Why is education affected negatively by COVID? It is the last sector I would expect. I'm sure many are doing fine but IIRC Ryan Florence had to lay off his React teachers as well.
If Lambda tries to sell their ISAs, which they admit they sometimes do, the buyer is going to request a much steeper discount now than before if they are willing to buy the loans at all.
If hiring slows down, which it has, then these schools don't have anywhere to place students.
I'm going to need you to cite something to back that up. It is opposite of everything I've seen so far.
Just search on "schools shutting down for the rest of the year" and you'll find a bunch of sources. Of course it varies by state/district here in the U.S., but many are opting to shut down completely rather than attempting online instruction.
It's capped and time limited - so you know the max you'll pay and how long you may be paying up front. Not sure why you're mentioning unemployment benefits? Why would that be their job to do that for you?
What's the problem?
Not really sure what you want here.
They don't offer proof? When you buy a book do you demand 'proof' from the author that you'll learn something from it? What proof do universities offer? It's a service offered. If you want it, buy it. If you don't, don't.
> And in crisis times they signal their courses give no edge over the job market by.. laying off their own people.
These are employees, not students of their course, aren't they? And you having to lay people off due to reduced revenue doesn't say anything about the quality of their education anyway.
I think you're just throwing random snide comments around that don't really make any sense.
Claiming slavish tax is the same, like Lambda does, is simply a fraud.
Lambda School is also limited price as well. And you can 'throw your education out of the window' metaphorically, after you've paid the fee, any time you like. You also can't throw a book out of the window until you've paid the whole price of it.
> Claiming slavish tax is the same, like Lambda does, is simply a fraud.
It's just a fee for a service. It's not a tax. And there's no deception so it isn't fraud.
The problem is that Lambda are vampires. Their model is completely superfluous. They do not add any value over self-assigned MIT lectures on Youtube. From what I have gathered, Lambda is the kind of setting where folks like me are supposed to show up and supplement the "teacher" and their lack of knowledge; normally, when I do that, I expect to be paid six figures per year.
Where on earth do you think I said that?
> The problem is that Lambda are vampires.
You're just resorting to abuse now.
In formal jargon, which might not sound much better, Lambda is a rent-seeker [0]; they want to complicate an existing system (people teach themselves for free using freely-available materials and time) in order to extract money from the system. Quoting from [0]:
> The classic example of rent-seeking, according to Robert Shiller, is that of a feudal lord who installs a chain across a river that flows through his land and then hires a collector to charge passing boats a fee to lower the chain. There is nothing productive about the chain or the collector. The lord has made no improvements to the river and is not adding value in any way, directly or indirectly, except for himself. All he is doing is finding a way to make money from something that used to be free.
From one of many deep looks at Lambda [1]:
> Lambda’s educational model hinges on student-contractors called Team Leads (TLs) — students who, two months into their education, defer another two months in order to become teaching assistants tasked with taking attendance, checking in with other students, and answering questions. These student-contractors are paid roughly $13 an hour and have only just learned the material they are then tasked with explaining to the next batch of students. One student told me he was given no training on how to be a TL and spent many hours on devising curriculum and exercises to help other students. Another student, Erica Thompson, told me that TLs “are hired on a Friday and start on Monday.” TLs are roughly analogous to graduate-student instructors at universities, but with far less experience with the material.
I am not exaggerating: I am not interested in paying money, or promising away future money, or getting less than a $15/hr wage, for the privilege of regurgitating material to my fellow students. It sounds like a massive waste of everybody's time and money. Why do you defend these practices so ardently? Were you victimized by Lambda or something?
[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rent-seeking
[1] https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2020/02/lambda-schools-job-p...
I said this education product isn't free. That's just a fact. I didn't say it was not possible to get other education for free. I got my CS education for free, for example.
> is that of a feudal lord who installs a chain across a river that flows through his land
I think you're confused about what rent seeking is. The feudal lord in this example installs a chain across a river. He stops people using the river who could have done free otherwise. That's the essential bit that makes it rent seeking.
But Lambda School don't damage anyone's access to education. They add their own product on top and take nothing away. They don't stop anyone from using using any other resource. It's a net benefit to society. Even if you think it's a useless course, it's a net zero to society in that case, which isn't something to get annoyed about as long as they're minding their own business.
> I am not interested in paying money, or promising away future money, or getting less than a $15/hr wage, for the privilege of regurgitating material to my fellow students.
Well... then don't! Nobody's making you, or even suggesting you do.
> Why do you defend these practices so ardently?
Always good to step in to defend someone who's being subjected to an unjust attack!
Lambda damages the folks that they sucker into being students. Since they have a non-zero number of students, there are some folks who have been damaged. [0] is a writeup of some of their stories.
Lambda is not a net benefit to society. Even if such utilitarian thinking were valid, then no, by the broken window fallacy [1], Lambda is still slurping time out of the hands of folks who could have spent it on other things.
Finally, while I'm loathe to call you a liar, you claim that you got your CS education for free. Does that include your PhD [2] and associated academic career? Congratulations if so, but it is not the typical experience of PhD candidates to get their education for free.
[0] https://www.theverge.com/2020/2/11/21131848/lambda-school-co...
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parable_of_the_broken_window
Not sure why you're repeating what I just plainly said like it's some kind of gotcha you've dug up... yeah I think they're unjust that's why I mentioned it.
> Feel free to bring evidence to this discussion
I don't really understand which point you want evidence of? Do you want evidence that they're an educational provider? Or did you want evidence of what rent seeking means if you're still confused about that? Or evidence that Lambda School isn't forcing anyone to do anything and isn't taking away access to free education?
You're making up a lot of arguments that I didn't say - like that you can't get an education for free, or that they want you to work for free. Sorry I can't give any evidence for those because I don't think them!
> Does that include your PhD [2] and associated academic career?
Yes. That's typical.
> it is not the typical experience of PhD candidates to get their education for free.
Really not sure what you're talking about here - almost nobody pays for their PhD education in a STEM field. In fact you typically get paid to do it. That's not just special scholarships it's just the way it works. I don't know how you think a STEM PhD works?
I know people burned by bootcamps in the sense that they should have been told up front that they didn't have a strong enough foundation for the bootcamp to be worthwhile. This was before the days of salary reimbursements, so they just paid outright (installment plans). I also know people who had their instructors go missing for weeks of the program replaced by unqualified recent grads. Finally every bootcamp lies about their placement rates it seems.
All that being said I work with a few bootcamp grads and they are very talented and productive developers.