The U.S. Military Is Monitoring Protests in Seven States | Hacker News Reader

The U.S. Military Is Monitoring Protests in Seven States

thenation.com

38 pointsAndrewBissell20 comments

As they should.

Those protests are ripe for foreign influence escalating the situation. USA knows this best of all with its history of amplifying civil unrest abroad in order to advance its geopolitical goals.

For USA the most recent were the Honk-Kong protests which it used to try undermining China. So wondering how China will respond now. Russia might try promoting Black Lives Matter again to escalate the tensions. Then there is Iran too. Would be interesting to somehow get the list of all the players.

I wonder if this is why Trump, in one of his recent press briefings, just talked about Hong Kong.

I'm an African American living in Asia. I have lived in China. And I have experienced much more racism in America than in China. Some will not believe me so I'm prepared to prove it if necessary.

Recently, certain politicians have made grave proclamations about people/thugs fighting for freedom in HK, Minneapolis, and other places around the world.

It should be interesting and instructive to observe the cognitive dissonance and resulting contortions of U.S. and other Western politicians as they address this grave matter.

I have observed that whenever some of my compatriots are presented with information that lies outside their regular programming, they label the messenger either a Chinese or Russian troll. This Australian woman has noticed this phenomenon: https://caitlinjohnstone.com/2020/03/19/liberal-npcs-hate-ru...

These could be as a result of foreign influence operations by the Russians or the Chinese. Then again, this effect might simply be the result of the online labors of America's equivalent of GCHQ's JTRIG: https://theintercept.com/2014/02/24/jtrig-manipulation/ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joint_Threat_Research_Intellig...

We (Americans) are the masters of "foreign influence operations."

I’m from South America and have lived in China (2 years) and the US (30 years) too and the only conclusion I can come to is that your post is likely one of the trolls this comment references. In the two years I lived in both rural Hebei and Beijing and in the time I spent traveling around the country, I witnessed far more elements of fascism (especially out in Kashgar and rural parts of Xinjiang) than the US that it’s not even close.

If this comment was something someone had actual conviction about they wouldn’t be using a throwaway account.

You're entitled to an opinion. Even racists and JTRIG operatives have opinions. Quite often, racists are quick to dismiss black people's allegations of racism because they lack empathy... even when confronted with video evidence.

One thing I noticed while living in China is that it's not usually Africans and African Americans who complain the most about Chinese racism against black people. No, sir! It's usually non-black racists who have experienced discrimination for the first time and finally found an opportunity to camouflage and justify their own racism against blacks, Asians, etc. by using the Chinese as a canvas on which they can paint a narrative.

A person can travel to China (or elsewhere in Asia), date and marry the locals, have mixed race offspring and still have strong prejudice against Asians or other people of color. See for instance SerpentZA and Laowhy86 and their reactions to the physiognomy of their own children. And SerpentZA's expressed opinions on post-Apartheid South Africa.

Are there racists in China? Of course there are. Is there rampant discrimination against non-Han people. Yes! People of all colors can be racist or ethnocentric. But is Chinese anti-black racism worse than American anti-black racism as the recent narratives have proclaimed? No! An emphatic "NO"!

In China, most foreigners experience racism at some point during their stay. For a non-black person who has never experienced in-your-face racism, this has to be a jarring and disorienting experience.

For a black person in China, particularly an American black person, it's just "meh" racism. The cops aren't trying to murder you for simply existing and no one will try to lock you up in prison forever for not being the right color. Granted, as in America, some people may not date you and some employers will not hire you due to the color of your skin, but the vast majority of Chinese will be warm and friendly toward you and they won't clutch their pearls when they encounter you day or night.

So, in my opinion (as a black man) living in China was quite a refreshingly meh and relaxing experience. "I didn't even have to use my AK."

Apparently, your experience varied and you hold a different opinion about the relative toxicity of Chinese and American racism. But, as you noted, we are different people. Welcome to racism for the inexperienced... it hurts, doesn't it? I feel for you but I will not apologize for living a different experience than explained by your programming or your privilege. If that makes me a "troll", so be it.

He said he's experienced more racism in the US than China. You say that China has far more fascism than the US, which apparently makes you believe he must be trolling.

