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Comment by kkdaemas | Hacker News Reader

> Wouldn't car dealers raise their prices some value up to $1k because they know anyone coming in that month to buy a car also just received a $1k check from the government?

There is still competition between car dealers, so I doubt this would happen.

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It would absolutely happen. When I was in the military, the town I lived in had to pass laws preventing landlords from changing your rent based on your rank because everyone's pay information was public. It's naive to think dealerships would try to undercut each other instead of colluding to all get more money.

Charging rent based on rank would be a form of discrimination... also this is anti-competitive behavior. It is pretty well understood that regulation should exist. It is just a question of how much and how to regulate.

In America, this is the problem that has to be addressed before we can consider rolling out projects like UBI. I agree with you that regulations have to exist for this to work, and we simply don't have the regulations in place right now to enable it widely.

I was suggesting that regulations have to exist in general. Over the entire market. But what you said just flat out confuses me. That we shouldn't implement something because we currently don't have regulations for it? Why would we? We haven't implemented it. I mean with that kind of attitude we can't get anything done.

Do I expect hiccups and bumps in the road? Yeah, why wouldn't I? Humans aren't perfect. Never have been, never will be. But just because there are speedbumps in my neighborhood doesn't mean I should never go to the store. I still need to eat at the end of the day.

> That we shouldn't implement something because we currently don't have regulations for it? Why would we? We haven't implemented it. I mean with that kind of attitude we can't get anything done.

I think before implementing UBI, we have to address the broader issue of anticompetitive behavior in American business, due largely to decades of ill-advised deregulation, coupled with regulatory bodies who refuse to prevent anticompetitive mergers. Once we have undone the damage of deregulation, then I believe it's prudent to start putting UBI proposals on the table, but not before. Otherwise we risk making the situation worse for consumers and better for rent seekers.

I mentioned something similar in another comment. But I'm confused why everything is becoming an "or" conversation. We're a pretty rich nation, we can have more than one cake. There's lots of talk about regulation, we don't have to focus on only one topic at a time.

I agree with you generally, but believe this is a case where the two events have to occur one after the other.

Putting UBI on the table today without already having a reformed regulatory framework in place from day one will result in a failed project, IMO. Opponents of UBI will use this to say that UBI is broken, instead of pointing to the real problem, that regulation is broken.

Colluding to prevent competition is and should be illegal in a market economy. We can't say we can't implement a viable and beneficial social policy because people will break the law. We should enact the policy and ensure the culture, norms and laws are in place to make it effective.

I disagree. Policy should be pragmatic. As an extreme example, self driving cars shouldn't ignore the possibility of jaywalking.

I don't think there would be this sudden collusion at such a large scale though. Would be pretty obvious and begging for a crackdown IMO.

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