Collapse OS | Hacker News Reader

Collapse OS

github.com

42 pointskristianp15 comments

Previously: Collapse OS (collapseos.org) 753 points by spraak 8 months ago | 316 comments

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21182628

Should probably be merged with the other submission that’s currently trending. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23450287

In theory, that discussion is primarily about Fourth and this one is primarily about the OS.

I wonder, after a civilization collapse in some near future, would there really be that much "older hardware" like floppy disks. Wouldn't the currently modern hw (usb hdd / sdd) be overwhelmingly more present and in a usable condition?

I think it depends on your definition of collapse. A total apocalyptic collapse I think is quite unlikely; even in nuclear war we don't have enough warheads to cover every square inch of land.

What is far more likely is decentralized collapse, i.e. at the national or continental level. We see instances of this going on even today, for example in Syria where basic societal privileges like rule of law and utilities are/were destroyed. There are a few countries around the world that match this description.

In that case, old hardware is much more likely to be present, especially if autonomous gangs roam around looting households and public area freely. Furthermore, if you imagine that all technology is gone entirely, it would be much "easier" (relatively, anyways) to build a floppy disk from scratch than an SSD. Once you reach a certain level of operating system like CollapseOS, developing and deploying embedded software applications becomes "trivial" (relatively) which opens up the gateway to autonomous factory machines that build better machines, that build better machines, that build better products, etc. until you eventually reach a stage where you are equivalent with modern production.

But, supposing tech artefacts are still around, why the autonomous gangs would use old hw? If you enter a house or a store today, would you not more likely find a sdcard than a floppy drive?

> In that case, old hardware is much more likely to be present

This project seems to be targeting computers and games consoles from the 1980s - stuff that hasn't been manufactured in decades. Why is that more likely to be present than something like a Raspberry Pi, or a WiFi router that can be flashed with OpenWRT?

Because third world economies run on stuff from the 1980s. Most of the world still doesn't have WiFi routers.

I don't know everywhere in the world, but at least in some of the poorest countries of West Africa, in the low-to-middle class (merchants, a large part of bike/car taxis, salesmen, teachers, IT...) everyone have a smartphone, using heavily Whatsapp btw. This is the kind of hw that will most likely remain after a collapse. Survival should concentrate on using smartphones for general purposes, while trying to not depend on online services (AppleStore, PlayStore etc).

As a side note, survival best practice would be to depend only on what is the most likely to remain. Programmers knowing the mainstream languages are the wide majority, so after losing lots of people, they are the ones most likely to be still around. Better build an OS based on C/C++, Java, JS.

Which country exactly do you think has no WiFi devices, but has a ton of TRS-80s?

This is what is it looks like when retrocomputing enthusiasts turn into full-blown preppers. Like conventional preppers, they have turned mere idle fantasies of them being relevant and important into apocalyptic visions of societal collapse, since that would be the only thing capable of making them such.

Being an enthusiast and having expertise in matters now mostly forgotten or abandoned is good, since this knowledge might otherwise be forgotten, and some of it is still occasionally useful when you least expect it. But scaremongering and encouraging bunker-building is probably counter-productive at best.

I think it is worth reading his explanation [1] of why he built this. He doesn't really seem to be scaremongering, just that he identified a risk that he thinks has a high likelihood of happening, and he decided to do something about it.

He isn't talking about apocalyptic collapse, rather a collapse of supply chains necessary to develop complex electronics.

[1] - https://collapseos.org/why.html

The point he makes is extremely valid and your response is simply that you don't want X to happen so you'll deny it.

Just before covid got big I was warning people to do basic stuff like stock up a bit just in case, and expect disruption. I literally got laughed at or told "you're wrong" or "you're being stupid". By people like you. Who won't face up to actual possibilities. Who drag down those who do, and who try to discredit those who do something about it.

Covid was a 'apocalyptic visions' just a few months ago. You've nothing to be proud of, trying to diss this guy. You are not contributing anything.

Many countries and governments recommend having atleast 2 weeks supply of food and water incase of a natural disaster. Not to mention for people who live in remote places.

So I want to say that you were not laughed at by everyone.

Now... there is a possibility of 'I was correct once... so I am also correct on other unlikely things that might happen' fallacy.

Not saying you are wrong on this case. Just that you remind me of my dad. He always thinks things are going to go wrong. Like every day he thinks he'll get robbed or his car will get stolen. So the one time he hits on a bad situation he'll remind us how no one listens to him and that he's always right.

> Now... there is a possibility of 'I was correct once... so I am also correct on other unlikely things that might happen' fallacy.

As you don't know what else I am predicting that will happen, you can't call it a fallacy. These things WILL happen: serious epidemic (woops, ticked that!), highly destructive solar flare, catastrophic climate change, diseases caused antibiotic resistant bacteria, food production problems from widespread use of what are effectively plant clones (monocultures)[0].

Now tell me I'm wrong, that any these can't happen. They might take a while but when they hit they could be serious to extremely serious. Low risk but high consequences.

> Not saying you are wrong on this case.

> Just that you remind me of my dad...

So you are saying I'm wrong or what? I think you're talking down things the same way as the other poster for the same reason.

Well, I'm not your dad. I'm not here to show off being right. I'm trying to avoid catastrophic situations. The first step to doing that is identifying the problems (listed above, I will presume you agree with them?) then deal with them by actually... dealing with them. That's step 2, which the great majority of people won't take because it's uncomfortable. Easier to deny.

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