I'm having trouble following the logic of your argument. Did you perhaps misread "racism" as "fascism" in his comment?

Both. Racism and Fascism. I lost track of how many times I heard my students say "All Japanese must die". While I'm sure there are people in the US who feel the same about some groups, such as Black people, I've never personally heard a statement like that about any group, much less heard it multiple times from different students of different ages at different schools.

This was just the attitude towards Japanese people. There was also the attitude toward Uighurs and Tibetans.

Black people aren't the only people that experience racism.

> Augment MN State Patrol Civil Disturbance Operations with a show of force

Well, that's fucking illegal as shit. You can't use military to perform law enforcement actions, and a "show of force" is clearly a threat to use the force, which would be a law enforcement action, since a show of force is technically a responsive security measure. The military is only supposed to support law enforcement with things like medical care or what have you, but this falls clearly on the side of law enforcement.

Edit: when I was in the Navy, we performed counter drug operations where the Coast Guard would legally "take over" the ship's command structure, temporarily, so we could legally perform law enforcement actions against drug boats thousands of miles from the USA. When we spotted the drug runners (by helo or intelligence), the Coasties would immediately become in legal command of the ship because any warnings over the radio (where we told them to stop or we'd shoot their engines) or shots to do so would be considered a law enforcement action since it was a "threat of force". We (the officers) were told if we did anything over the radio or even chased the boats before the Coastie Commanding Officer took over, we'd get court-martialed for some sort of violation of the US Constitution, no shit.

> Well, that's fucking illegal as shit. You can't use military to perform law enforcement actions

You can if they are National Guard called out by the governor.

Haha what a clever end run around the rule. Just get a single Coast Guard officer in and you can enforce using the military. Reminds me of the fact that California has no civil asset forfeiture but the police have revshares with the feds and the feds can totally still do their civil asset forfeiture, so Californian police just route their stuff through the feds who take a cut. Very much in the hacker spirit.

Also reminds me of that movie Sicario.

Yes, it was pretty much bullshit, I am not happy about my role back then.

> Well, that's fucking illegal as shit.

Nonsense. As far back as 1970 the infantry and armed cavalry of the Ohio National Guard fixed bayonettes to the M1 semi-automatic rifles and shot 13 unarmed students at Kent State university - killing four.

You will note that students were indicted for the riot (Kent 25) but NONE of the soldiers or chain of command.

And the USG has been defending this action as recently as 2012.

Isn't that the difference between what is illegal on paper (according to the law) and what actually gets enforced as illegal? Kids are taught that the law is the law, but in reality only the law that gets enforced matters.

IANAL and don't live in the US, but my guess from other posters is that its completely legal for the national guard to shoot rioters if the governor authorises it.

FWIW: I did politely ask what the legal response to looting in US law is, but got down-voted, sans answer, by the woke.

Why are you commenting if you don't live in America and don't understand the situation? De facto is way different than de jure.

I have bitter first-hand experience of the consequences of leaving dangerous laws on the books: e.g. shooting looters with FMJ ammunition "that everyone known isn't going to be used".

I bet few us live in Ireland, but most would agree that their recent changes to remove blasphemy laws is a good idea, no?

If you REALLY don't want the military shooting looters, then at least take the effort to get the laws changed. You can multi-task. Phone AOC.

I appreciate your experience, but in the USA, regardless of what these other posters are stating, you can't use the military for law enforcement except for very narrow limits. They are mistaken when they say this use is legal, but I can forgive their error since America has basically turned into a banana republic, so it's hard to understand some things that are occurring daily used to be really illegal and looked down upon.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posse_Comitatus_Act

1. I am aware of the PCA, by guess is a bunch of other loosely written clauses in OTHER equally legal Acts of congress are used as cover to trump the PCA;

2. Once you are at secret courts, all bets are off.

Sad really.

"You can't use military to perform law enforcement actions"

As a former military member, you need to go refresh yourself on how and when posse comitatus can be suspended, and to whom it does and does not apply.

as KKPMW comments here, "Those protests are ripe for foreign influence escalating the situation."

So are discussion pages like this, "ripe for foreign influence escalating the situation." Let's all be mindful of that.

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