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Comment by lend000 | Hacker News Reader

It's interesting, and somewhat reassuring that they mention people recovering from the hospital after two months, as I believe I've had coronavirus symptoms for about 6 weeks now without much change. My symptoms have never been quite as severe as the last time I got the flu, but they show little change over time. Lethargy, sore throat, pink eye, and mild fever are the primary symptoms for me. I'll feel 95% better, then go for a walk and relapse for another week and a half.

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This is actually quite common in COVID-19 and SARS patients, Chris Cuomo from CNN popularized the "waves" that it comes in with his personal ordeal. Some evidence that this virus either replicates very fast, or hides from the immune system (could explain the asymptomatic people) until the right moment when you feel weak after a workout. Eventually your body will 100% defeat it, but you should probably take it easy and socially distance until you have 72 straight hours without a fever.

This is common in Chickenpox too, where it hides out and then re-emerges later in life as shingles near the age where your immune system starts to weaken.

Good luck, you'll get through this.

If this person has COVID-19, should they not socially distance with extreme vigilance for a very long time?

I must be misinterpreting you, are you really saying you'd be comfortable being around people right after peak symptoms of a COVID-19 infection?

parent is using CDC guidelines (I think?). I agree with your take, however.

Yeah, those were (and maybe still are) CDC guidelines:

2 negative tests at least 24 hours apart OR

7+ days since symptom onset, AND 72+ hours without fever (with no meds) AND significant improvement in respiratory symptoms

There's mounting evidence that people are no longer infectious from day 8 after symptoms first appear onward. A German study tracked only a handful of patients, but tracked them very rigorously, with multiple swabs each day for 30 days and were unable to cultivate a live viral isolate after day 8 in ALL cases, even when the patient's viral load was still extremely high. (But in fairness, a bunch of viruses work this way, where patients are still sick and their viral load is high, but they cease being contagious after a few days. Eight days is still a long time, but you shouldn't have to quarantine for a month, we hope.)

Do you have a link to the study?

For those who wonder, it's a preprint[1].

[1] https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.03.05.20030502v...

> hides from the immune system (could explain the asymptomatic people) until the right moment when you feel weak after a workout

I'm pretty sure this is what happened to me. I felt fine, did a big workout for the first time in a few weeks, and a few hours later, came down with a low grade fever, which progressed into an illness that very closely tracked the symptoms and timeline of COVID-19.

The good news: I was recovering in a house with my two parents around age 60, and my younger brother. I spent most of the two weeks in my room, trying to avoid any contact, and nobody else in the house got sick (it's been over a month since I recovered, so we're pretty confident of that at this point). So, it's not inevitable that you'll transmit it if you take distancing measures early!

Have your two parents and younger brother had a particularly big workout yet? ;)

Both the parents have, at least! My dad and I did a 35mi bike ride last weekend :)

Unrelated, but that fake, dramatized departure from quarantine that Cuomo did really bothered me.

He was leaving his home well before that, violating doctors orders. It made me question how much of his "ordeal" was dramatized as well.

I don't necessarily blame him: CNN producers are likely at fault.

Is there evidence of that? I remember him claiming he hadn't left the basement at all. Also, I know you can't tell by looking, but he never really looked all that sick. Never a stuffy or runny nose and usually not that tired looking, no red face, no watery eyes, etc.

I have no reason to doubt his account, unless of course there is evidence that he didn't stay down in the basement that whole time.

You mean more evidence than Cuomo's own account of him being outside his residence that he gave on his radio show?

what? that's a far different thing from gp's claim

The account Cuomo gave was of a confrontation he had because a cyclist who knew from CNN that Cuomo had COVID19 and was quarantining asked him what he was doing outside in public around his family. It wasn't close to his property. He was violating quarantine.

He didn’t stay in the basement. He was “caught” outside with family members and no mask.

Look up the “fat tire biker” incident.

For obvious reasons CNN is not admitting that the basement emergence video was entirely fake.

Personally I now think that Cuomo did have Covid but probably had mild symptoms and was basically soft-forced into hamming up the symptoms to “drive the reality of Covid home” to America.

I hate to use the term but CNN is truly fake news at this point.

