BMW’s new flat logo is everything that’s wrong with modern logo design | Hacker News Reader

BMW’s new flat logo is everything that’s wrong with modern logo design

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239 pointsTomte185 comments

BMW builds _cars_, not Apps. They pride themselves in craftsmanship. The Logo badge on the actual car is a three dimensional, physical thing.

Instead of embracing that, they made it flat like an App icon. It will look shit on cars and it does not communicate that BMW builds _real machines_.

Everybody is going crazy about going digital and they forget what they are good at and what the customer likes them for.

Looks shit on paper too. Like someone forgot to turn a layer back on before merging in illustrator.

It needs that black ring. Would be fine if they brought it back

Cars are becoming more like apps in the future. It makes sense to me. I like the new logo.

Additionally it isn't well composed. I learned graphics design from a guy who actually learned it by using his hands to pit down the letters. He had us move one black square around on a white page for 3 hours and explain why we put it where we did. Then we were allowed two squares of arbitrary size, later colors etc.

If you are learning it from that basic level you cannot unsee badly unbalanced design. You cannot just remove a black background with a white one and keep everything unchanged (which is why dark themes sometimes suck as they don't get the extra love they need.

This thing looks like it has been made by the CEOs daugther in Powerpoint.

> This thing looks like it has been made by the CEOs daugther in Powerpoint.

I love this. I know only a bit about graphic design, but this new logo just looks...cheap. My first thought was a high school student made it with whatever free software he could find while he was bored during class, and gave up after 30 minutes because class was over.

I'm not a big fan of the new flat VW logo either, although it's much better than this.

https://www.motor1.com/news/369756/volkswagen-new-logo-unvei...

Okay, help someone who never learned anything about graphic design from anyone. why isn't it well composed?

Compare the lettering on the two versions. The use of 3D-ish black and fake embossing on the original makes the letters pop.

The lack of both on the new version makes the letters look like they've been crammed into a tiny space at the top of a big empty ring.

This might have worked with new lettering with different proportions. But it's literally just a flat copy of the original letter shapes, without any of the original context.

The 3D effect on the original print/blueprint/engineering marker/quadrant feels dynamic. The impression changes as you move your eye over it. It conveys movement and substance. It works with the black to suggest a car tire, but also a sophisticated (black...) crafted object.

The new version looks like a printer reference mark. It's just... there. It doesn't do anything.

The grey is meaningless and neutral. Again, it's just there. It fills a space, and that's all. The transparent version doesn't even do that. There's literally nothing there.

Removing the 3D creates a uniform space inside the ring, which is why the letters now look as if they're squashed up at the top for no reason. There's poor alignment, and no metaphorical or literal highlight.

Overall it suggests that management don't care about engineering or about appearances.

Hate to break it to you, but all these "problems" with the logo were exactly the same in the old logo. You got distracted by the ham-fisted layer styles and fooled into thinking that made it good.

The fact that you said "makes the letters pop" would send shivers down any designer's spine.

Having the text as negative space on dark is still perceptually different to having it on a transparent background (which is perceived as negative space). This is enough to make it feel unbalanced.

See here: https://i.imgur.com/uW4TGX2.png

Thank You! This is enough to illustrate the problem. It would have been fine if they had kept the black as background colour.

Purely subjective. I personally see no difference in the balance, and either way, "balanced" doesn't mean correct.

> The new version looks like a printer reference mark. It's just... there. It doesn't do anything.

To me, it looks like the mark on a crash test dummy.

Yes, I knew it reminded me of something - that's it!

> print/blueprint/engineering marker/quadrant

I believe the logo was originally intended to represent a propeller.

Yes! It’s a propeller against a blue sky.

BMW has refuted this idea.

https://www.logodesignlove.com/bmw-logo-evolution

I am quite sure it is just one square of the traditional white and blue bavarian checkers pattern, with Bavaria coincidentally standing for the "B" in BMW

Well, since you ask...keep in mind that these are only my opinions:

1. Lack of depth...yes, depth can be introduced in any 2D/flat design utilizing color and space illusions

2. The curve/arch that the letters follow is not fully concentric to the center circle

3. The letters appear to be transformed vertically to make their height such that it fits between the outer circle and the inner circle...this in-turn throws of the original aspect ratio of each letter of the given font

Minor inconsistencies as such are aggravating for graphic designers who generally tend to be OCD. I hope this helps.

There's no accounting for taste. This isn't the sort of thing you can really quantify, and if you do you'll lock yourself into a way of viewing things that prevents you from being a good designer. Design is mostly trying 100 things and picking the good one because you have taste, which is a thing you get through years of study, practice, and reminding yourself that you're a worthless hack at 4am in the morning.

Anyway as someone who's spent the requisite sleepless nights I've been granted the power of justifying my taste. It's not the same as "why" because the understanding comes from a felt sense, and then I just make up some bullshit to explain it.

