designs and blueprints they are working on.
I'm curious to know more about the attitude that an engineer might have about their role in Boeing. It often seems that Boeing is being dragged through the mud, and rightfully so in some part due to the 737 MAX. However, I know enough to know that shit often rolls downhill, even onto those who never ate in the first place. I imagine there could be some disgruntled vibes going around in the shops, far from the boardrooms.
Surely there's some sort of chart they've made for all these parts and how fast they're allowed to decay, given some number of flight-hours?
I think the issue here is the lack of flight-hours. These parts were designed and specified for an in-use plane, not one that sits around.
An airplane is an extremely expensive asset and they are typically almost constantly in service. It's very rare for one to be idled for months at a time.
The non-precise way you've already heard about, sheet of paper, check for dragging.
The better (more precise) way, is using a magnetic base micrometer attached to your extruder head. You can then watch the bed run-out in real time; if your 3d printer supports many configurable sections across the bed ( I know Prusa style cartesian units mostly all support quadrants) you can record the run out everywhere across the plane without any more physical work than watching the gauge and recording the results.
P.S. be careful using both the micrometer and the feeler gauges on a 3d printer bed. Most work plates now-a-days are using PEI coatings that'll scrape off easily with metal-on-metal contact.
Yeah, you're correct, it's a glass bed so I use it to do the 4 corners (every few months) and then use a BL touch to do a 3x3 grid on top of it.
Believe it or not, that's actually a lot of the idea that drives commercial aviation design.
Or used to anyway.
> A complex system that works is invariably found to have evolved from a simple system that worked. A complex system designed from scratch never works and cannot be patched up to make it work. You have to start over, beginning with a working simple system. - John Gall
Despite what we see on the web more and more, this principle applies to code too.
It shouldn't be about stacking up layers of complexity for no good reason.
His example was designing brackets for a Indonesian construction company that was using locally sourced tropical softwoods for constructing buildings. The brackets were designed to be made with 'steel' and the tolerances were compatible with a hungover guy running a drill press.
It seems like we really like to push the limits when it comes to shooting each other.
Weapons can be used for defensive purposes. There's nothing inherently wrong with them, only how people use them.
> parts you couldn't use parts from one rifle on another without a smith
You cannot swap bolts in the field on most rifles. At minimum, you require a go/no go gauge. The tolerances on modern firearms are very precise.
In my experience, I think you're probably right, it does seem like people may take them as "more accurate."
These planes have regular maintenance checks and diagnostics to help identify issues before they become catastrophic failures. This whole thing is likely a normal maintenance issue, maybe unexpected due to the unusual nature of the scenario they face with so many idle jets, but not something that would have escaped their servicing routines. The system flagged a problem and now they can address it. If for some reason their diagnostics were not set up to detect this sort of issue then you have a problem.
And it’s not often the wings fall off, but the tail does, or sometimes a huge hole opens in the “skin” of the airframe.
Example: Aloha Airlines Flight 243
If the feeler gauge doesn’t slip in with minimal force, then that tells you the gaps is smaller than the gauge.
The numbers of sets of comically bent out of shape feeler gauges I've encountered in my life demonstrates that there's a bunch of folks out there who don't understand how they're supposed to be used. As in "maybe if I just push harder this'll fit" :)
They're cheap. Shops that care have them on a replacement schedule.
Yes, things like rulers and gauges are tested. The schedule depends on the use case and frequency of use. For relatively light lab duty stuff, rulers and gauges were checked 1-2 times a year. Things that are used more frequency or more aggressively are checked more often.
Put is this way one time I found a set of hex torque drivers with cal stickers on them at a surplus place. So when I say everything I do mean everything. So yeah a feeler gauge should be traceable.
This idea again. I don't know why people are saying this. It's not true. Aviation you're allowed to use any tool you want unless the workshop manual says to use a specific tool.
OEM calibration certs are useless to an aviation company because it's someone else promising accuracy that could see you thrown in jail if it's wrong. Before tooling is used the first time it will be calibrated. Then calibrated again at set intervals.
>hex torque drivers with cal stickers
It's most likely the part had stickers so it was in their system for visual inspection for good condition. I have a pair of lockwire pliers that were pulled from the shop floor due to them being indicated worn during a visual inspection. I still have them 7 years later and they're still the sharpest pliers I own.
As for the traceability from birth, this applies to parts that go on the aircraft not tooling. Tooling traceability you need to know what tool was used if it's required to be calibrated. ie torque wrenches.
When I was young, it was guaranteed that a lifter would let loose just before you picked up your date on Saturday night if you had not “run the valves” in the past month.
Clack-clack-clack-clack-...
Date: Why does your car sound like it’s broken?
Me: <mutter>
Someone performing maintenance in their garage on an internal combustion engine would encounter the need to measure the same tolerances, for example, adjusting valve clearances. This is a common and accessible measurement task.