I posted a New York Times opinion-piece a little while back on a woman who created an online support group for people recovering. I found the article because I was looking for some info myself on how long to expect things to last. I was feeling pretty down because it just seemed to linger and linger. Made me feel better to know this was common. The official CDC guidance broke people into groups of “mild” and “severe”, with corresponding time to recover. But the anecdata suggests even “mild” (I.e., didn’t go on a vent) can have lingering symptoms for sometimes as long as 30 days. Hang in there!

The 30+ day group has now 1600+ members.

I'm on my 8th week, and some people are on 60+ days.

What's amazing is the wide variety of symptoms.

The original article: https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/13/opinion/coronavirus-recov...

Same feeling here, but I can definitely attribute this to an allergy. Go and see a doctor and get an allergy test done, I had similar breathing and lethargy issues in last year November already. Then nothing until end of February and since then it is on and off for days.

I live in Berlin and we had very long periods of dry weather, yesterday it rained properly and I can immediately breathe again.

My story is that at the end of October I flew from SFO and on the way home I felt sick to my stomach (probably food poisoning), but about 5 weeks later in December I was having some pretty severe breathing issues, like it was cut in half and no other symptoms I could identify. It was attributed to anxiety by my doctor and a few days later I felt okay. Then at the beginning of the year in January it hit again and has been hitting me on a monthly cycle with diminished severity. In fact I’m feeling it again today after feeling totally fine for weeks. I don’t know if its Covid because I was never tested for the disease or the antibodies but it was And is a strange feeling unlike anything I’ve felt. Like wearing an extremely tight turtleneck. I wonder after reading these accounts if this disease is a chronic illness that lives in your circulatory system. Is there anything known about this?

Sounds like we had a similar respiratory disease. I also flew through SFO, like many millions of others, in December. I fell ill over the holidays, and then again in January. I also rarely fall ill, and hadn't had a cold or even severe allergies for several years.

My primary symptom was respiratory, I could go up a single flight of stairs and feel short of breath, like someone was standing on my throat and lungs.

I saw my doctor a few times about it, but neither my partner, nor my family, nor my co-workers fell ill. The phylogeny that I've seen published about SARS-CoV-2 definitively rules out that I had it. Likewise, if I did I'd expect that based on how virulent covid-19 is, I'd expect someone else I know or one of my grandparents to have caught it.

I've seen similar reports of a respiratory illness on Twitter and I think it comes down to a uniquely bad flu season and perhaps some other bug going around which hits the respiratory system.

Yeah, that's just the flu or some other disease. It's a bad flu year.

If it was actually covid-19 community spreading in December, then we wouldn't be talking about a few thousand deaths now in April, we'd be talking about millions. The exponential curves don't match up.

Whatever you had, it wasn't covid-19.

> If it was actually covid-19 community spreading in December, then we wouldn't be talking about a few thousand deaths now in April, we'd be talking about millions.

That's assuming the death rate is as high as it is estimated from known cases. If the actual death rate is a magnitude smaller due to huge amounts of undocumented cases, then the curve is wrong.

Going by some of the antibody tests performed, this seems to be the case, but the antibody tests might be erroneous as well.

There's a strict lower bound of around 0.5% on how mild the IFR can be looking at NYC and Italy

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.04.18.20070912v...

There's absolutely no way that it's been running rampant since december

Hell no. That estimate comes with many assumptions, so unless you are willing to list them all, it is better to just provide the link. And it is still just one study, waiting to be proven / disproven. Take it easy and use common sense.

That's interesting.

I've had very mild but puzzling symptoms since late January when I returned from Thailand/Malaysia.

Sometimes absent entirely for a week or two and sometimes as strong as that "oh - I'm beginning to come down with something" feeling. Sore throat is common as is a slight heaviness in my chest.

Tends to come on in the afternoon and usually imperceptible in the morning.

It's only a nuisance if it wasn't just enough to trigger anxiety about whether or not it was Covid-19.

I've dismissed the idea that it actually was Covid-19 because I've never heard anyone say that it could last this long but it's definitely unusual.

EDIT - for various reasons I've been strictly isolating for almost 2 months anyway. I would have isolated earlier if the advice had been clearer.

That's pretty much my experience in terms of symptoms. I otherwise haven't had any cold symptoms whatsoever in the past five years. I'm waiting on reliable antibody tests to become available.

