Amazon warns Alexa Echo Buds earphones pose overheating safety risk | Hacker News Reader

Amazon warns Alexa Echo Buds earphones pose overheating safety risk

bbc.com

70 pointspbhowmic54 comments

Seems pretty mundane, the headphones can overheat while charging in rare cases and it's fixed with a software update. It's not like they're burning people's ears during regular use or catching on fire.

Lots of comments taking the opportunity to complain about Amazon the storefront, and issues with fake reviews, counterfeiting, etc. but that doesn't really have anything to do with this story. Amazon's hardware generally has a pretty decent reputation, from Kindle and Echo that have been huge successes and basically created brand new product categories, to amazon basics cables and batteries and whatnot that are reliable at a good price.

Journalism in action here, the relevant line is WELL below the fold:

“We recently determined that in very rare cases it is possible for Echo Buds to overheat while in the charging case."

Good job as usual, HN community.

If it overheats in he charging case, and then you put them in your ears, isn't it at risk of fire?

I think the bigger danger is when it's in the charging case. They're more likely to be tossed in the bottom of a bag or pocket where there will be no ventilation whatsoever. On their own, the airbuds have a much higher ratio of surface area to battery volume, increasing cooling especially when they're in-ear.

Still doesn't seem like a big deal because Apple usually demands the best binned parts for their products and they have weight to throw around. Better quality battery cells are far less likely to have fires due to thermal runaway and Apple power firmware is probably good enough to stop them from reaching that point when charging.

Your apple is showing.

> it's fixed with a software update

How is it fixed with a software update? Why is it running software when charging?

Probably not due to processor heating. Batteries heat up when charging. I imagine this software update reduces the charge rate to lessen battery self-heating.

Everything runs software, all the time.

Even when there is no source of power?

devices like this probably have low-level battery management software running while charging. this would be to protect the batteries and prevent overcharging.

$129 and lesser quality than most ear buds, this isn't even a new design, there's dozens of ear buds that look similar.

Really? I hear they're the hottest earbuds on the market.

There's tons of bluetooth earbuds on Amazon that you'd never hear about but are top ranking sellers in their category. I've bought 5 different pairs over the last 3yrs and they've all been great (I lose them or buy them for other people).

They all sell for $30-60 and are the same quality as Amazons.

It's like how Apple is the #1 phone seller even though there are 5x more Android phones in circulation under 10 different brands.

(I usually try to not comment when there's not much value added)...

but I see what you did there...

The Samsung galaxy buds+ are a lot better. Rtings seems to agree as well.

Truth is, Amazon tries to be an everything company, and that simply does not work well, when the competitors have honed their specialty skills for way longer. I find that Google faces a similar problem with hardware.

At least with Microsoft, I can respect them going out of their way to make their products weird and unique in an Apple-esque manner. (Surface book, Surface pro, The Surface headphones, the surface buds)

On the contrary, Samsung and Apple for eg. derive their music prowess from AKG and Beats respectively. Bose and Sony have a long history in music. It simply isn't possible for even the biggest of players to break into the market if treat it like 'any other product'.

I preordered the Echo Buds when they were first announced, and tried them out for a while.

Had to return them because the microphonics while walking were really bad, and the noise cancellation didn't seem comparable to the Bose QC30's I still use, even though the Echo Buds's were supposedly "powered by Bose".

Can't comment on microphone while walking because I rarely talk while walking.

But Amazon's were advertised as Bose "noise reduction" rather than straight out "noise cancellation" (this was made very clear in the specs and in reviews), and in that respect, it does what it's supposed to. I wear my Echo Buds on my daily walks listening to podcasts and for all purposes it works pretty well. (I also own a pair of Bose headphones which are too bulky to wear on walks)

I will say that the Echo Buds' noise reduction don't work well on a plane, I'll give you that. Tried it.

Apple's AirPods Pro has real noise cancellation, but it's also double the price.

