To Delay Death, Lift Weights | Hacker News Reader

To Delay Death, Lift Weights

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123 pointsplessthanpt0592 comments

"Strength training in a gym and doing bodyweight exercises seemed to confer roughly equivalent benefits. "

So no, bro, you don't have to lift.

Just buy a yoga mat and start doing press-ups / sit-ups / dips etc

That what we were told in the military back in the noughties and it makes sense; wherever you are in the world you can still do your daily sets. No need for weights and bars; a bath towel on the floor of a hotel room suffices.

The single most important thing is to do something that loads your muscles. Lifting weights is great. Bodyweight exercises are great. Swinging a kettlebell is great.

Too many beginners get caught up in picking the right program, or acquiring the right gear, or planning the perfect routine. It's far more important to just get started with something. Anything. You can optimize as you go and research more, but focus on making it a consistent habit first and foremost.

The paper defines gym-based strength training as "working out at a gym/weight training/exercise biking". That is, participants in the study were merely asked if they had done one of those three things in the past four weeks, and if they had, they were considered to have done "gym-based strength training".

This is of course already flawed methodology: using an exercise bike consists of a very, very large number of repetitions of a very, very sub-maximal load. This is not gym-based strength training in any form.

Checking whether you've engaged in the activity "working out at a gym" is also a very poor indicator of having participated in consistent and effective strength work. The vast majority of individuals do stupid shit and make no progress, year-after-year.

So, I suspect the reason that the two categories confer roughly equivalent benefits is because when you perform both in an ineffective and poor manner, all you're really doing is exercising (not training), and the exact form of exercise becomes irrelevant.

If you were to do a study that was tightly controlled/regulated and consisted, say, of doing a linear progressive overload program (where you see untrained individuals gain tens of pounds of muscle and put on hundreds of pounds onto their squats) I theorize you'd see very different results. The physiology of a muscular individual who squats over 400 lbs is very different from the physiology of a skinny individual who does push-ups every morning and morbidity is rooted in physiology.

Finally, there is no bodyweight exercise in existence that can provide adequate loading of the posterior chain/lower-body. The musculature is too vast/large and doing a bunch of air squats doesn't provide adequate stress to introduce an adaptation in all but the most untrained of individuals. Adequately stressing the smaller musculature of the upper body is easier--especially at first--but even here adaptation quickly slows due to the inability to effectively load the body in a progressive manner.

So no, bro, you probably have to lift. And yes, bro, once again we see that the entire field of exercise science is basically nonsense.

> So no, bro, you probably have to lift

I followed your premise, but it leads to this conclusion which doesn't seem to follow. As you pointed out, the study poorly defined what counted as exercise. That said, that leaves a gap in terms of, what further benefit does lifting bring, that any other form of moderate exercise doesn't already? As you say, the physiology of both people are very different, but now we don't have a good study on if the physiology of strong weight lifters means you'll be healthier and live longer, obviously you'll be stronger, but what does that do to your health?

Their is bodyweight for the posterior and lower body other than air squat. - Pistol squat, shrimp squat, sissy squat, nordic curl, bridge, sprint and many more.

And the progressive overload can be done by exercice variation, you do an harder one.

Exemple: incline push up -> push up -> diamond push up -> pseudo planche push up -> push up on gymnastic ring -> bulagarian push up on ring -> one hand push up.

The current bodyweight fitness is way way past just increasing rep on easy exercice.

I recommend the Recommended routine on reddit /r/bodyweightfitness to start: https://www.reddit.com/r/bodyweightfitness/wiki/kb/recommend...

> Finally, there is no bodyweight exercise in existence that can provide adequate loading of the posterior chain/lower-body.

Sprints?

> Just buy a yoga mat and start doing press-ups / sit-ups / dips etc

No, don't. Seriously. If you want a long term routine to build strength and stay healthy (which is what we're talking about here), you can't just say "do exclusively upper body pressing for the rest of your life". Floor exercises are great, but none of them work your posterior chain in any meaningful way, which is almost always a weak point just due to modern life of constantly hunching over a keyboard. It's also very difficult to give your legs adequate intensity. It's not impossible, but it's hard.

At a bare minimum you need a bar for pullups. If you want to avoid barbells that's totally fine, but you need a real routine with a clear progression that isn't going to leave you with serious muscle imbalances after a year. https://www.reddit.com/r/bodyweightfitness/ is a good place to start if you really do want to do bodyweight strength training (although even they recommend barbell squats and deadlifts).