In this case the design isn't well composed because the removal of the background has left the logo un-grounded. The outer ring is now dominated by the letters B M W, making the design top heavy. Also worth noting is that the letters themselves are no longer balanced. The M and W are no longer the full cap-height in the center, which further unbalances the design by making it lighter to the right. The "simplicity" reduces legibility. The design is now dependent on the color of the background rather than working anywhere. Though I can't imagine a color upon which this logo would work better than the previous one. There's also an unpleasant visual ringing that occurs at hard edged transitions like the center of the checkerboard which was previously mitigated by the dividing lines.

IMO, it's because the black of the original logo takes up space, and keeps the BMW text and the inner circle grounded to a larger context.

Without the black, the text and the circle are just hanging out at the top of the outer circle, unbalanced against a large empty space at the bottom of the outer circle.

EDIT: Another way of putting it is that it looks like the text and inner circle could just bounce around inside the outer circle—they are "loose", and, as I said above, ungrounded.

Exactly right – see here: https://i.imgur.com/uW4TGX2.png

I cannot shake the feeling that the inner emblem should be moved down just a tiny bit. Visual subjective balance is not the same as geometric balance. It just looks visually skewed in the vertical dimension.

What a poor result.

I made a flat version that keeps the black ring and put them side to side. Check this out and you might immidiately see the issue: https://i.imgur.com/uW4TGX2.png

The white letters without background are perceived to be placed in space – you don't see the ring so you assume it is empty. The bavarian checkers in the middle seem to float in midair with letters crammed in above it. And this combination of floating and cramming makes it look bad.

With a dark ring this works much better, because the floating part is removed and the letters are on the ring instead of in it.

Probably one of those cases where the designer creates something great and then when the customer views it they start “I like it but we want something more modern like those buttons on your phone, how do you call them? Apps right? What if we remove this and this and make these a bit larger”

Fake shadows and fake light is not good craftsmanship. It makes sense for a logo on a flat piece of paper to look flat and look beveled and shadowed on a badge.

This evolution of the logo is bad, but not because it's flat.

yeah, they could have easily made the existing design flat[ter] but left the rest intact. the new look looks very cheap, but i bet they paid $200k for the redesign.

Only $200k? I'd guess at least double that. If an iconic logo is being revamped for the first time in decades, getting it right would be worth at least a million. Sadly, paying a lot doesn't guarantee a good result...

From reading about these redesigns in the past it sounds like most of that money goes to surveying and considering all of the places a logo is used; letterheads, physically on the cars, web graphics, sides of buildings, making sure it doesn't conflict in other markets, etc. Sure, Nike paid $35 to the designer of their logo, but that didn't include any of those things above or pay for all of the rejected designs.

Like you're saying, the client very well might be requesting and choose a design that looks like it was made by an amateur.

Remember the London Olympics logo? Something like $700k.

I had to look that up, that is awesome!

Thats... almost exactly what they did though.

No. They boffed it with that transparent background, and the letters scrunched up against the circle.

Envision a black ring instead of black, no white border, and the letters B M W in a tighter, more modern sans serif. That could have been slick.

>Everybody is going crazy about going digital...

This Logo design change is so out of left field too, since the craze about "going digital" feels almost a decade old at this point.

Flat, simple logo design has nothing to do with "going digital" - all the gradients and chrome shit layered on top of the existing logo are far more "digital" than anything that came before or after.

> BMW builds _cars_, not Apps. They pride themselves in craftsmanship

Do they? You're commenting on a thread about their logo change which suggests they don't.

BMW has for very long time been primarily a brand. Take away the brand and they simply wouldn't compete in the market. They build real machines, but not very good ones. Look at Honda if you want an example of a company that is about the machines.

Very debatable. Depends on the model. That may be true for the X models, but if you want that is real wheel drive, practical and fun around corners, you don't have many options.

It's worth saying that due to taxing in USA they are a worse deal than in Europe.

How many BMW drivers care about rear wheel drive? That is a very small niche. People who really want those features would go for one of the more practical sports cars.

This probably varies a lot per region, here in Europe BMWs are a pretty affordable when compared to other real wheel drive cars.

As I said in another comment imported American cars aren't a good deal in Europe. Japanese are a good deal too, but there aren't really many options that are sporty AND practical.

On the other hand most other goods are much cheaper in the US than in Europe and also US consumers also have more disposable income than Europeans making the price difference of a BMW negligible.

And anyway, complaining that some luxury cars are a bit more expensive somewhere is a first world problem most people aren't lucky enough to have.

My point wasn't about purchasing power in general but about BMWs in particular (European cars actually) being a better deal in Europe than in USA. The same way American cars are a much better deal in USA: A BMW 230i with M package is about 13200 USD than a mustang fastback with the 2.3 engine according to BMW and Ford websites using a sillicon valley zip code. My BMW 230i was around 2000EUR (2250 USD) cheaper than the mustang in Spain, and I added around 2k€ worth of extras (not including the m package which I was already counting).