I'd say Echo Buds are pretty good deal at the $100+ price range.

> Can't comment on microphone while walking because I rarely talk while walking.

I was talking about microphonics [1][2] i.e. the noise caused by the earbuds vibrating(?) when I walk.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microphonics

[2] https://www.reddit.com/r/headphones/comments/dd4gqi/tws_iem_...

Thanks, I wasn’t familiar with that technical term.

I just put on my Echo Buds and started walking. If I’m understanding microphonics correctly, it means a rustling electrical sound when there’s mechanical vibration. This does not happen with my Echo Buds.

However, I do hear the thud of my footsteps. I’ve accepted that this happens with any in ear headphones. Not sure if there are any IEMs out there that don’t have the footstep problem.

> However, I do hear the thud of my footsteps. I’ve accepted that this happens with any in ear headphones. Not sure if there are any IEMs out there that don’t have the footstep problem.

The thuds annoy me a lot, but I found that in the Bose QC30 (which I still use), the Sony WF1000XM3, and the AirPods Pro (which I've tried), it somehow seems less obvious.

Looks aren't really the most important aspect.

They may catch on fire but I don't necessary think they're lesser quality. I'm pretty sure they're using bose proprietary tech which probably wasn't cheap.

> $129 and lesser quality than most ear buds

I don't know if that's true. I bought my pair on the day they were released, and they're decent quality. They're not cheaply made, and everything works. (pairing took a little bit to get right, but not a deal breaker).

What do you mean when you say they're of "lesser quality"? What dimensions do you mean?

The fact that they might overheat alone? (but it got patched today; it's amazing to me that you can patch firmware on ear buds)

How many different ways can ear buds look? I haven't seen any new designs in ages.

Meanwhile I couldn't be happier with my $16 earbuds that I got for free. Sound quality isn't great but for watching streaming video, podcasts or a quick workout they're fantastic. If I lose them or they break, no big deal.

I like that you're happy with the ones you have, but it's a weird flex to say that you "couldn't be happier" _and_ that "sound quality isn't great". Would you not be any happier if sound quality _were_ great?

I know that there's a kind of pleasure from not worrying about disposably cheap products, but there's also a kind of pleasure from having nice things with extra features where the trade is usually just taking care of them slightly better.

Personally I'll never go back to wired headphones after experiencing the freedom of wireless ones. Know of any wireless $16 throwaways?

Yes! Just search eBay/AliExpress. They work and sound great. I get the appeal of having nice things, but earbuds? They're tiny plastic things that just sit in your ear and could easily fall down a sewer grate at any moment.

Knowing what I know about the expected quality of things found on AliExpress, I'm hesitant to put batteries found there in my ears.

You overestimate the quality of your "trusted" brands.

Nearly every problem I've ever had with electronic components in my life has been caused by counterfeits that either lie about their capabilities, lie about what they're made of, or lie about whether they were QC tested. Maybe that means the SD card only stores a few real megabytes before trashing all of your photos. Maybe that means your phone charger destroys your phone. Maybe that means the battery in your ear explodes [0]. The thing about trusted brands is that at least they have brands to protect.

[0] - https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2019/04/lithi...

Anker has several options for under $20 with very good build quality, sound quality and battery life. The mic for phone calls is a bit lacking; I haven’t found any cheap earbuds with noise cancelling mics.

having to charge your headphones in order for them to work is not freedom.

Mine sit in their little charging case and as a result are always ready to rock.

My headphones don't require electricity

I would be happier if the sound quality was better but did not expect that which means my expectations were not only met, but surpasses as they performed better on other ways (batter, connectivity, comfort etc.)

I do take pleasure in high quality things, just not these and especially not something so easily lost.

And they are wireless. The prices for equivalent earbuds run $25-$45 now, but if you time it right they'll go on sale or a new company will discount for under $25. I got mine free as a promo but would gladly pay even $25 for them.