To second this, I slowly built up doing leg raises/push ups/planks since high school as a habit, I've never skipped more than one day at a time - it's astounding how good of shape I am in now, without ever having to go to a gym or worry about having the time.

Start super small, and increase when it feels too easy. That's all! You can skip every other day if you need, but never twice in a row. Then it becomes a habit in my experience.

IDK about you, but bodyweight exercises are much more boring that lifting iron.

After 3 years of lifting weights with compound exercises, I got bored, and now having so much fun with bodyweight, it's been 2 years now.

You can Google Handstand push up, pistol squats, full planche, high pull ups. Those kind of skills/balance/freedom of your body can't be reached with only lifting weights. Those are my new targets skills, I've been practising, and I'm having a LOT OF fun progressing toward those goals.

I still do squats and DeadLift from time to time because BodyWeight doesn't strength legs/back as much as I wish, becauseI think they're still important exercises to be solid.

Body weight exercises alone are boring but they become so much more enjoyable when combined with some demanding martial arts like boxing, kick boxing, muay thai or mma. The gains become obvious within a matter of weeks if you practice at least 2 times a week. Your lats and abs stand out very fast!

Agreed, for whatever reason I get bored to tears doing most bodyweight exercises.

Strangely even adding something as simple as a resistance band to the exercise makes it more enjoyable.

I wonder if there is any sort of reason for this phenomenon - I doubt we we are alone!

I believe it is that you are focusing more on one set of muscles with resistance bands or iron which makes it easier to enter into the "flow" state. Bodyweight exercises involve so many different groups of muscles that it is hard to deeply focus on form and enter "flow". For example the moment I maintain my core perfectly straight on a pushup, my ankles may move out of alignment.

Yeah, I really tried, especially during this lockdown, but it was just too demoralizing.

I prefer barbell and kettlebell exercises to bodyweight exercises myself, but I'm a little jealous that bodyweight exercises look cooler and can be demonstrated anywhere at any time in fun ways.

There are way more body weight and gymnastics movements than lifting that you might do as exercise...

Gymnastics requires a lot more training and skill than lifting up and putting down iron. There are far less body weight exercises that you can do without specialized equipment than with dumbbells or barbells, because with bodyweight exercises you always have to push, never pull (with exception of pullups). Bodyweight exercises also generally take much longer to reach fatigue than weightlifting.

That's why I think weightlifting is better for the average person for health, although whatever gets one to actually exercise is what one should be doing!

Make sure it's rusty black iron, not chrome plated or plastic filled with sand.

Really depends on the person, I think. I would lose interest without being able to easily see progression week after week in the form of increasing weight on the bar. At least in the beginning.

r/bodyweightfitness has a great program [1] where you track your progression by moving from easy versions of exercises to very difficult versions - for example [2] from vertical pushups to incline pushups all the way to pseudo planche pushups.

I've made some progress on this, and it's quite satisfying. But I do agree that I'm having trouble getting the habit to stick, compared to when I used to lift. I have a sneaky feeling that this is more about having a gym outside of my regular work / living spaces than a weakness of the program itself though.

[1] https://www.reddit.com/r/bodyweightfitness/wiki/kb/recommend...

[2] https://www.reddit.com/r/bodyweightfitness/wiki/exercises/pu...

That was the trick for me. Seeing constant measured progress is a great motivator.

I do bodyweight work now, but it's strictly as support for my other athletic goals. It's just too boring to me to do for its own sake.

Do you (or anyone) have a recommended bodyweight routine?

The recommended routine from the bodyweightfitness subreddit is aptly named: https://www.reddit.com/r/bodyweightfitness/wiki/kb/recommend...

Not an expert here, but this is what I do and enjoy: you need just 4 exercises: push, pull, legs, abs.

Push: work towards 1 arm, 1 leg pushups

Pull: pullups on a bar (not chinups) Some people can do a 1 arm pullup but I'm far from that.

Legs: work towards pistol ups (=1 leg squads)

Abs: ab roller and/or leg ups with feet touching top of bar

The first 3 are the top of their class. For abs you can choose from a lot of different ones (dragon flag etc.)

I'm getting older (41), so I shifted from 3 times a week going all out, to every day training while not pushing myself to the extreme.

I've seen studies confirming the inverse relationship between strength and all cause mortality numerous times. It seems pretty well established by now.