Regarding the cost of the goods, cars in particular are still cheaper in USA (even European ones). Most American states will have cheaper taxes than most European countries.

Regarding the rest of the goods, I don't know America nearly enough to have a strong opinion, but checking median salaries by state and median salaries by country in the European union I'm quite skeptical to believe most goods are actually cheaper.

Regarding the purchasing power I don't know either.

Current and potential customers of BMW know what they build.

Don't know if a 3D logo works as a reminder of what BMW does.

I will hate a 3D logo in a company like SpaceX

That's the thing. BMW is recognized as building cars, or as you say _real machines_.

Instead BMW tries to transform its business to provide mobility. Its a service provider and the service is mobility. It is not the cars. The cars are the vehicle to provide mobility, one form of mobility.

BMW has several brands to communicate this mobility, which are ShareNOW, FreeNOW, and ReachNOW. ShareNow is what used to be DriveNow, which is the free floating carsharing. FreeNOW is the Uber-like Taxi-App. ReachNow is the Google/Apple Maps which includes public transport, Carsharing, Taxi, eScooter Rental, Bike Rental so that you can reach your desired destination the most efficient way.

This is every car manufacturer. They’re either making these investments, or resigned to their own demise.

> They pride themselves in craftsmanship.

Used to. These days, not so much. And they're misfiring quite a bit. For example, the new X3 xDrive30e gets a measly 18 miles of electric range (EPA; real-world likely less). All of that added complexity and weight for very little benefit (in 2020 -- 10 years ago it would have been alright). No 3er manuals in the US anymore. Have you seen the rear of the new 3er which looks like Lexus IS? Have you seen what the 5er looks like, heck even in M5 guise? And so on, and so on.

Sry, I used to be a BMW guy and that touched (touches?) a nerve. They had the right formula when the i3 originally came out, and then someone at the top decided to effectively kill the program and most of their top EV engineers left. They would have been way ahead of where they are today, and of most of their competition, had they not intentionally shot themselves in the foot.

With that logo, it's a done deal, I'll never buy their product again. BMW was something you could identify with.

You are conflating design decisions with craftsmanship.

I would argue that they still pride themselves in the execution of the designs, even if you (and I) disagree with some of the design direction.

Anecdotally I've known 5 BMW owners, one was an older car (early 2000's), the rest made after 2010. The older one wrecked unfortunately, and all but one of the rest had mechanical failures.

Statistically they may not be any better or worse than any other manufacturer, but I still can't convince myself that their craftsmanship is any better. The koreans pride themselves in their craftsmanship too, and their cars are a third of the price.

Anecdotal too but the only car that has left me stranded ever was a bmw.

I love the older bmws for the driving experience but they require so much more maintenance than say a Lexus. The newer bmws meanwhile seem to be geared much more to the luxury market than driving enthusiasts (eg very few manual choices).

Lexus has a good rep for being super solid and reliable. Always has been. But why shouldn't be, it's a Toyota.

Ironically the least solid, least reliable car I have ever owned was a Toyota. After 8 years it was very poor. Other, older, cars I have enjoyed more reliability with have included a Honda, a Kia, a Fiat and a Lada.

(more anecdote) I've known a few people with corollas and drove them for a long time. All of them have been in pretty bad shape after a while. Engines running rough, lots of physical damage, struts and springs busted, little bits and pieces missing / not working etc. In fact all of them were pretty scary to drive and ride in.

In general they were all beaters that barely ran, but they ran. One corolla went for 2 or 3 years without an oil change and had 2 cylinders with low compression. Friend never got it fixed, but the car was still running (although with very low power). I actually think the general reliability of these cars leads to them being in worse shape. They're running so why bother to fix it. The owners also had a drive it until it dies approach, just generally took a long time to die.

> I would argue that they still pride themselves in the execution of the designs,

Employees maybe but the company strives to be a mobility service provider nowadays.

It obviously touches a nerve, because the "craftsmanship" mentioned is about making physical objects, not someone trying to claim they make the best automobiles in the world.

> They had the right formula when the i3 originally came out

An overpriced design study with huge panel gaps everywhere?

The e32, e34, e38 and e39 series are iconic and really good cars.

Just like MB's w123 and w124 series.

Today, not so much.

Surprised you didn't mention the e36. The car modding enthusiast community loves the e36.

I forgot it. Also a prime example. Thanks for adding it

Commenters are saying BMW has stated clearly they will not use the new logo on their products (cars).

Everybody here is tripping for no reason.

They showed the flat logo as a badge on their new concept car, right when they announced it. Maybe they are backtracking now, but it seems pretty clear their original intent was to put it on the cars.

They said it during the launch of the new logo: https://www.press.bmwgroup.com/global/article/detail/T030630...

> They pride themselves in craftsmanship.

Designing a good logo is also craftsmanship.