Amazon is the new Walmart. Low quality products. Increasingly the top brands aren't even available on the site and all you have is Chinese no-name crap.

I've been shopping online directly lately and the service and shipping times have been phenomenal. It's almost as though Amazon and small ecommerce shops have swapped places when it comes to quality assurance, service and shipping times.

What you’re describing has been Amazon for at least a decade and it’s transparently what they offer and how they market themselves, so the Walmart comparison is not even necessary.

If you are using Amazon to find top premium brands / products, you’re shopping in the wrong place to begin with.

For me its even worse than Walmart. No matter how shitty it is, at least I know what I'm getting at there.

With Amazon its pretty much a gamble whether or not I'm getting what I actually ordered or some cheap knock-off crap.

For the entirety of quarantine I've been ordering directly from companies and its saved a lot of headache, sure theres no 2-day shipping, but I'm no longer receiving a fake Anker charger four times in a row.

Quarantine has also taught me Amazon is just terrible at handling some stuff. I ordered a new French press from them, which came broken both times. Ordered from Crate & Barrel and it came wrapped and packaged beautifully. Special bubble wrap with creased edges for folding to the contours of the box, and a box that actually fit the product (as opposed to Amazon: "let's toss this in a box 3 times the size of the item, with 3 squares of inflated plastic. Surely nothing bad will happen as it bangs around in there.") I'll never order any glassware or glass products from Amazon again.

And before I tried Crate & Barrel I actually was making excuses for Amazon. "Well, shipping glass and ceramic is hard. I knew there was a chance it would break in shipping." Still valid concerns, but easier to stomach a bad experience when it shows they put forth effort and thought.

Yeah, I'll use them as a last resort but going to B&M retailers or even walmart online is working real well for me. Free shipping online if you spend more than a certain amount a lot of the time.

I think it's worse than Walmart. At Walmart you get cheap garbage for low prices. At Amazon you have cheap garbage for high prices because masquerading as a premium brand with high prices and drop shipping from (ex:) AliExpress is super lucrative if you can corner a market.

I've been trying to find a decent webcam for a while now on Amazon, if you want prime and not ridiculously over priced it's all no name off brands. Really frustrating.

Amazon knowingly sells tons of products that maim or children, and refuses to take them down even when reported. I literally saw an Amazon recommended product the other day where the #1 review was that it gave the person's kid lead poisoning. Even at it's worst Wal-Mart wasn't that bad.

Example: https://www.amazon.com/Star-Right-Flash-Cards-Set/dp/B073GBD...

TFW the brand name you want is Chinese and Amazon offers you Chinese knockoffs of the Chinese thing you want.

(I was shopping for a replacement power brick for a ThinkPad.)

At this point brand names seem to be very weak indicators of value, except a few exceptions in a specific niches with exclusive technology.

Most brands that get any traction seem to abuse that halo to also shove mediocre product to the middle/lower market. In the end we still need to do a ton of research to see which product is individually good, and looking at reviews is a way better indicator than brand marketing.

I hit this issue when trying to buy a vacuum cleaner. Perhaps it would be different if I was willing to pay a grand for the top of the line, but otherwise house name brands had at most mediocre reviews, often with documented cheaping out on important parts. We had to go through video reviews of each specific model of the price range targeted to get a decent idea of what we were buying.

Is there a phrase from ear drums melting?

This gives a whole new meaning to the phrase "My ears are burning."

I guess playing sound while simultaneously recording and broadcasting all your conversations back to the mothership is CPU intensive. Who knew.

Some people may not take your comment seriously, but I don't understand how a software update fixes this unless something like this is going on. When I put my earbuds in the charging case, they power off (which disconnects from bluetooth) which means they shouldn't be running software to the best of my knowledge. Do the Amazon ones not do this?

I would be interested to know. If you have these can you please let me know if the bluetooth disconnects from your phone when you put them in the charging case?

They could still be storing audio on the earbuds or charging station itself then transmitting when connected but that seems somewhat unlikely.

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