The best thing that could ever happen to Canada would get rid of that god awful TN-Visa. TN - Talent Nuke. Completely sucks us dry of people moving to the US.
It may sound small but it has a major impact on our happiness, energy levels, and overall well-being.
Maybe we'll be back some day. Toronto is the most likely.
On topic for the parent – we're both Googlers but right now Google has no tech employees in Toronto proper (it's all sales and marketing). Waterloo is the only product/eng office and that's a tough commute. I'm not sure if that is changing with this announcement.
Fwiw I'm a Canadian that just signed a Google offer to work out of downtown SF because I hate the winter too. I think people care more or less about the weather based on their hobbies / interests.
Exceptions don't prove the rule.
There are some idioms that do mean it is unexceptional. You might be familiar with the Pratchettism "Million-to-one chances happen nine times out of ten."
We do have a rather comfortable bus which runs from Toronto, if you don't mind the 2 hour (each way) commute.
(The company I worked for was bought by Google back in 2011. We had people in NY and Toronto; all our Toronto people were told we had to move to Waterloo and that was that. Most of us have stayed @ Google but for some the practice of having to rip up their entire lives in Toronto to move wasn't ideal and they left.)
Toronto is not perfect, it has some of the worst weather in Canada. Summers are too hot (due to humidity), and the winter is cold and windy (due to humidity).
It’s not much different than most places in Canada but the lakes add a bite to the -15 to make it feel like the rest of the country (save Vancouver). The rain is brutal in Vancouver, but can keep you busy like cold does in the rest of Canada. Canada’s winter months are synonymous with precipitation, and you might be surprised to find where the most sunshine is.
Most of my friends from Toronto rarely or meaningfully ever leave Toronto to have an informed opinion of all 4 seasons nationally.
Commuting time takes away years of waking living time in GTA and GVRC unless you live downtown, except many startups are leaving downtown for affordability and keeping their people happy. All of this can be balanced away if you get other things that are worth it, including market size relative to Canada.
There are a few entrepreneurial pockets like Waterloo, and even Kelowna that are worth paying attention to. I don’t live in any cities listed here but travel often instead.
Much of BC. The rain is not that bad.
Also, winter is not that bad at all, it's really the long thaw that bites.
And if you live near hills and the countryside, it's fun.
Weather is a barrier to people coming to Canada, but it's generally not a reason people leave.
I was looking to move because I like colder weather/climate change related reasons and I had one recruiter tell me "You can't possibly ever make that much, that's CEO pay!".
Why are salaries so low in Canada ? Now at least owing to the US immigration fiasco, more labour should move in and salaries should technically rise - but I don't see that happening. Not sure why.
Competitive salaries on par with California or even NYC will have a dramatic impact on the influx of immigrants.
Also the quality of the work here is mostly miserable. There's not a lot of interesting stuff.
Things are better if you can find something outside of Toronto where the cost of living is ridiculous. One advantage of the Google Waterloo office...
You sound like an outlier mate.
That would improve the talent situation here.
It gives some pressure to stay in NZ, but in reality, talented engineers can get over double their salary abroad.
The TN wasn't responsible for my leaving and it isn't the reason I'm staying away.
Without the TN it's likely you may not have been hired because it's not worth the effort for most companies: T1 is easy, then once you're in they can process it more.
FYI this is not an argument for or against TN.
i.e. you see the world in terms of 'how does this law help me now'.
But from almost any other perspective it's not.
TN visas are mostly 'one way' - to America. It's an opportunity to suck out the best talent (the fruit of public education) for no cost.
Without real reciprocity, there's no benefit to Canadians who wouldn't use the opportunity.
Shockingly, neither government really keeps that much data on TN. Our incompetent governments have really little insight into what works and what does not. A TN is a 'stamp on your passport' that you get at the airport, it should be more centralized.
An easy solution to the asymmetry would simply be to make it '1 for 1', i.e. one American goes to Canada for every reverse.
I don't believe these are 'national/communitarian' vs. 'liberal' arguments, there's many situations we can have our cate and eat it.
> i.e. you see the world in terms of 'how does this law help me now'.
Classically liberal perspective would be "how does this law help individuals now", not me specifically.
The popularisation of almost any liberal policy usually takes the form appealing to the choice/freedom/egoism of the individual. Sometimes in a crude way.
I should have used the third person impersonal 'one sees' not 'you see' as I didn't mean 'you' of course.
True reciprocity would be more or less an equal exchange of talent. I think this might be beneficial.
There might be some opportunities for the Canadian government to effectively market itself in the USA.
From talking with people I know who are still in Canada it sounds like the FAANG companies expanding there presence is starting to fix the wage disparity for tech workers. Without the wage gap there is less incentive to leave. I'd rather just let this continue than rely on some knee jerk government intervention that is likely to have unintended side effects.