Here in New Zealand all the new Ford & Mazda trucks have the logo's painted black now so you can barely see it. Especially cause everyone buys matt black trucks.

Not a bad thing. The trend to put a brand logo on literally everything started probably with cars and it is beginning to irritate me more and more. Why would I want to tell world what the brand, type, etc of my car is? Surely that is something that only interests me, the person driving it?

I understand that there are people who want to impress others with their stuff, but if slapping a logo on it is what makes the car impressive... then the car is not impressive at all.

Through the ‘90’s BMWs were well thought out and made. Some time in the ‘00’s that changed.

This article is just a guy whining about how he personally doesn't like a logo. This logo is just fine, and it's certainly better than the old one that tried to look like it was made of physical material. Obviously the logos that are applied to the cars will look metallic because, well, they will be made of metal. This is a better logo in general, especially for print and online purposes. No excessive fake gradients and material renders, simpler lines and colors that will reduce well, and it goes back to the original state of their logo before they piled a bunch of fake chrome on it in the last couple decades.

Even in apps you could argue if flat design is the best way to go. Since Google maps changed their icon I have a hard time finding it instantly between the dozen other flat app logos on my screen.

I despise the new Maps icon.

> Sure, it looks nice on BMW’s bronze-hued electric i4 sedan concept, but what about on a white BMW? Or a letterhead? Or on a sign for a BMW dealership on a highway?

Is the author really concerned that BMW's design team didn't think about how this logo would be used in such fundamental ways? I can guarantee you that they did.

You can personally like or not like it, fine. But if you're going to write a judgey article about it, at least take some basic steps to try to understand why the choices were made. Companies don't just have some intern change their logo up for no reason at all.

And that headline is obnoxious.

Basic steps such as? There is not much available about it.

Also, you think too highly of corporations. Companies literally have an intern change their logo for no reason, i’ve been that intern. There are dozens of levels of people more worried about saving face than anything else.

As an intern you changed the logo for a company with a public-facing brand with the same value and visibility as BMW's? For no reason and with no other oversight?

Basic steps such as reaching out to some people at BMW and asking them about it. Talking to other people who do similar sorts of design work and try to understand why choices would've been made. Ask someone who might actually know the specific constraints involved in this kind of design work and ask them to weigh in.

This article is just whining about something the author doesn't like. Which, it's fine not to like something. But not everything is designed for your eyes and your personal tastes only. So a design journalist should hold themselves to a higher standard and attempt to understand and illuminate rather than just point and sneer. (Which, I know: This article is just click-bait and not intended to be anything more than that. In which case: Why is it on Hacker News?)

Who hurt you?

> Companies don't just have some intern change their logo up for no reason at all.

Companies redesign their brand (websites, logos, etc.) all the time and it often correlates with a new hire who wants a "fresh start" with the brand.

Jens Thiemer who is the SVP of Customer and Brand and spearheaded this effort has been at BMW a little over 1 year.

It's a way of staking your claim at a company and putting your literal mark on a project. Unfortunately, it's not always the best move.

I help VPs of Marketing redesign brands and more often than not, about 6-12 months into their new gig I get a call.

Just out of interest are you a freelancer?

I've freelanced and run a digital agency

The new guy can suggest a rebranding, but I'm sure the CEO and board will have something to say about it/final approval.

Sure, but if a VP goes all out on a push to rebrand and is rebuffed they'll probably leave. Basically, the pitch is "you hired me to improve the brand and that means improving our logo".

So CEOs and the board might not push back as hard as you'd imagine, especially if they don't come from a product/design/brand background.

I wonder if he will get fired for this?

These story makes me appreciate Steve Jobs even more.

> It's a way of staking your claim at a company and putting your literal mark on a project.

Much like the dog puts his mark on your new tires. And for the same reason.

Other teams of highly recognized brands have messes up before: https://money.cnn.com/2010/10/08/news/companies/gap_logo/ind...

Butthurt much aren't you? It takes a quick look at the logos compared to see that it looks like shit, no contrast. You just do not see it. I was sceptical about the headline as well but if you just have to lie to yourself the go ahead.

I'm no designer.. but the new logo looks horrendous. From the few design principles I do know, it appears they took all of them and did the exact opposite. If they wanted to stick with flat design, they could have easily repurposed their existing logo without beveling/lighting to achieve what would likely be a much better result.

Their old old logo was literally their old one without the bad 3D effect. Everything old is new again. Except this weird monstrosity.

New Coke https://www.everything80spodcast.com/new-coke/

An awful lot of flat logos and interfaces these days look like things that would have gotten you a "oh, did you, the design-challenged developer, design this? That's OK for now but we'll get a real designer on it before it goes to production" a decade or two ago. Stuff I'd be embarrassed to show anyone because they look like crap (but are within my limited design abilities!) but I guess they're fine because a "designer" did it.

OTOH it's the easiest it's been since the late 90s to make a webpage or program look "professionally designed" if you don't mind the current terrible aesthetic, so there's that.