It would be much easier just to calibrate the tool before putting it into service. And given that there is a routine calibration schedule for measuring equipment, there's no need to have some NIST paperwork certifying the metallurgy of the brass rivet holding your feeler gauge together.
The two tooling engineers I sat next to when I worked at a jet engine MRO would buy any tool they wanted from their parts catalogue. I can't remember the name of it now but it was yellow covered and about 6 inches thick.
They would buy the same tools you could get at any respectable hardware store. Snapon, Koken, TengTools were common. They bought good quality so it lasted, not so they could get NIST certificates with them.
In the engine manuals, for specific jobs, there would be specific tools you would need to use. These would be listed by part number. If you used any old torque wrench when the manual specified a particular part, you weren't in compliance. This could be picked up by an aviation authority when your paperwork was audited. Or of course, if you have an 'escape' where an engine gets put on a plane and then stops mid flight (second worst case scenario).
The same goes for the calibration of the tool, each time you torque a procedure you need to fill out the paperwork with the tool # that the engineers will have engraved on the side of it. If the records show that tool is overdue for it's calibration when it was used, best case scenario, engineer doing the procedure gets told off, tooling guys get a 'finding' and have to improve their system of tool tracking. Worst case scenario, people die. Which could result in the Quality manager getting thrown in the clanger.
For about five bucks you can get feeler gauges more accurate than that, and for about thirty you can get a micrometer that's accurate to 0.0005" over a whole inch. (I checked mine against a set of grade 2 gauge blocks at their calibrated temperature.)
Normal CNC machines, not designed for extreme precision but the sort of thing an exceptionally serious hobbyist or decent makerspace might have just sitting around, will happily hold 0.001" across the entire working envelope, which may be the volume of a couch cushion or larger. The one I'm familiar with (which dominates one corner of the local makerspace) has thermal sensors scattered about the large castings that make up the machine frame, so it can compensate in software for the estimated warpage of the frame depending on how the HVAC has been blowing on it. And that's mid-90s tech, things have only gotten better since then.
1 part in 2,600,000,000.
Dan Gelbart built his own lathe with <1µm final part tolerance [2].
Within a few thousandths of an inch isn't very impressive. I can hold 1 thou on a cheap manual lathe (Grizzly G0602 10"x22" working area), with a decent amount of care. Holding to tenths (1/10000") is impossible with the equipment I can afford though.
[1] https://nanotechsys.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/12/HDL2600-B... [2] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sFrVdoOhu1Q
It was a robotic arm that lived in a temperature controlled room. The parts it was to measure were left inside the room to acclimatise. When they were at the correct temperature, you would put a part on the largest granite block in the southern hemisphere that was so flat they used lasers to calibrate it. Then run the program for the part. The arm would move into position and then a little probe would touch the part to get a measurement. It was used to measure things like warpage of inner diameters etc.
Funny trivial, if you ran the wrong program the arm would end up colliding with the part causing the probe to break. There was always spare probes kept because this happened. $20k each.
Typically the issue isn't the ability to measure to such tight tolerances, the problem is physically getting the calipers into position to do the measurement. Airplanes are full of tight spaces with weird angles, which makes measuring parts without extensive disassembly kind of hard.
Yes, it is basic stuff in most mechanics. For instance, the valve clearance on most car engines is going to be .002-.005.
I worked aviation maintenance for years. Most larger planes are held together with 'hiloks' [0] They are an "interference" fit.
For a quarter inch hilok, you'd first pilot drill a hole around 3/32" (#40 drill bit), then up drill it to .242 (C drill bit), then swap out to a .242 to .247 "reamer" and ream the hole to .247. The hilok itself is around .248-.249" so you can't just "push" it in but tap it in with a hammer or rivet gun. There was a "go-no-go" gauge. The "go" end was .246 and the "no go" end was .248. So yes, tolerances of 0.001" are quite common.
Here's the "Adjustments" manual for a Model 15 Teletype, the 1930-1958 model. I've restored two of those. Making those adjustments isn't that difficult, just time-consuming. Adjustment to 0.002 in. is sometimes required, but it's not that hard. Most Teletype adjustments can be set with feeler gauges. You don't need a micrometer.
[1] http://aetherltd.com/public/model15manuals/138_Model15_Adj_O...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_NuvwndwYSY&list=PL-_93BVApb...
Model 15 and 19 Teletypes are not hard to work on. Everything comes apart easily; it's all screws and lockwashers. They're human scale; it's not like building surface mount electronics or repairing an iPhone, where you work under a microscope. The adjustments aren't that finicky, except for a few near the selector magnet. It also helps that the whole thing is unidirectional - there's a straightforward path from input signal to typebar hitting the paper, and you can work through problems in order. As a nice feature, movement is powered in one direction and spring-loaded in the other, so if something gets stuck, it's just stuck in the operated position and doesn't get bent or broken.
