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Comment by m0zg | Hacker News Reader

How is it even a "rival"? Apple does not make server-grade CPUs. Nuvia does not compete with them at all. I hope to dear god Apple fails at this.

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Mac Pro Rack:

https://www.apple.com/shop/buy-mac/mac-pro/rack

Wow, TIL. Does this even make sense financially for anyone?

Sure, if you're a creative professional or Mac developer you are probably making at a minimum 20x the cost of this box. If you're in an office a rack mount helps save a lot of desk space, which more than pays for itself. Also lets you get away from the sound.

Looks like it starts at only $500 more than the desktop version but I didn't bother comparing specs. I have a friend with a 192GB new Mac Pro he's using for video production and he's currently testing it and finds it outperforms his HP Z8, he's very happy so far.

Does it have the same CPU as Z8? Because if it does, I don't see how it would "outperform" Z8. It's a PC, in a nice, expensive machined case.

It actually has a slower CPU, and fewer of them, according to him. But these kinds of machines are where GPUs, architecture, and software all come into play. Cores, bus speeds, subsystem speeds.

There's vastly more to computer performance than the reductionist "It's a PC, in a nice, expensive machined case". In fact, that sounds condescending and dismissive rather than a comment in search of enlightenment.

But all of those things you've enumerated are available in a PC - Apple only makes the board and a few smaller unimportant chips that don't affect performance. You're not comparing apples to oranges when you say that MacPro is faster somehow. It'd run at identical speed given the same CPU, same GPU and same RAM.

Well, you're clearly incorrect, but I don't work in high end video production so I can't give you precise details as to why.

Sorry.

There might be benefit from some of the extra bits available (the specific GPU in Mac Pro is not exactly easy to replicate elsewhere as it's a custom twin GPU setup with extra bus for cooperation with another unit if necessary) + the FPGA codec card that might be exploited by the stuff he does for work.

Replacing a software-only codec with hw accelerator card would go a long way to explain performance difference.

Rackmount doesn't mean server. My understanding is that the main reason they are offering that option is that many recording professionals want to be able to rack the macpro with all their other equipment which can then be placed outside the recording booth or put on wheels to move around with all the other equipment.

What about a rackmounted Mac Pro doesn't qualify as a server?

...the architecture of chip inside?

And if I had to bet, the lack of ECC RAM.

But mostly the fact that they're not selling it as a server.

This argument feels...meh.

2019 Mac Pros require ECC RAM (not that this qualifies anything as a 'server').

They are from 12 to 28 core Intel Xeon Ws with up to 1.5TB of ECC RAM. Also has two 10GB Ethernet ports.

Every RAM option on that configurator is ECC RAM, and every processor option is a Xeon.

It is designed to be a user workstation. In some industries, such as pro audio, you often literally have a standard rack built into your desk where you can install your desktop. In these environments, it is not uncommon for your desktop computer to be rack mounted.

Since this is one of Apple's markets, it makes sense that they would cater to it. Dell also sells some desktops with rack mounting options for the same reason.

Correct, though my first search for "Mac Pro Server" actually turned up their server software that you can buy on the app store for, I swear it said $1999, and the image was of a laptop.

I bet you're thinking of macOS Server [1], which costs $19.99 (twenty dollars).

[1] https://www.apple.com/macos/server/

Well, now I feel like I'm in a jack in the box ad.

Nuvia makes _chips_ for servers, not the servers themselves. Given that Apple also makes chips, it seems like a pretty fair argument

>> Apple also makes chips

But not _for servers_. It's like saying Qualcomm is a rival of Intel when it comes to CPUs. The two do not overlap at all.

...but...they do? Qualcomm Centriq directly competes with Xeons (or is intended to) and they build wireless solutions for devices and until recently directly competed on smartphone modems!

Such a powerful rival, I wasn't even aware of the competing product. OK, pick another one of three dozen ARM manufacturers as an example.

1) I think Apple could easily argue it was planning on leveraging it's chip design and manufacturing expertise into other areas. That's pretty reasonable. I could be seem them exploring licensing some of their IP to other manufacturers for example - ARM servers are gaining traction and Apple is a leader in the ARM space

2) Seems like the whole "rival" piece is not material to the lawsuit itself and is just a bit of editorializing on Reuters' part. The lawsuit probably centers on duty of loyalty and breach of contract

I agree that Nuvia doesn't compete with Apple but Qualcomm is actually a rival of Intel now because of their 8cx platform that's going into ultrabooks.

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