Personally, I started lifting several years ago, and it's been the greatest change in my health in my life. I lost a lot of weight, my resting heart rate is way down, everyday tasks are easier. I move better, and I just feel better overall. Plus, it's a wonderful discipline for building determination and grit. I am certain that most people's lives would be significantly improved by the addition of a strength training program.

Yeah, starting a lifting program was a massive change in my life. Huge physical, emotional, and social benefits - and I quite enjoyed it! I have a feeling that I'm going to be seriously de-loading and basically restarting after we can finally go back to the gym.

> confirming the inverse relationship between strength and all cause mortality

Ahh, but which way does the relationship go..?

Unsurprisingly if I'm dying of something really serious and lying in bed sick as a dog.....

...I lose muscle mass.

These studies are generally longitudinal studies across a number of years, where greater muscle mass or strength early in the study correlates with lower all-cause mortality across the duration of the study. It's not looking at survival rates for acute afflictions.

Examples:

* https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6427792/

* https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/12242311/

* https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/10795731/

* https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/11984288/

(There are many, many more of these, and they all seem to agree)

Correlation is not causation.

Of course. But given the high correlation, pursuing strength seems likely to produce the benefits of whatever the final cause happens to be.

How did you start? Any recommended regime?

I started with Stronglifts 5x5. It's a good starter program if you haven't lifted before, because it'll give you the opportunity to drill and learn the movements, and the program is simple, and there's an app that holds your hand.

In terms of programming, it has some deficiencies, but most people just need a structured program to start with. You can probably run it for 12-18 weeks and then have a strong foundation to switch to another program. People argue its deficiencies, but if it gets you started and gets you structure to build a routine with, that's what you need, IMO.

For the last couple of years, I've been training with Jim Wendler's 5/3/1 program, and it's fantastic. I keep getting stronger and can probably happily train on it for many years to come. I've competed in a couple of local powerlifting meets, and have a routine that I feel like I can sustain forever. There is a 531 for Beginners program, too, but it's less hand-holdy than Stronglifts.

I'm a big fan of both programs (I built a lot of my current strength with 5/3/1), but I just want to add a couple things for anyone starting out:

1. If you're new, realize that your muscles will get stronger faster than your connective tissue. Be patient with your progression and be mindful of joint problems.

2. Most of the powerlifting/strength training programs are a bit light on pulling. Add in pullups and rows if the program doesn't call for it and your posture will thank you.

3. Strength training isn't cardio. It should (eventually) be hard. If you're taking one minute set breaks on big lifts you're doing it wrong.

4. Learn to eat. High protein and adequate calories. If you don't eat well you'll struggle to progress after a while and you're likely to get injured becasue your body can't recover adequately.

I was going to reply to GP but you beat me to some of my points: > realize that your muscles will get stronger faster than your connective tissue

The author, or another prominent advocate on YouTube, emphasizes the ability to get a workout done in under an hour. In my opinion this is rushing it.

There's a joke that you should add 5 minutes to your warm-up for every year over 30 (exact numbers vary). The point remains: always warm up thoroughly, especially the older you are.

I take a lot of time between sets to recharge my ATP. I also do days where I'm not trying to add the 2.5 kg, but instead focus power. Or even just do it with good form at a slightly lighter weight if I'm not feeling 100%. The newer you are to lifting, go slow and focus on technique. (Perhaps 20 year olds can add 2.5 kg every session ad infinitum but I can't.)

All excellent points!

Heads up for Wendler 5/3/1: the program is fantastic, but if you buy the books, you'll find some pretty blatant misogyny in them. I was really disappointed, and disappointed that I had endorsed that content with my purchases. There are a lot of good beginner programs. Check out the r/Fitness wiki for alternatives, specifically this page: https://thefitness.wiki/routines/strength-training-muscle-bu...

I’m somewhat terrified about having wrong form and hurting myself. Is that a silly fear or should I find a coach or something?

The good thing about 5x5 is that you start with minimal weights - like an empty bar - and spend your first couple of weeks training with "easy" weight. This time is really for you to learn the movements. There's a wealth of information out there on how to do these movements properly. Injury is always a possibility, but if you start light and progress steadily, the risk of it is substantially diminished.

A coach is a great resource, but a) most trainers in gyms are not strength coaches, and range from actively harmful to wonderful, and there's not really any way for the novice to know which they are, and b) legit strength coaches are expensive. I'd recommend self-study and starting lightly before a coach, personally, but if having a coach is the difference between you lifting and not lifting, get the coach.

