100,000 people pressure Apple to shut down 'Gay Cure' app | Hacker News Reader

100,000 people pressure Apple to shut down 'Gay Cure' app

cnn.com

16 pointstwodayslate19 comments

People seem to have a hard time understanding that freedom of expression goes both ways.

Whether or not you agree with the stance the makers of this app take they have the right to express it, just as gay rights activists can express their side of the coin.

Freedom of expression does not exist in Apple's app store. That has consistently been my takeaway from previous discussions on this topic, at least.

It would arguably be a violation of Apple's rights to force them to sell something on the App Store, except where rejecting it would be anticompetitive behavior. Nobody's stopping the 'Gay Cure' folks from doing it as a web application instead.

Apple is free to limit freedom of speech in their app store however they want and they have done so in the past.

As a bisexual man (who in no way claims to speak for anyone else), I'm torn on this.

Of course, I am fully supportive of freedom of expression and the phrase "I strongly disagree with your opinion but will defend to the death your right to voice it." But...can you imagine an app claiming to "cure" black people? That'd never be approved by Apple. "Curing" LGBT people is just as absurd as "curing" black people. Exposing children to such bigoted, offensive material is really awful. It should almost certainly not have the 4+ rating, and I'm really torn on whether Apple should even allow it into the App Store.

Stuff like this isn't just some abstract issue about 'gay rights' with two equally valid sides of an issue--this homophobia can ruin lives, and sometimes even result in death. It's really a very emotional issue that can't be easily dealt with or abstracted into some 'gay rights' issue.

I feel like I didn't express myself as well as I would've liked, so if anyone has questions, please feel free to ask them.

As much as I don't think one can be cured from homosexuality nor that is a disease, I don't think it should be Apple's responsibility to decide on moral issues (although they have an history of doing so). Morality is people's individual responsibility, not companies, not governments.

The problem is they've irrevocably assigned themselves that responsibility. Google does no curation of the Android Store, therefore they have no responsibility for its contents. Apple, by putting every app through an approval process, has taken on complete responsibility for the App Store's contents.

That being said, despite the occasional screwup (and having been the recipient of an unfair app rejection myself), I think the App Store is a better place overall because of the curation.

So why are there no porn apps on the app store?

The screens get oily enough as it is...

The law against false advertising probably does apply here, and as such the correct course of action would be to file a suit against the seller. I'd love to see them try to prove that their method actually "cures" something.

Without this option though, there's not really anything we can do. If someone believes this is worth selling, and someone else believes this is worth buying, then we're not in any position to tell them what to do with their money.

There are all kinds of scams and other ways buyers can get into trouble, and I certainly won't defend scams (I hate all of them). But in the end it is the buyer's responsibility to call "B.S." and decide not to buy something. Apple can't be a parent to everyone. Even if they could be, what would happen as soon as you step outside the App Store and find something on Amazon or in a brick and mortar shop?

Unless it's a spiritual cure.

Apple has taken measures to ensure that the app store is a walled garden. It has set the bar pretty high compared to other less regulated 'app stores'. It could be considered a strength/weakness. It is what it is....

If it was an anti-apple app then, @#%& you: Denied! Can't have anything ruining apples image, everyone else DIAF.

freedom of expression, more like a bigoted attack. This entire story has so many directions it could go.....

See also the discussion from yesterday: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2349531

This just, again, shows the core problem with censorship. By removing the right for the user to choose which app to download, Apple takes upon itself to filter out "inappropriate" apps. Where do you draw the line? To some extent, something will always offend someone.

You draw the line at government control and stop trying to regulate the activities of private companies and people.

Being able to freely critizise the activities of a private company without fear of government sanction is what the 1st amendment is about. It is not about forcing private companies to adhere to any particular person's view of what they should or shouldn't sell.

I'll bet I could gather up a million people in America who would sign off their right to freedom of speech for a free Apple product and some free apps. I'm glad this country is not run by the majority.

Our freedom of expression is worth a million times more than stopping a few people pushing some evil religious agenda. 50 years from now, these nutbars will still be with us, voicing new inflammatory messages. The solution is not to silence them, but to educate everyone so the inflammatory message has no effect.

1 million people is not the majority of 300 million people. Unless you think you could gather up 151 million people who would accept your trade?

It's Apple's platform for "raking in the cash", not your platform for "freedom of expression."

Apple has a ToS, and Apple isn't censoring (def: "forbid the public distribution of") anyone.

Private people expressing their negative opinions regarding a private company is not a restriction on speech or a violation on any constitutional right.

The first amendment is about government behavior not about private behavior.

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