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> We have a planet that is in dire need of this kind of motivated action, and yet Elon would rather be distracted by this dream.

What? You see a motivated person with the resources and drive to pursue his dream and you're upset that he's not putting his vision aside to pursue what you think is important? Musk doesn't owe you anything.

The person who is doing this is also very concerned with the state of affairs on Earth.

He owns SolarCity, a solar panel company, Tesla, an electric car and battery company, and Boring Company, an attempt at creating a transportation system that mandates the use of EV.

The fact that all of this technology will benefit human existence on Mars should go ahead and show you how developing technology in order to survive a situation far more dire than Earth's, in a sustainable way, might also help us better survive our situation on Earth.

That's a fair point, and I'm not trying to say everything Elon is doing is bad or wrong. I wish his other projects got even a fraction of the attention his space project gets.

Tesla?

Ok fair... it's not about attention of other projects, and I shouldn't have said that.

I'm just reacting strongly to this Mars madness. That is all.

Defending this project by saying its leader is also compassionate toward other goals isn't compelling to me.

Why are you reacting strongly to the topic of Mars or maybe Musk in general? Fixing Earth and going to Mars are not mutually exclusive and beside that there are a lot of billionaires doing far less useful things for humanity. Complaining that they could do something more useful would be more understandable, imo.

That line of thinking is next to insane. You should be happy he is not somewhere on the yaht drinking $20K whine every night.

That can be said about anything - why do you buy board games or watch sport events every night or learn to play piano - you should be saving the planet ffs...

I do worry about the mass lack of action due to social distractions...

But this is larger, as it seems to imply an escape from the problems of the Earth in a new world. A dream that will never become a reality.

Either we fix the Earth or we parish. There is no salvation in the stars, and no second coming of Christ.

The technology developed for Mars will improve life on Earth, in ways we can't even imagine.

Human effort isn't completely fungible. There is no guarantee that all of the people working incredibly hard at SpaceX would switch to work on whatever problem you want them to.

It's sad that you frame this as "whatever problem you want them to work on". As is there should be any doubt.

It's sad that you think your priorities should be everyones' priorities. Find like-minded people and get to work. But what people get inspired of is none of your business to judge.

I feel perfectly entitled to judge those who spend their days dreaming of Mars as a solution to their problems.

I will not support such efforts, and I feel quite comfortable being a detractor as well.

Who are you to tell me what to judge?! This argument gets you nowhere with me.

They aren't dreaming of Mars as a solution to their problems.

They dream of Mars as it is exciting and will lead to new knowledge, understanding, and meaning.

>If we as humans can't live on Earth responsibly, we frankly don't deserve to exist at all.

We did for a long time though, except for relatively recently. And Mars won't be able to live without Earth for a long time so it isn't really escapism as you paint it.

I don't think we deserve to disappear completely, but if we don't reverse climate change, we'll have a ton of loss of life but not likely total extinction except for some astronauts. That's probably "enough" as far as galactic justice goes. I'm always a little disappointed in this argument though because it's climate change that we should be judged by, rather than massive deaths from human made conflicts throughout history. Surely there's lots of previous events that qualify for "we don't deserve to exist at all".

Do we need another eccentric billionaire but for climate change though? Sure, bring it on.

Instead of being fatalistic and bemoaning the problem, you'll find yourself in a better mental space if you just apply yourself to solving it. Yes, you will only start with small steps, and yes, that will be a great risk, but in the end it the only chance we have of making things work.

I do not follow your argument, and I don't appreciate your appeal to my mental state.

I'm making a dramatic argument against large scale efforts to inhabit other planets, while ours is in a dire state.

Fixing climate change is a political problem first of all. A very different set of talents is needed here.

You'll have to convince or force people to change their priorities. First is probably not possible, due to the slow moving nature of the threat, second has its own drawbacks as well.

> As a friend of mine once said: "progress when you're going the wrong direction, is turning around".

I disagree strongly.

Progress in the wrong direction still teaches you things, and it means you're moving and you've overcome the inertia of doing nothing, which is half the battle.

Failure isn't trying and not reaching your goal. Failure is never trying.

By that definition, Hitler was pretty successful.

Yes, learn from your mistakes. No, don't actively go in the wrong direction.

Well, yes, Hitler was pretty successful at what he was trying to do.

Now you're talking about if you need to consider any moral implications of the activity you're undertaking, which is a whole different discussion.

No, my entire point is about morals!

The discussion started out as "is it better to do something, or do nothing at all", which is outside of morals, but more about motivation and actually doing something.

Obviously if it's a horrible moral choice (i.e. Hitler) then sure, it's best if nothing is done.

In the very vast majority of cases ( build a better car, spaceship, software, grow better food, get fitter, learn a new language, help our community, be a better friend, etc. etc.), then doing something is much, much preferable to not even trying.

The topic of better vs worse, or good vs evil is the very basis of morality.

"Morality (noun): principles concerning the distinction between right and wrong or good and bad behavior."

I encourage you to think more deeply about your argument. I struggle to agree that the "very vast majority of cases" are positive.

It sounds to me like you are sensitive to apathy and/or nihilism. I can understand that, especially these days, but just because it feels like nothing is being done doesn't mean things can't get worse.

Sorry, I'm a bit of a cynic these days.

sigh...

there are plenty of reasons humanity should be multi-planetary other than escaping climate change.

Feel free to elaborate.

I suspect any reasons you'll come up with are all still less urgent than the needs of our Earth.

I've heard the argument about learning to control the climate through taraforming (or whatever you want to call it), but I'm completely unconvinced that is an efficient method.

I'd be willing to be convinced otherwise, but I'm very skeptical.

Once even a minuscule fraction of the resources of the Solar System become available you can solve all terrestrial problems once and for all.

Space & Solar System is big and has a lot of resources, much much more than what is available in on a terrestrial planet.

There are multiple catastrophic events that could end civilized human life on Earth that we have 0 control over.

Asteroids, supervolcanoes etc.