Alan Thrall has 3 really good beginner videos on the S/B/D movements:

* https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bs_Ej32IYgo

* https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wYREQkVtvEc

* https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BYKScL2sgCs

Also check out the JTS pillars series. JTS are legends in powerlifting, and these videos can really help tune up technique.

* https://www.jtsstrength.com/pillars-squat-technique/?v=7516f...

* https://www.jtsstrength.com/pillars-bench-technique/?v=7516f...

* https://www.jtsstrength.com/pillars-deadlift-technique/?v=75...

There's also https://www.reddit.com/r/formcheck (and r/fitness and r/stronglifts5x5) which can be valuable resources for getting help fixing particular problems.

Valid concern, but at the same time, if you start slowly, watch videos, record yourself and review your form, and listen to your body you'll be fine. Barbells are psychologically scary, but nobody worries about hiring a coach when they start running or playing rec soccer or whatever, even though those things tend to be more injury prone than lifting. Not to discourage you from getting coaching, but if you want to start just start.

It's kind of funny. I've seen people afraid to try lifting a 20kg barbell in a controlled, slow movement, even though they don't have any fear at all about picking up their nephew or lifting a bag of dogfood.

If you can find a coach and that will help alleviate your fears, do it.

I work out in a "group personal training" setup where there are generally 5-8 folks lifting at a time, usually performing the same lifts on the same days, but all at different paces and levels. And we have a coach that helps with programming and offers assistance, critique, and timely doses of motivation or ridicule.

Valid concern but with preparation and also with a coach and also listening to your body, it shouldn’t be a fear. Injury is going to happen, you could be walking down the street and hurt your ankle.

The most important thing is working on form, which you don’t have to do with heavy weights. But for this a coach totally helps because they can pin point exactly where you’re messing up.

Also, get the bible on basic barbell lifting, "Starting Strength", and read it cover-to-cover:

https://smile.amazon.com/Starting-Strength-Basic-Barbell-Tra...

You can really benefit from hiring a coach ro start, or can prevent injuries.

Curious, what kind of deficiencies do you think 5x5 has?

My two biggest complaints about it are too little deadlift volume (and always deadlifting after you've squatted, which is just suicidal at higher working weights), and no periodization. The latter is really the biggest issue with it as anything beyond an introductory program - the benefits of periodization are well-established, and while linear progression is great as an "on ramp", the human body just can't sustain that style of progression indefinitely. When you hit the point that you stop regularly progressing linearly, it's time to stop and switch to a periodized program.

If you wanted to get really picky, it lacks lacks arm (bicep and rear deltoid, primarily) and oblique accessory work, but I don't really consider those too big of a problem since most beginners need something straightforward that isn't too overwhelming.

Any suggestions for a periodized program?

5/3/1 is my personal choice.

5x5 is a simple and effective program. It's gone the route of marketing and sales but the principle is the same. A few big lifts a few times a week produces a lot of strength. You'll be surprised. You don't need to do 50 exercises.

5x5 has already been brought up a bunch of times. Starting Strength: Basic Barbell Training was a good book for me to cement each lift and I picked up 5x5 later for the routine. SS is a bit long-winded, it only covers a handful of basic lifts but dedicates a chapter to each one. Proper form is really important in not hurting yourself and maximizing your time in the gym. Being thoughtful about which muscles are getting activated and getting comfortable on how to position yourself really helps when the weight goes up.

The New Encyclopedia of Modern Bodybuilding (Arnold Schwarzenegger) I remember half was life story and theory on bodybuilding and the latter part was a good reference of a bunch of variations on exercises to mix things up.

Both of those books have been around forever and are generally well regarded. Your library probably has a copy you can borrow.

Here’s pretty good starting point for building overall strength: https://stronglifts.com/5x5/

You beat me by 1 minute! 5x5 is an excellent starter program. I've lifted for about 10 years and while I'm more in the advanced and intermediate lifting programs, 5x5 is my goto when I have a long hiatus in lifting. I'm definitely doing it once the COVID lockdowns are over.

Seems like this requires both physical space and equipment. Being stuck at home right now, what would be good enough alternatives for the exercises other than squats (perhaps with smaller dumbbells or with body weight)?

https://old.reddit.com/r/bodyweightfitness/wiki/kb/recommend... - maybe check out this program. I haven't run it myself, but I've heard a lot of people speak well of it.

