Comment by cptskippy | Hacker News Reader

Comment by cptskippy | Hacker News Reader

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> Say you do it every 15 years or so. (Yes I realize it would last longer of course, probably want to do it after 15 years or less, especially if you plan on selling).

Our last home, in the southern US, was build in 1980 and two of the 3 bathrooms (all full which is odd) were original and about 35 years old. While the appearance was dated, structurally and mechanically they were sound with no mold, water damage, or other issues. A steam clean of the tile and porcelain, along with a re-caulk and re-grout would have been sufficient to keep them going for quite some time. Our house before that was from 1965 with both bathrooms being original. The metal plumbing had started to fail and there was some rot to the sub-flooring around a toilet but otherwise fully functional and clean. In both cases the bathrooms were like most homes in the US with ceramic tile floors, steel tubs, and tiled shower stalls.

When I think about all the bathrooms I've used while in Europe, most were much newer and all felt like they needed to be redone. The finishes were unlike what's typically done in American bathrooms, some where plastic or vinyl covered while others used wood. They were all small and poorly ventilated, and they all had issues with mold and rot. I'm thinking poor ventilation and choosing materials for style over longevity might be why you feel the need to redo your bathrooms so frequently.

A lot of what's in the market for UK bathroom remodelling is actually very poor and unsuitable materials (e.g. cabinets with a veneer on top of particle board that will just love the humidity and blow up nicely once the surface or a corner gets a knock). It originally started with kitchen companies seeking new markets, and only needed to resize units and change installation habits a little to add new, (badly) fitted bathrooms. As a result a lot need redoing as half the stuff was never really suitable for being in a bathroom in the first place. Going on the quality of most kitchen installations, why would anyone ever...? :)

So you move into a new house with a grotty, worn out (and possibly only 4 or 8 year old) bathroom, with mould and maybe a tile or two falling off. Now you need to remodel, and most of what's out there is shoddy "replace every 5-10 years" quality, so the cycle repeats. New build homes are happy to install the cheapest shite available so long as it looks OK. Every time someone moves it's just about certain the mouldy, grotty bathroom and kitchen will need a makeover (or a divorce). If they got suckered in to a fitted bedroom you'll need to budget to rip that out too (also built from kitchen units with ideas above their station). :)

The parts of Europe I visit seem caught in a similar game.

Up until the seventies most houses were built with lifetime bathrooms -- one 50s house we lived in still had the tiling and fittings from when the house was built, still looked clean, nothing broken. All we ever needed to do was change taps as they had started to wear, and fit a better shower. A couple of tiles were lifted doing that -- that was revealing. No tile adhesive, all the tiles were mortared directly onto the brick, no wonder none had been lost since new. Not only that, tiles were better and the edges and corners were in the tiles -- none of the awful, easily broken, plastic corner things that appear to encourage mould.

The nicest house bathroom I ever saw was a house that had managed to keep its turn of the century bathroom, with high gloss tiling, original bath, radiator and polished pipes, with the modern additions carefully picked to appear like they were there from new.

Never quite understood how so many got so completely suckered in to such wasteful and expensive short-termism.

The fit and finish items in new construction in the US is also what I would deem substandard but with the option to upgrade. That's typically how developers can offer homes starting at very low price points, because quality finishes can increase the home selling price by 25-50%.

There are plenty of renovators that will be happy to install floating floor systems and other garbage but the traditional materials and installers still exist and don't charge that much of a premium. Many times the newer methods require subfloor modifications or other added costs that usually bring them in parity with the traditional products but the end result is much lower quality.

Here, the bespoke cabinet makers doing things the traditional way are often on par or even less than the installation companies. I think people simply assume they are right at the premium end so don't even ask for a quote -- as a result may not get all the work they deserve. Box installers meanwhile have bumped prices up to "insane", right where I might expect a carpenter making genuinely fitted cabinetry.

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