Comment by atishbabu | Hacker News Reader

Comment by atishbabu | Hacker News Reader

the article misses a big point on why Apple products are slow to come to India. the Indian government has imposed a 51% FDI (foreign ownership) cap on single-brand retail stores, hence the most apple could own if they started apple stores in India is 51%.

India sells very little electronics online as of yet so most of Apple sales happen online. so if you are Apple and you arbitrarily have to give up 49% for no reason wouldn't you wait for regulations to change instead of helping prop up some arbitrary partner that you are forced to do business with? moreover, if you have to prioritize markets, wouldn't you prioritize markets where you own all of the business that you created before giving inventory that is in short-supply to a market where you are forced to sell through 3rd parties?

also, this does not even start to address the duties and other fees imposed on apple for selling in India which jacks up prices for their products and reduces their addressable market. again, if you have to prioritize wouldn't you choose markets that were more friendly assuming limited supplies of your product were available. wouldn't you only come in when supplies were high enough or products were saturated enough in other markets that were more favorable to you?

the article also confuses the population for India with Apple's available market in India, because of income levels in India a very small portion of the population has the income and desire to buy Apple products (Remember, India is the market of the TATA Nano, the 1 lakh car or about $2000 to $2500 USD based on the USD-INR exchange rate). Indians tend to very cost sensitive. Yes, India has over a billion people, but I bet Apple's market in India is 0.1% of the population or 1 million people max (and even then I think that 0.11% is high and overly generous). Compare that to Dubai or Singapore or Belgium where the population is much smaller but Apple's addressable market is higher due to incomes and purchasing behaviors.

I am Indian and live in Mumbai and would prefer new Apple products to be available in India sooner rather than later (I have a iPhone, iPad, AppleTV, and MacBook Pro), but I understand why Apple has made certain business decisions in how they prioritize their markets.

This FDI norms are hurdles but it should not be the only obstacle as there are many companies that are marketing their products successfully, in fact Dell is going to make $2billion from India alone and they have more than 20,000 employees there ... India is certainly a biggest growth market but then you need to concentrate on that properly by having active presence and that is what Apple lacks right now ...

first, don't think people who want to buy a Mac are considering buying a Dell or HP device, two different market segments with two different needs, that's like saying because the TATA Nano is selling well in India that Aston Martin should be prioritizing India as a key market despite there being more people who would actually purchase an Aston in a country like Dubai or Singapore or Belgium

second, I never suggested that India was a small computer market, just saying that the original article does not address some reasons beyond Apple's control nor does it look at things from Apple's perspective, Apple is not stupid if it was worthwhile for them to prioritize India higher the company would, just look at their efforts in China in terms of the iPhone and opening Apple retail stores, every business has limited time and resources and people and you are going to use those things in the markets that gives you the best return on your investment

The FDI cap easy workarounds involving setting up a wholesale business and signing up your customers as members (the CostCo model). Many other brands already do this.

But otherwise, all valid points.

agrred, that's how walmart and carrefour are getting around retail FDI restrictions in India

they are setting up wholesale cash-and-carry businesses that resemble Costco in the United States

just envision that would be hard for apple to do in terms of apple stores for India

> Compare that to Dubai or Singapore or Belgium where the population is much smaller but Apple's addressable market is higher due to incomes and purchasing behaviors.

Hmmm, can it really be true that Singapore (population 5e6) has a larger market than India (pop 1e9), even given the huge per-capita GDP difference?

I agree with the thrust of your point (and everything about FDI), but would be useful to look at the income distribution in India to see if your ballpark estimate is correct.

i concede your point in that my analysis is far from rigorous

my brief sample is walking around singapore you see many more people on a percentage basis with iphones in their hands and you go to coffee bean and tea leaf in singapore and you see that of those with computers out many more have MACs than their peer group in India at coffee shops with their laptops out - i am the first to say this is not the most rigorous argument

Thanks for the explanation. Your comment was more informative than the article. I have always wondered about the reason for Apple ignoring India, and now I know what's going on.

one thing you have to also keep in mind about articles written by Indian publishers is that investigative journalism is basically non-existent

the amount of research that writers put into their articles is pathetically low, and editorial oversight takes a back seat to sensational headlines that grad attention and ad revenue

another way to look at Indian news media is that it actually makes Fox News in the US looks "fair and balanced"

if you think sensational seeking news media is a problem in the United States and elsewhere in the world, I don't even know how to describe how bad things have become here in India which is a shame because it used to be much better here in India

Interesting. Do you have any idea what has caused that change?

my guesses are a. decreasing attention span b. business - tabloid news sells better than investigative/informed journalism that presents both sides and a full set of arguments c. cheaper/easier to be an echo chamber for mob sentiment than to be the voice of reason

Oh, OK. Sounds like the same things going on with USA news.

Having seen a fair share of Fox News and Indian media alike, they're on the same platform. Sensationalism exists in Indian media but none of them push an agenda as much as Fox news does.

On the other hand, you could compare CNN here and Indian news channels for the kludges and for relying on "public opinion and insights" rather than partaking in investigative journalism.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com