My opinion is the best strength training routine is the one you can stick to. Sometimes you get into a routine because someone told you it's the way to do things. You try to force yourself to do it even though you don't like it. Eventually you stop doing it because you're not motivated to do something you don't like. At that point you might think, "if this is the way I'm 'supposed to' workout, but I don't like it, then I've failed and just won't workout because anything else is not the way you're 'supposed to' do it". Don't listen to anyone who says you have to do one thing or another. Do what you like because you'll be more motivated and stick to it.

This has been my experience... Personally, I don't like going to a gym. I'm not a fan of the atmosphere. I've tried several gym-based workout routines and I just never enjoyed doing them. When I say gym-based, I mean routines that really require gym equipment and access to heavier weights.

I also don't like workouts that waste a lot of time. I found with gym-based workouts I always had to keep looking up each exercise because I would forget exactly how to do them and that wasted a lot of time. There also seemed to be a greater risk of injuring yourself doing certain exercises, especially those requiring heavier weight. I also found exercise routines advertised as being "simple" or "basic" would have several exercises requiring equipment my gym didn't have, so I always had to figure out alternative exercises for that muscle group, which also wasted time.

I ended up doing P90X for a few years, which was great for someone like me that always has other things occupying my mind because I didn't have to think about what exercises to do. It was all laid out for me. Also, I could do it at home and it incorporates HIIT, which allows you to get in some cardio. As I got older, I found P90X felt like it was over-training and I couldn't keep up with the intense hour-long exercises. I switched to P90X3, which has 30-minute routines. That was good for a while, but personally not enough strength training for me. It had a variety of exercises (because variety is kind of the P90 way), but a lot of the exercises didn't really feel like they required enough exertion. P90X3 is probably good for someone starting out though if you need to get a basic level of physical fitness before moving on to more intense stuff.

After P90X3, I purchased RIPT90 Fit, which is very similar to P90X3 (30-minute home workouts) but is cheaper and has fewer, simpler, and more impactful exercises that I think maximize your 30-minutes. I still occasionally mix in some P90X3 routines, like yoga and core workouts.

HTH

+1 to choosing a routine you can stick to.

Routines like 5x5 can be ok for some but I'm not sure it is a good idea to put most beginners in low rep range workouts before they can learn the movements. Probably best to work on the 8-12 rep range and machines in the beginning.

I'm a fan of two weekly full-body workouts in a mix of machines and free weights, or 2-way splits (upper/lower, push/pull) 3 times a week. I've seen far too many times beginners being put on a 3-way split with workouts that take 1 hour or more just too quit the gym the next month.

Seek help to build a simple routine (bodyweight exercises work too) that works the whole body and doesn't too much time and then build up from there.

This is right on the money. SL5x5 was the thing that "stuck" for me, but the best program is always the one that you stick with. Us kinds of people who are prone to read HN probably have a tendency to want to micro-optimize everything and pick the best most perfect program ever, and the truth is that the best program is the one that you do, even if it's not technically perfect. If one thing doesn't take, rather than giving up, look for another approach. The benefits are worth it.

What are your goals?

I have yet to read the methods used, but my low prior leaves me somewhat skeptical even after reading this article. The vast body of pre-existing material indicates "aerobic exercise" is the primary driver of health, with strength training obviously delivering some aerobic exercise too, but not nearly as much as some other forms of exercise.

The way these studies are described in the article, it sounds like they might have mislabeled a bunch of confounders as signal.

(E.g. people who regularly get aerobic exercise -- especially as they are older -- have greater muscle mass and are less likely to die. Heck, just that people exercise at all in any capacity is a signal of health, which lowers risk of death.)

Edit: That said, I believe some level of strength training is critical to avoid injury or overstressing particular muscles, even when your interest is primarily aerobic exercise.

The FNIH Sarcopenia Project [1] and the paper Associations of Muscle Mass and Strength with All-Cause Mortality among US Older Adults [2] are about assessing age related decline.

Neither are about how strength and cardiovascular training impacts mortality; the focus of the OP.

[1] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3991146/

[2] https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/28991040/

Especially with most of us shut at home, I've found kettlebell to be excellent as medium for strength and conditioning.

The focus on the posterior chain helped resolve a lot of back issues I had from sitting at a desk all day. I could feel my posture improving in a week or so.