According to BMW[1], it looks like this is only designed for brand communication. I wouldn't expect to see this pushed to non-concept cars, at least not for a long time.

[1] https://www.bmw.com/content/dam/bmw/marketBMWCOM/bmw_com/cat... from here: https://www.bmw.com/en/automotive-life/bmw-logo-meaning-hist...

Those article quotas aren't going to reach themselves...

The new logo looks more top heavy somehow. When there was a dark ring the logo looked balanced, now it looks like the center of gravity is off and the logo wouldn’t stay upright if placed on a table.

Interesting, that was exactly my reaction to it. It's unbalanced in a way the old one wasn't.

Offcenter like a football club badge

My take on this is the airplane propellers in the center--that's what the white and blue signifies, for those who don't know--draw your eye toward the center-point of the logo, but the "BMW" draws your eye back up, causing a sort of "oscillation." If they insist on this design then eliminating the outer ring would likely cause a more balanced reaction.

The white & blue checkering is actually a nod to the Bavarian colors/flag. The propeller metaphor came later.

https://www.bmw.com/en/automotive-life/bmw-logo-meaning-hist...

Yeah, should have removed the letters too.

It's occurred to me for some time now that design has suffered from globalization in that while surely there is some good in the more rapid exchange of ideas, there has also been this hyper convergence in design where it all just kind of looks the same. Consider that in this particular domain, automobiles, you used to be able to clearly delineate design along national lines. There was a clear distinction in Italian design vs American, German, British, Swedish etc. But now?

The thing that bothers me the most about this minimalist trend is how pervasive it is. I quite like minimalism myself, but I feel like 40 years ago even within minimalism you would have expected to see some difference in execution across the globe.

Which brings me to how trendy the design field is in general. I don't think I've seen a field so uniformly go from one trend to the other and then defend it with such dogged bullshit. Who in God's name is fooled by the poetry? You're using the same design language and aesthetic as everyone else, the only thing creative is the nonsense you're writing to defend it. Why is a field full of 'creatives' so uniform in thought and expression? How many trends have we witnessed so far in web/graphic design? We've built all these powerful creative tools just so they can end up all making logos that look exactly the fucking same. Surely machine learning models can create a good percentage of the design we see today.

What the hell... Yeah its flat but that's obviously not the problem, why would you eliminate the color black from your very famous blue black and white logo.

Yeah, that's the main problem. They got rid of black color ring surrounding the blue rotating propellers. That killed the logo.

It's actually a stylized Bavarian flag, the propeller story is a myth

huh, TIL

“Then, in 1942, BMW itself linked the propeller to its company symbol” [0]

[0] https://www.bmw.com/en/automotive-life/bmw-logo-meaning-hist...

That article clearly says the propeller thing is a myth, and that BMW just did that once for a fun advertisement.

The Bavarian flag is white-blue, BMW is blue-white ;)

I agree. It seems like the obvious solution would have been to just remove the light gradient—and maybe the bevels.

Maybe they should have gone with a slight tweak of the 1963 version https://cdn.bmwblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/03/BMW_logo_... and scored retro-nostalgia points with the older crowd, too.

Yikes. Putting it on the same page as the past logos just emphasizes how chintzy it looks.

I wonder why they didn't just revert to the 1963 logo. A lot of mid-century logo designs seem to actually express the flat minimalism that is currently fashionable.

It looks as though the designers wanted to be bold and drop the “BMW” text but were overruled.

As a designer, I think this theory is reasonable.

I don't understand why people spend a bajillion dollars on a logo re-do. My first company did it and it was generic, shitty, and did us no good (Electric Imp). We had a wonderful little imp, we called him the imp dude or similar:

https://cdn.instructables.com/F31/9EZA/HJKC29JK/F319EZAHJKC2...

Captured the brand, such as it was, perfectly. A small hacker company started by a man that had hacking coded into his DNA. The founder had started out phreaking at somewhere around age 8. He made a cool bit of money as a teen by custom-programming firmware for lasertag guns and upgrading guns around his hometown. The company was started because he was annoyed at how hard it was to simply get an IFFT style IOT light set up in his bathroom, securely. And so the logo: a cocky little imp creature, imo agendered, with a plug pitchfork and a goofy (optional, not always displayed) tail. Our costume-crazed QA guy even threw together a cardboard and paper-mache version of it for a halloween party once. Possible, because it was a character. It could be anthropomorphized. It represented the company identity.

Then we paid, I don't even know how much, but it didn't matter in the end anyway, for this:

https://3psnnz1ja4lg3qllb62xd6yg-wpengine.netdna-ssl.com/wp-...

It was supposed to be simple, I guess, and the little line was supposed to represent I guess a single connection on a silicone board? But what is that? What does it mean, what does it represent? How can we form an identity around that, how could it have represented us? We got rid of Imp Dude for no reason. Stupid.