An acquaintance of mine told me of a friend that had died of viral pneumonia at the end of February, when there were very few cases identified in the west. Strikingly, he reported a loss of taste and smell.

The annoying thing is that I'm now isolating both because I might not have had it and because I might still have it.

Thank you so much for posting this. I was in Boston in early March on a business trip, two days later I began having a sore throat in the afternoons/evenings that was gone again every morning. After four or so weeks, it finally disappeared, only to come back strong for two days, where I thought I was finally coming down with something, then it turned mild again, then disappeared. The sore throat went on for at least six weeks, which is easily three times longer than anything I've had before in my life.

I wouldn't have thought it was COVID-19, except for the new studies from Spain regarding skin conditions. I had what I thought were horrible bug bites that appeared one morning. They were very itchy small blisters, and I thought I had bed bugs. I hired an exterminator, but he found nothing at my house. What I had - exactly 14 days after my trip - matches exactly with descriptions of skin rashes written up in the study. I'm 53 years old and the study mentioned this kind of rash was most common in middle-aged patients.

So . . . now I'm convinced I had/have it, and will get an anti-body test when they are available.

I noticed exactly the same dry cough, itching eyes, laziness and feeling tired symptoms as you. Don't know If i'm positive, but I remain at home, avoid contact, and wash the hands often, just in case.

Flu-like hitting hard in December or so (before the start of the problem), and ripples all the way since that. I don't know if is coronavirus or other thing, but the recurrency of the symptoms is puzzling. Could be just a spring allergy also of course. No fever at all.

I had a good sweat for half a night followed by a dry cough that lasted about 4 weeks from late February through March. It's gone now but I don't remember the last time I had a cough last that long. Once the antibody tests are more widely available I plan on taking one to understand if it was covid19

FYI, you can buy yourself an antibody test online directly from Quest Labs for $119.

That’s great news; here’s the link:

https://questdirect.questdiagnostics.com/products/

However, I’m disappointed that it’s not available in the states of AK, HI, OK, AZ, IN, nor outside of the U.S. Further silliness is that in CA and OR you have to wait a week to get the results because California and Oregon state laws require that lab results be held for 7 days before Quest can release them; this hold is in place so that your physician has the opportunity to discuss your lab test results with you prior to you receiving them.

Another annoyance is the little questionnaire you have to go through before they agree to sell it to you. You have to divine their intentions for each question. If you don’t answer “correctly”, this is what you get and they won’t sell it to you:

This test is not right for you. Based on your response, you may still have an active COVID-19 infection and this test may not be right for you at this time. COVID-19 Immune Response testing is specifically used to check for an immune response to the virus which can take time after an active infection.

I understand all that. I just want to buy the test. Maybe I want to keep it for a day when I or someone I know needs it. Or whatever reason. Why force users to reverse engineer the questions and then lie to get it?

Also if you give your date of birth as less than 18, you get the same “This test is not right for you” refusal. I guess they don’t want to sell to minors, though the message is deceptive since it has to do with regulation and not whether the infection is active. So if you’re buying it to test your children, you again have to lie to their questionnaire since the questions are posed for the person taking the test.

The bureaucracy surrounding medical products is just horrible.

Why do you feel that anyone is entitled to buy their test even if they do not meet their criteria for who they believe should receive their test?

A test is not a life-saving device, especially for a test that only detects recovered patients.

If it started in December, it's probably not covid 19. If you don't have a fever, it's probably not covid 19.

The official record has traced the first case back to November 17, so it definitely seems at least possible it was spreading earlier than we know.

2020, the year COVID outranks Cancer as the webs goto diagnosis for anything and everything

I saw a report today that said most people going to hospital with covid-19 don't have a fever.

I don't remember if it was on december or january, honestly, but it was before the wuhan market jumped to the newspapers.

All tested members of my family were negative so far, so probably more around Jan than Dec, and probably not corona. Maybe just fungus spores or pollen

At the start physicians insisted on fever being a core symptom, but since then they have eased off on this. No fever does not mean no covid.

probably but not completely discountable.

its because people have been saying "hey what about this" despite the loud banging of the scientifically minded people yelling "NO EVIDENCE THEREFORE ITS AN ABSURD IDEA" that we know of a community spread case in the US that died on February 6th. Instead of a travel related case that died on February 29th.

so then was patient zero in US from travel on January 15th? January 1st? December 15th? December 1st? How many hops are really necessary

If patient died at Feb 6th, then it contracted covid about 1 month before that from somebody else, so Jan 1st, maybe.