Unfortunately it does have a bit of learning curve to it, but it's still something I recommend friends try as an effective quick workout.

For strength training, you want exercises that can be performed with increasingly heavier weights (e.g. barbell exercises). This is how you get stronger. If you always lift the same weight you won't get stronger.

That's straight away misinformation. Your body doesn't know how many plates your lifting, all it cares about is intensity and time under tension.

There's a few ways to increase that without increasing weight:

- more time under tension (duh), in other words same movements but slower

- harder exercice variations

Now to mention that kettlebells can go pretty high in weight.

And a last point: what is your goal? Kettlebells will never allow you to compete in bodybuilding, but if what you want is to have a better quality of life and aesthetics? The answer is much less cut and dry. Kettlebells have some really great functional exercices. If you can do a turkish get-up with a 50kg kettlebell you're strong enough.

Doing many repetitions with light weights will elicit a different physiological adaptation than doing few repetitions with heavy weights. In particular, your body will become better at lifting light weights for many reps, but you won't get necessarily stronger. If your goal is to get stronger, you want to train by lifting increasingly heavier weights (progressive overload). Any other training strategy, is less efficient, for the purpose of getting stronger, or simply ineffective.

And what I'm saying is that you can achieve progressive overload with harder variations and more time under tension. There's plenty of ways to keep you in the strength rep range using kettlebells and/or calisthenics.

For pure strength and size nothing beats barbells, I already said that, but unless that's your only goal, kettlebells can be an alternative.

Kettlebells go all the way up to 5 poods bro

kettlebells are awesome. You have to start at the lower weights though and resist the temptation to be adventurous with them. It's my "home gym". A 6x4 mat, a jump rope and a kettlebell.

This is what I do, as well, plus taiji. I think of it as my "zombie apocalypse survival regimen."

I’ve been doing 100 pushups a day, 6 days/week (1 rest day on Sunday) for about 3 months now.

Before I used to get back aches and had an awful form. Now I feel great. After having a kid, it has been hard to find time to go to the gym. Two sets of pushups, one in morning, and one in evening is easy to get in. Takes 5 mins and you feel pumped.

Also been having more sex. So that’s been a great for health too.

Be careful about doing too much pushing without pulling, though. The bodyweightfitness subreddit is full of people asking about doing a high number of pushups daily and people always warn about imbalances, shoulder impingement, etc.

Get started with any exercise is difficult! Soon after I commence, I find exercise-induced injuries that force me to rest until the pain goes away. A younger me would ignore the pain bit now I'm not so invincible anymore.

More exercise also necessitates more sleep, which can be hard to do when there isn't enough of time.

What sort of timescale do you mean by "soon"? When you start doing a new exercise regime, it's really common to experience DOMS[1] for the first few weeks. It really feels like the end of the world (personal experience) but it's not actually an indication of real injury and it's generally safe to push through it if you can (and doing so can actually alleviate the pain, at least temporarily). Distinguishing between DOMS (where it's safe to push through) and real injury (where you definitely should not) comes with a bit of practice, and honestly, compared with the few times I've hurt myself for real... DOMS felt worse. Except when I slipped while holding weight and broke my toe. Strongly recommend against that :)

If you're experiencing exercise-induced injuries immediately during a workout (and if you have a budget for this), it might be good to talk to someone about what you're trying to do. Some gym plans include a bit of consultation time with a staff trainer, and they can probably help you work around whatever the problem is, sometimes simple adjustments can help (particularly anything involving preexisting shoulder damage, most of the commonly-recommended shoulder exercises have substitutes that are less risky for already-damaged shoulders).

1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delayed_onset_muscle_soreness

You might be starting too aggressively. A successful program is going to start you lighter than you're capable of and progress you over time. Ego and eagerness get you injured quickly, and ultimately work against your goals.

You are probably not exercising property. You either have poor execution, use too much weight, use exercises that don't agree if your body mechanics or a combination of the three.

Feeling sore in the muscles is normal, feeling joint pain is not.

It's true you need more rest/sleep but I found you can work around it if you don't care too about putting on muscle and thus work out less frequently and with less intensity, just for the health benefits.

I do believe exercise and strength is helpful for long term health, but these studies obviously don't control for the fact that people with poor health / health conditions are both more likely to die in the future and less likely to exercise / develop strength in the present...

For the purposes of meeting the aerobic training goal, is walking considered moderate exercise?