Usually I think these "modern design" complaints are whiny, but man that new BMW logo looks so flat and lifeless. It needs something to make it pop. Also the lack of outline and white lettering seem a hassle to use on anything.

I always thought the Red Hat breakdown of what/why changes of their logo was really well done:

https://www.redhat.com/en/about/brand/new-brand

https://www.redhat.com/en/about/brand/new-brand/details

that was a fantastic reading, and it makes way more sense than most re-branding discussions I've seen.

My favorite observation on the changing of corporate logos: https://flowingdata.com/2009/08/13/pepsi-and-coca-cola-logo-...

The 1973 Pepsi colors are really similar to the BMW Motorsport ("M") color scheme, with a light blue, dark blue/purple, and red.

https://www.schemecolor.com/bmw-m.php

Related to Pepsi, have you seen their 2008 rebranding document?

https://www.goldennumber.net/wp-content/uploads/pepsi-arnell...

I'm still not convinced it isn't satire as it has some truly breathtaking BS. Some quick highlights:

The new logo incorporates 5000 years of design (including Vastu Sastra, Golden Ratio, Feng Shui, Vitruvian Principle, and the Mobius Strip)

The Pepsi Ratio is created by two simple circles, that are in a set ratio to each other: The Golden Ratio. The Pepsi Ratio is aesthetic geometry.

Incorporates "The Earth’s Geodynamo" and "Magnetic Dynamics" to create the "The Pepsi Globe Dynamics"

Edit: A few articles about it still exist: https://www.cbsnews.com/news/pepsis-nonsensical-logo-redesig... https://gawker.com/5150582/breathtaking-document-reveals-pep... https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/howaboutthat/459...

Glad it hasn't completely disappeared yet.

Pepsi is such an archetype of the eternal identity crisis it's almost a classic identity in itself. On a shitty day, I buy Pepsi.

They should just make "Is Pepsi OK?" their new slogan and be done with it.

The flat aesthetic: making the world uglier one icon at a time.

This has absolutely nothing to do with "flat" design. BMW historically had a flat shaded logo [1]. The current logo is just supposed to be the flat shaded badge that goes on the cars, but rendered as if it's actually being lit.

The problem is just that they removed the black ring that is key to the logo and the brand. Add that back, and it's virtually identical to the logo they had for whole second half of the 20th century.

The removal of the black ring is unequivocally not a consequence of flat design.

[1] https://cdn.bmwblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/https-_s3...

> This has absolutely nothing to do with "flat" design.

I don't know the design history of the logo or the intent of the redesign, but I do know that it fits well into the current "flat" design aesthetic, so I lump it in with that. If it walks like a duck...

From a utilitarian maintenance perspective, I think the open design of it makes it such a pain to keep looking good on a car. All those interior edges inside the logo catch debris and are difficult to clean to the edge of the design elements. I prefer car logos with closed smooth badges.

This is a great point! Bits of fluff from car wash cloths would get caught under all those edges.

> sacrifices the company’s well-known identity

I challenge author, or anyone, to find any person who is unable to correctly attribute new logo to BMW but can do so with the old logo.

The BMW logo is iconic and has become the brand, with that this is what would be classed as a "New Coke" moment.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Coke

The author has a point, but they seem to have missed the fact that BMW already announced that they won't be using it on cars (well, probably other cars than the concept car featured in the article). It is only for marketing material:

https://www.press.bmwgroup.com/global/article/detail/T030630...

> The new logo is a new media branding and will be used in addition to the existing logo. It won’t be use (sic) on the vehicles or in the exterior and interior labeling our dealerships, the existing logo remains in use there.

Putting the "BMW" lettering on whatever color happens to be behind it creates a strenge dependency that didn't exist before. I'd say that part of the criticism is valid. But the rest of the logo adheres to BMW logo heritage, as the article admits. "Flattening" the central part of the logo, meant to evoke a whirling propeller, is an improvement.

My bet is the logo does not make it past concept car use. It has to be terribly finicky to get a logo with so many separate parts right. Or there's a clear plastic part that won't age as well as the metal parts.

Yeah, they'd have to decide which colour of lettering to use with every paint colour. I think you're right that it won't make it to production, at least in its current form.

Not sure about the logo, but I do know this two paragraph “article” is everything that’s wrong with modern journalism.

Aside from being ugly and making no sense at all, the part that gets me about these things is that it wasn't broken.

Seriously, did someone at the top of the organization wake up one day thinking "We are not selling more cars because of our logo"?

Of all the things they could have decided to work on that might actually deliver real value to customers, the logo was deemed to be important?

After owning a number of BMW's we decided we had enough, turned in our last leased car and walked away. They are horribly expensive to maintain and, even if you are willing to do some of it yourself, the parts are just ridiculously expensive.

