The Big Five in tech are paying like the Big Four in sports
adamconrad.dev
adamconrad.dev
The average MLB salary dropped slightly in 2019, but still north of $4million
src: https://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/28341983/average-mlb-sal...
I don’t think that the data the author used reflects what he think it does. There have to be minor league/partial contract players in those averages to make sense.
Here's the top salaries in MLB:
https://www.spotrac.com/mlb/rankings/
The top 141 players are making $10m or more per year (and that keeps rising year after year). The big five in tech don't come even remotely close to paying the way professional sports does and that includes the top thousand engineers. It's closer to a 5%-10% total compensation ratio at best (including stock-based compensation), in terms of elite athletes to elite engineers.
There are too many engineers and they're too replaceable, versus a Lebron James or Mike Trout. Those players are among the few best in the world at what they do, in a field with a very small number of people being compensated and from a relatively massive pie (MLB money is being split between just ~750 primary players; ~1200 including reserves).
Everything about the comparison is off by a large margin.
>L6 is staff engineer. Only about 15% of Google engineers are at this level or higher
And the post:
>People who make it to Staff engineer at Google per year: 1,875
I'm not sure about google but at Amazon there's definitely not that many people making it to principal/staff every year.
I have no idea how he gets from "15% of google engineers are at this level or higher" to 1875 people, and then on to that many being promoted.
I might believe that 1875 is the total number of engineers at L6 or above across the company. Seems slightly low, but not impossible. But I guarantee nowhere near that many are getting promoted every year.
Also, making L6 is in no way guaranteed. It takes years.
Also if you compare with how many sports players there're vs >=L6 engineers you'll get a better comparison
Microsoft, for one example, will double in size in the next ten years and they're already generating ~$50 billion per year in operating income (next four quarters).
They're going to fire people while doubling in size, from their already extreme scale? Nope.
Adobe is now worth as much as SAP. They're booming, extracting vast profit from their global cloud business. They'll more than double in size in the next ten years, their operating income will zoom from $3b to $6b or more. They're going to fire people in that environment? Nope.
The same is true of Google, Facebook, Amazon, Apple.
Apple will fire people while generating $60-$70 billion per year in operating income? Nope.
So where will the labor slack come from in tech to reset salaries lower? It's not going to.
Plus, the Fed has its hands all over the financial system in several ways that it didn't in 2007. Rates will stay perma low by necessity, they'll drown everyone in inflation before they allow rates to ever rise beyond 3% again for a consequential duration of time (it'll bankrupt the US Government, they can't allow it for the same reason Japan couldn't). Those perma low rates will provide a very large support base under valuations and will persistently push money to chase greater risk (public multiple expansion; and VC capital flowing very freely).
When there is inevitably a large downturn or correction, the low rates and massive QE injections will make the bottom higher than it otherwise would be. The next downturn will be far more gentle than the great recession (and the bounce back to prime conditions also might be even slower).
The only way any of this changes substantially, is if US tech is decimated by foreign competition. US tech can pay so well because they dominate globally, extracting vast global profit and paying a relatively small number of employees (vs the profit scale) from that big haul. That's the equation that has to change to drain US tech salaries.
As for foreign tech eating American tech's lunch, it's pretty clear that the next big social network will be (already is) TikTok, which is Chinese.
* In addition to other counterarguments noted here: not everybody makes Staff engineer (many consider Senior terminal) but every rookie in sports gets a similar deal; athletes get cold hard cash but in tech a large part of total comp is tied to stock; athletes can get endorsement deals; athletes don’t “work” 12 months a year; athletes usually retire long before age 65.
Moreover, the top pro athlete earners are pulling in more on endorsements than salary. If the CBA prohibited that, it might look more like a typical union / employment contract.
Big Tech pays like sports, not because of average salary levels, but because of the spread between highest and lowest paid engineers.
Let's say an entry level role in big tech pays about $200k per year in total comp.
It would not be surprising for your top engineer (Jeff Dean ~= LeBron James, e.g.) to rate north of $10m in annual total comp, so 2 orders of magnitude difference.
Multiples in sports are higher, but the point I'm making is that just as LeBron makes multiples of what a bench warmer does, so do the Jeff Deans of the world make multiples of what new college grads do. This is a markedly different landscape vs say, the late 90s when spreads were much MUCH tighter. Unfairly so in my opinion.
Disclosure: I work for Google but have no special knowledge of Jeff Dean's (or any other superstar) comp. I simply claim I wouldn't be surprised if I ever learned the real numbers. :)
wouldn't be so sure about that
> Sitting at a desk sure beats getting tackled for a living
standing desks exist and some of the sports mentioned don't have tackling at all (MLB)
# of software dev jobs per US gov: 1,365,500 [1]
# of people employed by big tech (FAANG+Microsoft): ~500k
Assuming 30% people are dev, still this would mean ~10% chance that given person with software dev job is in big tech. So sports comparison doesn't sound sound.
[1] https://www.bls.gov/ooh/computer-and-information-technology/...
The main exception AFAICT is Netflix, who really prefers not to hire new grads.
If you can manage a balance of both, depending on the individuals in the team it can end up being beneficial as juniors level-up and seniors tackle the higher-level stuff.
It's a lot easier to get hired when you are given a multi-month internship to prove yourself. Instead of having to prove yourself in 5x45min interviews.
(On the other hand students don't have experience to draw on)
Junior engineers willing to burn themselves out doesn't bode well for the quality of work you're getting.
Stating that median or mode are not average measures is also false.
https://www.thoughtco.com/measures-of-central-tendency-30267...
The point of my comment is that if the compensation is truly showing the average / arithmetic mean, then the data is skewed by outliers. If it's the median instead, they should should say so.
The roots of average come from shipping, "any small charge over freight cost", from French avarie "damage to ship".
The notion of which average specifically is meant varies, the association with "mean" dates only to the late 18th or early 19th century.
https://www.etymonline.com/word/average
What's ironic in the argument between mean and median is that they do in fact share the same root of the Latin medius
https://www.etymonline.com/word/mean
https://www.etymonline.com/word/median
And again, in current dictionary usage (as well as my several uni stats courses), you'll find that "average" applies to any of the measures of central tendency, though yes, "mean" is probably most commonly (and ferverantly, as you demonstrate) understood.
Merriam Webster, first defintion:
average: 1 a : a single value (such as a mean, mode, or median) that summarizes or represents the general significance of a set of unequal values
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/average
Which makes the argument of your initial comment, that the median is not a meaning of "average", again, false.
As you note, my point is that "average" is most commonly understood as mean.
The original article seems to fall prey to the classic mean-vs-median distinction. The compensation numbers being presented do not necessarily represent what one would expect. FAANGs are known to give a small number of employees multi-million-dollar comp packages -- that will skew the average (erm... mean) but not the median.
The article ... contains numerous misspellings and other flaws (I can note though not really complain as I do similarly...), but yes, really should note which of the various available "average" values it's considering.