I was going with 3 weeks, but yes early January like 2nd week 6th - 12th

and if that person was also community spread or travel spread then we are looking at mid-december either way.

> If you don't have a fever, it's probably not covid 19.

If you do have COVID-19, you're statistically more likely to not have a fever than to have a fever.

From what I've seen online, a ton of people in the US got hit hard in December, myself included - I typically don't get sick. Even if covid19 hadn't happened I think this would've been a bad flu year.

An anecdote about allergies. I take zyrtec (generic) for mild hayfever. Have been for almost a decade. So, I sort of figured I had allergies covered. I’d get cold/flu symptoms twice a year at roughly the same time each year, and just figured it was the seasonal flu (especially with school age kids, you get it all). I finally realized a couple years ago, though, that that most of the symptoms disappeared once I got to work, with it’s recycled and filtered AC. It took a long time to put this together since I’d tend to stay home when I thought I was contagious. So now I’m more aware of when the trees near me are dumping pollen, and it definitely lines up.

I say this to let you know that if you’re stuck at home, you may be more likely to be feeling the effects of local allergens that you might not feel if you spent less time at home. The symptoms you describe sound a lot like allergies to me. I’m not a doctor though, so please do your own research. And talk to a doctor about the symptoms, especially if they progress...

3M sells some high-quality home HVAC filters under the "Filtrete Healthy Living Advanced Allergen Reduction" label; you may want to try one for a couple of months and see if it helps you breathe better. They make a difference for me versus run-of-the-mill filters. I'm sure there are better ones out there, or cheaper ones of equal quality from a different brand, but in my experience these work quite well.

> I've had coronavirus symptoms for about 6 weeks now without much change

I've been having a mildly sore throat for five weeks, with a couple of days of feeling unwell, and slightly elevated temperature (not fever) on occasion. No cough, but a "you're about to get a cold" feeling in the airways. I've had also had one "relapse" last week. Since I didn't have any "hallmark symptoms", I didn't qualify for a test.

If I really did contract COVID-19, it must be highly contagious, because I've been drastically minimizing going outside even before there were any cases recorded outside Asia. I'm also obsessive about washing my hands and not touching my face. I haven't had a cold in five years and have no allergies.

People are self isolating without symptoms, but you go for walks?

Lots of places have a rule that you can go outside for one exercise walk a day provided that you stay 2m away from people.

I'm not saying it is against the rules, but what should be common decency. People going to the office having a cold don't break any rules, but the lack of self awareness is usually frowned upon.

Catching, or transmitting C19 outside looks to pretty unlikely https://thehill.com/policy/healthcare/494348-new-study-finds... May turn out that the best prevention advice would have been to stay outside as much as possible.

Most of us only go out for the bare minimum, but people actually experiencing symptoms are going for a walk. This does not add up. Exposing others knowing fully well you are having symptoms is not right.

I fortunately was stocked up on supplies for the first 10 days of symptoms (after which I thought I had recovered but still was quite careful). However I don't have the luxury to stay inside for 6 straight weeks at a time, nor would it be prudent for recovery and good health to be deprived of fresh air for so long, in my opinion. Of course I am still quite self isolated even when I do venture out, use a disinfectant wipe to touch doors, wear a makeshift mask, hold my breath and cross the street before passing other pedestrians when I walk, and manage to not come in close contact with anyone.

And I am far more careful than most, including the person I believe I contracted it from, and I have still possibly exposed some people incidentally. This is why I believe that any idea of containment and contact tracing is absurd in any semblance of a free country, and the only way the pandemic ends is if everyone gets it or an effective vaccine is developed. However, almost everyone will probably get it before the vaccine is developed.

thanks for this. Have nearly identical situation. 2 days shy of 6 weeks. The fatigue/lethargy is probably the worst part.

Also, I tested negative 5 weeks ago, but given issues with testing, I have self-isolated anyway.

edit: never have found a fever, though i had pretty intense bouts of chills in the first week

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