One of the key decision drivers is that we have a Toyota vehicle with nearly 250K miles on it (400K km). We bought it new and maintained it at about 1/3 of the prescribed maintenance schedule. In other words, oil changes every 10K miles rather than the recommended 3K. The car runs very well, fuel efficiency is still good and it cost us almost nothing to maintain after the warranty ran out. With one of our prior BMW's we had to spend $3K to fix it (I forget what it was) a few months after the warranty expired. I know this is a single data point, and yet, when I talk to long-term (out of warranty) BMW owners it is amazing how often these kinds of sentiments surface.

So, yeah, I don't understand the focus on a logo. A logo isn't going to get my family back into a BMW dealership, ever. You have to question someone's priorities and understanding of their customers when they feel messing with the logo is of actual importance to them at all.

Rebranding is a thing. It allows corporations to get rid of past negative associations with the brand, be more attractive to younger audience by not looking too differently from brands they are exposed to, even just remind everyone they still exist and should be considered as a choice, things like that.

I've never made the association with a crash-test dummy locator marking before, but the abstracted rotor by itself is reminiscent of that for me.

Same here. First thought upon seeing that: crash test dummy.

It’s amazing how companies make such stupid decisions on their branding. The new logo looks terrible.

The old logo was timeless and iconic. It stood for something and that’s what people wanted from BMW. They don’t need to be hip and modern they need to be BMW. Many companies clearly never learned the lessons of “New Coke.” If it ain’t broke don’t fix it!

Typical Germany, copy US fads 5 years later...

I thought the logo was a airplane propeller. Its actually just the bavarvian flag.. (B standing for "Bavaria" a region of Germany, "MW" Motor Werk.

It has evlovlved slightly over the years, but its kinda still the same. If it looks bad with a transparent background they'll fill it in.

Some "historical" BMW logos.

https://www.motor1.com/news/365668/bmw-logo-isnt-propeller/

Ad with the (not) BMW "Propeller Logo"

https://www.autoblog.com/2010/01/10/report-as-it-turns-out-b...

BMW stands for (the literal translation) Bavarian Motor Works. Not surprising they would use that flag in their logo.

Because the text now seems to disappear on the now invisible background, in this photo of their concept car https://cdn.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/m0Mq-L5MSCvGTGjp6huvqX8iVCw=... the logo look like one of those symbols on the heads of crash test dummies to calculate angles and velocities and such. Not something you really want to see in the middle of the steering wheels!

The BMW logo always looked like a wheel to me: a blue-white rim, and a black tire.

Although I would understand if they depict a low-profile tire in their logo, instead removing the tire altogether appears bit off to me.

Hence, it seems like they really found a logo for prototype cars that can't run.

Whenever I see anything from The verge all I can think off is that terrible build your own PC video.

Off topic: The giant double kidney grills on their new models look as horrible as their new logo.

This reminds me of when Instagram moved to their new logo and everyone mocked it for the same reasons. Someone made a parody video implying that some kid hacked it together in a few seconds in Photoshop, but I can't find that video anymore, all the links that point to it are dead and won't come up on web.archive.org. They used this kid though:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xz3PbpPR6DY

Edit: Here's something close, which is someone showing how to make the logo in Photoshop:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LU9zpCZFPJQ

And the Instagram logo is still bland and unmemorable, hard to apply and a target of mockery. It’s just not in the news anymore.

Oh right, I didn't mean to suggest that the criticisms became less valid over time.

BMW is transgressing from the petrol-carbon era and made away with the rubbery oily tire in the emblem. This is in line with the airy designs of their hybrid cars.

The new logo isn't that far from the very earliest. It would have been nice to see it in gold tones though. I think they should have held on to the heraldic feel already present with the checkerboard flag. The global market likes that exotic traditional stuff which is unique to European cars. Volvo for instance are pushing a lot on the Scandinavian heritage (only after they were acquired by the Chinese though) with minimalistic wood designs in the panel and Swedish flags on the seats.

The old logo looks bold, solid and heavy - like a diesel engine, whereas the new one - light, skinny, instant, almost like an electric motor. Not a big fan of it, but thats my impresion after a quick glance.

We definitely need a return to a more baroque design aesthetic. Something 3d and skeuomorphic, like early iOS or windows aero. The current flat design trend is getting so awful

I think a logo should express uniqueness, the soul of a company and their product.

In this particular case, it is the opposite: BMW’s logo change is an unoriginal move to copy the latest trend. Lack of courage and imagination.

I see it often recently that our German companies avoid risks of being pioneers, just copy-paste proven ideas, and act fussily and chaotically when see threats from emerging innovators.

I do a little bit of everything, including design, and what appeals to me about ultra-minimalism is that it takes very little effort or talent. To do it well takes some real creativity, but if you're just jumping on the bandwagon it's very easy to imitate and half the work of a more detailed design. You get to be lazy while acting like you're trendy and cutting-edge.

I'm not convinced it is a "new logo". It appears to be the old logo, with some new styling. To my eyes, a line drawing of the new version would be no different that that of the old one.

