Merge tag 'inclusive-terminology' into Linux kernel | Hacker News Reader

Merge tag 'inclusive-terminology' into Linux kernel

git.kernel.org

18 pointskbumsik18 comments

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23801134

I'd recommend a title change here, for editorialization: the name of the merged branch is "inclusive-terminology" and most of the recommendations appear to be close to those in the Knodel draft[1].

[1]: https://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-knodel-terminology-01

I've changed the title above. Submitted title ('Linux kernel now recommends politically correct terms') broke the site guideline against editorializing.

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Good. Cost is low to make these changes, even if they have "little real impact" (a common complaint), they're worth making to demonstrate exactly how arbitrary language is to change.

Ten years from now no one will even remember or care that master/slave was a term in computing.

Are there any 20 year old examples of terms with the popularity of master/slave that everybody has forgotten?

I'm surprised at how many people don't initially remember what Y2K means, since it was a huge thing that everybody was talking about about for about 6 months before and 2 weeks after. Mention it now, and virtually everyone says "Hah, I forgot about that!"

> they're worth making to demonstrate exactly how arbitrary language is to change

Why is that so important? Also, who doesn't know that? Plenty of changes over the past few decades, for example "restroom". Language changes all the time.

Well I now go out of my way to use those terms wherever I can. I’m not personally a fan of doublespeak or censorship though.

> Ten years from now no one will even remember or care that master/slave was a term in computing.

I don't think it will take them that long to regret this change. Now that everyone knows linux will just roll over, they'll push for greater changes to the "Code of Conduct." Then developers will get deplatformed at an alarming rate. And I'll have my popcorn ready. It'll be quite the show.

It seems like nowadays that's where concessions on visible efforts the likes of the Linux kernel go, inevitably.

It's not inevitable. It can be resisted. It takes a leader who can stand up to the pressure and say no. That's not a trivial thing. The pressure is considerable, especially these days.

What evidence do you have that suggests that these reasonable changes will lead to further unreasonable changes?

munches on popcorn

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

Not good, it only serves to increase the precedent for hijacking unrelated concepts for political purposes. Language has meaning, twisting that meaning to ascribe negative connotations to terms is divisive and counterproductive. Calling everything and everyone racist devalues the term 'racist' after which a new term for (the actual concept of) racism needs to be found.

I'm not certain that the cost actually is low. My company also announced that they'll be making similar changes. They mentioned there are over 4000 mentions of "master" in our Confluence docs. And they're all not in the same context, so someone will have to read over each instance and change it on a case by case basis. Between these changes and all the PRs that will have to be created to remove master branches / alter CI pipelines, etc., this will easily require thousands of dollars worth of wages. Globally, this is a multi-million dollar effort. And for what gain? Are slaves around the world going to appreciate that techies will no longer be burned with being reminded of their existence?

I wonder if people suggesting we change how we speak are also willing to give up vulgarity which is also offensive.

Why this headline instead of what is actually posted on kernel.org?

Dang...

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