Aircraft are built like that. Some parts require careful adjustment, but there's almost always an easy way to check that you got it right. Because, after all, you can't fix it in flight.
Mechanical design has a design philosophy embedded in it. If you work on complex mechanical systems, you can sometimes get a feel for how the original designer thought. Good machinery design is not a common skill. All the good Teletypes were designed by only two people - Howard Krum and Ed Kleinschmidt.
Very few people study this any more in the US, which hurts when you need to design production machinery.
It's interesting to me how getting the right physical configuration of something so it's reliable kind of encodes the complex procedure that gets it there.
It's so much harder than a program where you can identify all the parts and modify them in any order. And whenever you make a mistake, you can generally just reach in an fix it, rather than redoing a long disassembly or something.
Measuring with such high degrees of precision is easier than manufacturing by a very large margin. There are calibrated standards that fit in your pocket quite easily. Even ye olde feeler gauge was pretty precise if you were careful with it.
For this kind of measurement, they could almost certainly just use a feeler gauge and make sure that the 4 thou gauge fits.
I always wondered what the proper terms was for an airplane crash, and now I know: "forced off-airport landing"
Not all off-field landings result in an accident, or "crash".
From our own regulations, NTSB 830 "NOTIFICATION AND REPORTING OF AIRCRAFT ACCIDENTS..." https://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/49/830.2
>Aircraft accident means an occurrence associated with the operation of an aircraft which takes place between the time any person boards the aircraft with the intention of flight and all such persons have disembarked, and in which any person suffers death or serious injury, or in which the aircraft receives substantial damage. For purposes of this part, the definition of “aircraft accident” includes “unmanned aircraft accident,” as defined herein.
So while some off-field landings could be classified as an accident, that would only be the case if the off-field landing met the above definition.
You're absolutely correct though when it comes to larger aircraft. I rather doubt there are any examples of an off airport landing of a 737 without significant damage to the aircraft.
https://www.google.com/maps/place/30%C2%B001'52.7%22N+89%C2%...
Since I love reading about these kinds of incidents and the best way to solve a problem is to claim it's impossible, I amend my claim to "I rather doubt there are two examples of an off airport landing of a 737 without significant damage to the aircraft." :)
A deadstick landing,is a type of forced landing when an aircraft loses all of its propulsive power and is forced to land. The "stick" does not refer to the flight controls, but to the traditional wooden propeller, which without power would just be a "dead stick".
Another popular instance was the Lockheed EP-3 flying the China coast in 2001 before impacting a Chinese fighter in the air and making a forced "rough" landing. It was taken apart and shipped back to the states where it was repaired in Waco Texas and continues to patrol the China coast to this day.
The Qantas A380 from Singapore to Sidney that had an uncontained engine failure was repaired and entered service again, at an estimated cost of about $150m, or about 1/3 of the price of a new one.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Controlled_flight_into_terra...
and in space flight: "off nominal"
In contrast, a crash could be a lot of things: two planes colliding on the tarmac, loss of wings, or a controlled flight into terrain (such as flying into the side of a mountain).
1. Airspeed - SET
2. Fuel Valve - OFF
3. At 100 ft: Landing Lights - ON
4. If you don't like what you see: Landing Lights - OFF
Yes, there is absolutely additional wear that happens just from sitting around. Repairing this (if necessary) is part of the return-to-service procedure.
I worry a little more about theme parks that don't do winter shutdowns or might not have done the full shut it down for the winter procedure with sudden lockdown orders. The regulatory environment is also sketchier.
1. BAD: The degradation of airplanes in storage (seems that's fairly well understood, though)
2. BAD: The loss of proficiency and currency by the crews
3. GOOD (maybe?): Less traffic?
Prior to the pandemic, if you had a flight-worthy plane of any size, you were using it continuously. Once a plane was no longer being used continuously it was likely about to be permanently retired.
>Bleed air is tapped at the 5th and 9th stages of the HP compressor and from the fan.
https://hursts.org.uk/airbus-technical/html/ar01s19.html#idm...
(Airbus doc but the engines are CFM56 on the 737 models listed) Also according to this page the CFM56 doesn't have a turbine bleed air takeoff.
And bleed air is indeed always taken in the compressor, never in the turbine. First there's no point taking it later than the compressor, you just want compressed air. And it's ultimately used to ventilate the cabin, you don't want fuel vapors or smell.
All is explained in the link I posted, would recommend it as good introductory reading on the subject.
Funny this wasn't found before.
The massive increase in stored aircraft due to the pandemic meant that there wasn't enough room at these airports, and so aircraft had to be stored anywhere there was space available, often in less than ideal climates.
I wonder what other bugs will be uncovered from not exercising machines that are designed to be used on a very regular basis.
Especially if you leave it out in the weather.
https://politics.theonion.com/congress-approves-4-billion-fo...
Using an ampersand requires only one more space than a comma but is unambiguous.