I’ve never liked jogging, but I do strength training, about an hour of walking most days, and occasional sprints.

Aerobic training is all about the heart rate. You have to get it up to around 120 or higher (and keep it there for a while) to have a training effect. Unless you are REALLY unfit, walking is probably not enough.

You can also run/walk in intervals as long as you keep the heart rate up. If you want to get fit, a heart rate monitor is a great investment (something like a polar h10 can pair with your smartphone).

I think initially, yes, but you might rather quickly be walking into diminishing returns. The idea is to get your heart rate up and force your body to build more efficient ways to create/consume energy. If you are in good shape, walking might not do this unless you're thinking of long-ass multi hour walks.

But there are other aerobic forms of training than running!

Last I checked, the aerobic range is a quantified goal so you should be able to alter your circumstances to hit the range while walking. Personally I've been walking for weight loss and exercise since 2013 and a lot of it easily qualifies as aerobic, just depending on the incline, pace, weight carried, and other factors.

Makes sense, thanks. Looks like I hit the 50% if max HT goal, but not by much. So either I should walk faster (hard in heat) or do more on the exercise bike I have.

Got myself an elliptical machine second hand for $50. Great for getting your heart rate up without a lot of impact on the spine. The heart rate formula for good cardio is 90% of 220 minus your age. I can hit that easily on the machine. I highly recommend it.

Where I live the average age of farmers is over 65. Some people complain about the inefficiency of small scale farming carried out by many older individuals, and want to stop trade protections, and subsidies etc, and replace everything with robots and drones. A study like this shows one dimension of how much value there is in letting these people carry one working and not becoming a burden on health budgets.

Note that this isn't highlighting any new information, the article itself was from 2017 and was itself referring to earlier studies.

(Not to discount the overall thesis which is basically "muscle mass good," but if you're relatively up to date on this sort of thing there's nothing novel in this article for you).

I recall (vaguely) reading long ago that lifting weights shortens muscles and also reduces flexibility. Do people who lift weights or do rigorous strength training also complement it with yoga or other stretching exercises?

That is mostly outdated and nonsense dogma. The average person living in the Western world doing a barbell strength training program incorporating squats and deadlifts will see a drastic increase in their flexibility. Most people in the Western world are unable to squat (or at least, do it for long periods or without discomfort), losing the ability as they grow out of toddlerhood.[1][2] Squatting and deadlifting also improve flexibility and strength in your upper back and shoulder muscles.

Yoga is always a good idea anyway, and may help to get to the next level. And you should stretch before or after any workout, of any type. But barbell strength training alone will put you ahead of the pack.

1. https://qz.com/quartzy/1121077/to-solve-problems-caused-by-s...

2. https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2018/03/can-you-d...

As someone who's serious about lifting weights (at least 5 times a week), I can tell you that I almost have zero flexibility these days, my lack of stretching is also causing all types of pain. I sometimes have issues walking because some muscles are too tight.

Doing yoga and certain stretches definitely helps, but it needs to compliment your training. I tend to do 15 minutes of stretches in the morning, and then 15-20 minutes of yoga in the evening before going to bed, that has seriously improved my life. (As in, I don't have muscle pain when doing regular activities)

My 5 day a week lifting program had upwords of 20 minutes of stretching，10 before and 10 after. I try to do 30 minutes of yoga a day on top of that.

If I'm already working out, why not stretch as well?

I've been doing it more and more before exercise, especially when doing heavy squats and deadlifts. I also gradually increase my weights so that I'm warmed up by the time I'm doing any heavy stuff.

But those 15 minutes in the morning also help me wake up, and I kinda enjoy just stretching and not thinking about anything.

A good routine will have stretching before and after.

Higher level yoga practitioners can also be very strong. Static positions can be incredibly difficult to hold and a great way to build strength!

(Yoga is not hypertrophic, but it can build good endurance)

Kettlebells. Search youtube for "Enter the Kettlebell" with Pavel Tsatsouline; easiest, best way to start, is with the "Simple and Sinister" program, which is just kettlebell swings and Turkish getups.

Stephen Jepson comes to mind. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qh0PlR27qJ0

Correlation is not causation.

People who work out tend to practice a range of healthy habits.

I've found that developing a workout habit is a gateway to other healthy habits. You tend have less stress and sleep better, which improves workout performance thereby creating a virtuous cycle. The drive to improve workout performance leads you to make changes to your diet and watch other health indicators more closely. It's all connected.

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