As much as I value my design education, stuff like this really rubs me the wrong way. Not the new appearance, but just the idea that this variation counts for even a day's work.

"Graphic design is my passion"

Lots of definitive-sounding opinions from people who clearly don't have design experience. It's fun to be equipped to see through comments that sound good but are total bullshit to someone who knows what they're talking about - I don't often get that on here :)

I wonder how much they spent on this. To me it looks like something you could get for 50 bucks on one of these logo design sites. I don’t understand why companies want to go from very distinct easily recognizable logos to something that looks just like every other logo.

I wonder how long before they change it back or modify it because all the negative press.

I tried to improve it with an enlarged blue/white area and overlaying the transparency over that with black text.

https://imgur.com/a/stGip5E

It looks like a Secchi disk, used for measuring water turbidity and as a fiducial marker.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secchi_disk

The issue with this logo isn’t that it’s flat, it’s that it’s badly proportioned

I really love flat designs and I'm a huge fan of this trend, but this logo looks so awful.

I'm really bad at design and this looks like a sketch made by me when I have an idea and I want it to show it to a designer.

Well, there's a big difference between minimalism and something that just doesn't even remotely looks finished. I'm cringing at the idea of what this "redesign" must have cost ...

This new logo design gives me the same boring vibe as the redesigns of a bunch of fashion brands like Burberry and Céline. It’s monochrome, all looking too similar

I think the point of the design is to make logo harder to see and lose it to the background.

The current trend is to subdue logos or even remove them completely. Younger people in the upper class or upper middle class don't want to advertise products they use or wear. The stronger the brand, more subdued the logo can be.

I suspect that at the some point the design didn't have the letters but they were added in the same white as background as a compromise. In my opinion removing the outer circle and letters and keeping just tiny blue and white Bavarian color roundel would have been even better.

I don't understand the new VW logo, either. What benefit is there to have the characters touch the upper part of the circle, but not the lower part?

I can live with this new badge more easily than I can the new grills/kidneys on the actual cars. BMW's new design atheistic is loosing me.

It looks like a particularly hideous off brand sticker. This trend of making everything look drab and lifeless can't stop soon enough.

I like it.

New logo looks like shit. Being ironed is the least of its problems. What kind of potato-headed executive greenlit this BS?

Probably it's the same exec who decided BMW steering should become numb and lifeless, apparently to remind drivers that BMWs are luxury cars first and fun cars second.

And to anticipate the response, no, this wasn't inevitable as steering became more electrical. At the same time, several other carmakers produced far superior electric steering systems to BMW's (e.g. Audi, Porsche). About 2012 BMW made a design choice to dumb down the steering response of all their cars, IMO thereby dissing BMW's very identity as the ultimate driver's car. Now I'm not sure they'll ever be able to reclaim those 60+ years of proud history they so cluelessly dismissed.

As a car guy, I increasingly view BMW as I view Maserati - A car that is leased by people that want to display a certain level of wealth. BMW's decreasing reliability reputation backs up that thinking, along with the changes you mention.

Looks like one of those in-house localizer patterns you put on your walls when creating a digital model of your place.

I like BMW, but I’ve always hated their logo. It’s ugly and looks terrible on a car. This new logo is even worse.

better article showing logo changes throughout the last century+ [0]

[0] - https://www.thedrive.com/news/32440/bmw-starts-the-decade-wi...

at least it's not "Neomorphism" or whatever you call that braindead trend

Why would they replace their logo after more than one hundred years? It was iconic.

Change the colour to red and we're getting close to the Umbrella Corp logo.

I really want that space at the bottom half of the circle gone.

So they are trashing their logo in the same way Instagram did

I can picture the designer patting himself on the back for “fixing” the alignment of the B and W axis to the center of the circle... when optical alignment as seen in the original is the actual hard task.

Meh. The new logo looks like it was made to go on toys.

Reminds me of BMW's nonsensical cup holders

Design by committee... Never works.

I wonder if there's any similarity at all between the way they designed this logo and the way they design their cars?

That’s pretty terrible :/

I like it

fuckin tramp stamp

Change for the sake of change is how good apps and brands are ruined.

>Jens Thiemer, senior vice president of customer and brand, says it was designed to “radiate more openness and clarity"

Clearly a decision made by a non-technical person thinking with his heart and not his brain. How these people get away with such buzzword bullshit at huge multinational corporations is beyond me. I wonder how much he makes. Reminds me of that infamous Pepsi PDF.

These people get high off their own farts.

>> Reminds me of that infamous Pepsi PDF

Holy shit, you weren't kidding, That was really something special https://jimedwardsnrx.files.wordpress.com/2009/02/pepsi_grav...

What... did I just read? It looks like something that was written by Einstein, under the influence of some incredibly potent drugs.

This is incredible. The Pepsi Ratio vs the golden Ratio.

Outrage!

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